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[ipswich]

So I've been living abroad teaching English for about 4 years now. I originally went abroad after being pissed that Bush won twice and watching the economy in my city turn from bad to worse. Anyway, I've been doing alright, not fabulous or anything. I was making payments on my loans and stacking a little money for a rainy day, perhaps an online MA or some such thing in the future. Well, I didn't go home for the first 2 years as I only got 10 days off a year and the ticket to fly home was like $1400 at the time... I'm not a big fan of paying $140 a day to sleep on people's couches. I digress, apparently one of my student loans, the BIG one which I had paid down from $32,000 to $25,000 was sold from Wachovia to ASA.

Wachovia had been sending me emails semi-regularly keeping me abreast of my balance and just in general being a good bank. Once the account went to ASA I didn't hear from anyone. I have another set of loans, for much less, with Great Lakes which has been emailing me and I've been paying them semi-regularly, wiring them money when the exchange rate isn't absolute rubbish (as it has been most of the year, I've lost easily 25% of my income in $US). From the Great Lakes website I was able to check the balance of my other loans and saw no increase in the balance, in fact I assumed that Great Lakes had become the new owner of the larger loan because I could see it on their website.

What a mistake that was. I now work at a university over here and get nice holidays so I have been going home to see my family during the past two summers. My mom is my power of attorney and all of my mail gets sent to her place. Anyway, I go home this summer and she hands me this stack of unopened mail. I sit down and piece it together that my loan had gone into default (2 years ago) and that I now owe another $7000 and it's gaining interest daily. I call the new loan holder (ASA) and ask why they didn't email me when they got the account. I ask why didn't you get my contact information from Wachovia along with the account. They told me that they have a strict no email policy or whatever. For the love of God I am thinking, what year is this? You just screwed me in the butt to the tune of $7000 and you are trying to evade the point by saying you don't email people!?

After talking with some rude and unsympathetic woman who immediately asked me for $15000 (!) to bring the account current. I tacitly agree to resume payments as soon as I return to Korea. She wouldn't even email the swift code for their bank! Then I had to spell out my Korean address for her, again because she wouldn't communicate via email... it took 20 minutes.

I have friends over here who are trying to tell me I should sue them or at least find some other US citizens with student loans and organize a class action suit. This just seems to convenient for them. a great way to recoup their losses from the bailout? I really, seriously doubt that I will ever live in the US again. Considering this, what would you do, would you pay it knowing that you'll probably never reside within the US again?

Immediately after news of the bailouts reached me in Korea I told myself and my friends that they (the banks in the US, the government, etc.) can go to hell... they can track me down in some 3rd world country. This situation with my loan was just the icing on the cake, the straw that broke the camel's back, etc. I mean, come ON!!!! No email!!!! I could have paid the *beep* if they had simply contacted me. It seems like they were being deliberately... sneaky, then demanding a payment of $15000 to boot... too much, too convenient.

A part of me wants to be mad at my mom but she doesn't know a credit card offer from a bill so, yeah. I still can't believe she hadn't opened my mail though. That's what someone with power of attorney does right?

[denise]

Wow, that's rough. I'm really sorry to hear that you're in such a bad situation. I've also got my mail going to my parents' house, but my mom emails me whenever anything important-looking arrives and asks me what to do with it. I've told her that she's free to open anything and everything, but still she checks first.

My bank, Washington Mutual, was bought out by Chase, and I don't recall ever getting word--I just found out one morning when I logged on to yahoo and saw the big headline that WaMu had gone under. It's a different situation than yours because my students loans aren't with them (they're with nelnet, who've been great), but still, they didn't contact me either. And on a side note, my purse and all of its contents were stolen in the US just a couple of weeks ago, and trying to get a new ATM card sent to me took some work because at first neither WaMu nor Chase could find my file--even with my social security number! I was stuck in some sort of bank limbo. Mergers, mergers... they have a tendency to screw over the customers.

There's another thread around here somewhere--don't remember the name or which forum it's in, but maybe somebody else here does--about debts, defaulting, etc. Take a look at it and see if it can help you at all.

d

[Teatime of Soul]

Just tell them you are waiting for your share of TARP bailout fund and will send them some of the countless billions due your way.

Some banks work a scam. They sell more loans than they can service. If it is a federally guaranteed student loan, and they can find a way to declare it in default, they get all the cash immediately from the feds.

Florida Federal did this in the early 90's. Top guys went to prison after slamming over 20,000 loans into default by ignoring student calls and letters.

And those were the days when banks were marginally regulated.

A very wise man once said, "If you owe the bank 5,000 and can't pay, you have a problem. If you owe the bank 50 million and can't pay, the bank hs a problem.

You should have borrowed a lot more.

[Never Ceased To Be Amazed]

My heart bleeds for Wachovia. Like I told them in '93, no receipts, no more money being thrown down a black hole. In response to their threats of my loans being placed in default, my wags being garnished, and my tax-rebates being seized...guess what, I continued being an ex-pat teacher and they haven't touched a penny of my assets.

I live a better life teaching abroad than I ever would have slaveing away in the US and don't have to consider the fact that if I paid taxes, I would be supporting a war that I totally disagree with.

Lessee now, it's 2009 and who's solvent...Wachovia or me. Hmmm... I get a lump in my throat every time I think about Wells Fargo buying them out!

NCTBA

[leez]

[Glenski]

If your mom has power of attorney, why didn't she open the mail that was obviously important to your finances? I really don't see that anyone is forced these days to use email when the Post Office is still around. Postal mail contact first, telephone contact second if possible.

Trying to sue when you didn't even open your mail after all that time (2 years??!!) is not going to gain you any support in a court of law.

[JZer]

[santi84]

[Never Ceased To Be Amazed]

leez and JZer: I jes' had it renewed, no problems there. The State Department, as VS would put it, doesn't have a horse in this race.

Now that the U.S. Government has done the right thing and is getting directly involved in the issuing the loans rather than by proxy through banks that are only interested in generating profits by buying and selling loans to churn out profits (the same crock of S**t that got so many people into mortgage crisis) things will change for the better.

You won't have some good for nothing on the other end of the line saying, "We don't have to give you any receipts, your payment stubs in your coupon book is receipt enough".

Things will be different...not for me, but from some other youngster who won't be played by the system.

Leez, I regret that you're unhappy with me, but I never insinuated that goods were inaccessable in al jouf...only that it is in the middle of nowhere.

NCTBA xo

[dirimini]

I'm sorry, but as someone who has just repaid thousands of dollars of student loans, I have a question:

If I had to take out loans to finance my university education, and if I had to pay them back (because, you know, I used the money), why do others feel they have no responsibility to pay theirs?

I understand that people have legitimate issues with the cost of education, with the ways banks operate, with the government's use of taxpayer dollars. But no one forced anyone to take out a student loan. Think the system is filthy? Don't take part in it.

(And as a not inconsequential aside: we all understand that defaulted student loans wind up being paid by someone else, right?)

[Never Ceased To Be Amazed]

If you're responding to me, then I don't think that we're worlds apart although we are in generations. I also paid thousands of dollars and received not receipt one for any of the payments. Did you receive any receipts when you made your payments or did you just pay and pay and pay until, one day that loan discharge paper magically showed in your mailbox?

I am not happy or proud with not paying off my loans, I simply asked for acknowledgements of receipt of payment (see? RECEIPT!) How the hell does anyone know if the payments are being received if not given the simple feedback of a money received acknowledgement. Again, I was told that they "didn't have to" provide a receipt. And, then the threats began.

I don't respond well to threats. Especially those that come at me like thugs who are demanding "protection money".

I was current. I was paying. I told them then and I stand unrepentant now: I will not pay another thin dime unless I receive receipts for what I've already paid.

It's NOT about NOT paying loans, it's about how my loans were "serviced". I stand prepared to pay back my principal and 9% interest up to those tense phone calls in 1993. Not a bloody nickel more until they send me proof of receipt. I have the foreign and domestic money orders in my possession. THEY need to come across with their records and match mine.

I, unfortunately, will be dust by then 'cuz dey be da Man and da Man h'aint gotta do 'cept what da Man wanna do. Like the folks say: "Live and learn, die and fergit it all".

NCTBA

[ipswich]

I'm not saying that it isn't partly my fault. I trusted my mother to be my power of attorney, I guess she wasn't the right choice. To be fair she didn't graduate high school and has a bit of an out of sight out of mind attitude now that she is divorced and living on her own. When I left four years ago she was my only option short of hiring someone though.

I also assumed that since I was able to see the balance of my first loan (which was being serviced by Wachovia the last time I checked) from the Great Lakes website (who are currently servicing my second loan) that Great Lakes had acquired my first loan as well which was supposedly in forbearance or deferment, I honestly cannot remember. I have records of making payments until 2007 and then no longer received emails.

I shouldn't have assumed. I am admittedly financially naive.

It does seem a little convenient for the new bank though doesn't it? The account information with Wachovia stated I was living in South Korea. The loan is purchased by another bank who simply doesn't contact me via the most successful method of the previous servicer (email)? When I finally realize the error and contact them, they immediately demand $15,000. This doesn't seem suspect to anyone?

I would think that they would be anxious to get me back on track with several lump sum payments in the $1,000 neighborhood but to flat out demand $15,000?

Would that loan counselor have gotten a commission from that payment? Is that why she quoted such an exorbitant amount? I don't know many people with $15,000 of disposable assets on hand at any moment.

And, now that I've returned and they have my address in Korea I have yet to receive any traditional post either? It's been two weeks since I returned. A month or more since they've had my address. I half expected to land and find my mailbox stuffed with angry letters. But, nothing has arrived so far.

I know I'm not totally blameless here but it does seem suspect.

But, seriously can they tamper with my passport? I renewed last year but...

[dirimini]

To be honest, I don't understand the "no receipt/no pay" scenario.

I paid mine by check, with specific information about payment number/due date in the "notations" space at the bottom. That's a receipt.

Even a credit card statement is a "receipt." You're not sending cash, are you?

Additionally, if people in "customer service" (cough, cough) appear to be less then helpful, and if one really wants something one is not getting, I have always found it more productive to write a letter than to make a phone call. One thus creates a paper trail, with specific information about what one was requesting, who responded, and what the response was. I would imagine that one could even sit down and compose a letter to the effect of "this is what I contend I have paid for this period of time, for these specific payment numbers; if I do not hear back from you, in writing, within two weeks, I will take this to be your consent that you agree with my calculations." You'd be surprised how often "customer service" reps of any large company start to behave more civilly when they know that their lack of (or rude, or inadequate) response is being documented.

I understand the whole thing is onerous, and that one has to be vigilant about keeping one's own finances in order. Could it be simpler/more civil? Probably. But should one expect to personally have a mint left on one's pillow by one's personal bank representative? Yes, banks are heinous in general, and yes, some of the reps are rude and incompetent, and yes, they often try to surreptitously screw customers with ridiculous fees, etc. But that does not absolve one's responsibility for one's debts.

If, NCTBA, you feel you're not getting what you need, then press on until you get it. I do not accept the explanation that one has the right to withhold payment because one does not get a receipt. Write a letter. Write five letters. But you owe the money, just as many, many of us also did.

[floja]

I struggled with my student loans even as my business was going down the toilet. I tried to renegotiate payments, balances, etc., but the banks refused to even discuss things. I ended up like Donald Trump- bankrupt. But student loans are not covered by bankruptcy.

And they grow and grow and grow. The banks get private profits and public protection. Gotta love corporate welfare, er, I mean, capitalism.

[Never Ceased To Be Amazed]

They have no incentive to discuss anything, as they proved in my case, as the loans are federally-guaranteed. Unlike a house that they can foreclose on and hope to get, at least, a certain percent on the dollar. They'll get every penny on the dollar on a student loan.

As I said earlier, with the governmet getting directly involved with student loans, at least, you'll get an ombudsman OTJ.

Dirimini: You seem to be a reasonable person. I will not defend my decision as I was not incorrect in making it. As a final note on this subjct:

1.) Receipts need to be provided by the loan servicer to prove that payment was received.

2.) People have more important things to do with their lives, like doing thir jobs than endlessly writing letters that may (or in this case, may not) be acknowledged as being received. I mean, if your not going to acknowledge receipt of valuable funds...why acknowledge receipt of a valueless piece of paper.

3.) I don't expect mints, I expect receipt of funds received.

4.) I'll bet you a dollar to a donut that you're envisioning a person who doesn't work abroad. I have for two decades now. Things don't get done from afar. The internet has made things easier, but all of this happened pre-internet.

5.) Wachovia DID NOT lend me money. If they want to play a complicated game of buying and selling loans to squeek out dribs and drabs of profit, then they need to properly service those loans that they have purchased. They didn't.

6.) Finally, I will reiterate. I will and have offered to pay the principal and interest up until 1993 when they decided that they "didn't have to" work with a client by simply acknowledging receipt of payment. No more...no less.

The next time you try to return a faulty product, you'll soon understand the significance of a receipt.

NCTBA