Job Discussion Forums

[moneyoriented]

Where would you rather live - Seattle or Vancouver (the one in Canada, not Washington state), and why?

In other words, what do you like or dislike about these cities? How do they compare?

I've heard a lot of good things about Vancouver (spectacular scenery, fantastic Chinese and Japanese food, etc.), but really haven't heard much about Seattle...

What about cost-of-living differences?

[santi84]

If I could live in either city (assuming citizenship/visa issues are not a problem), it would be Seattle. Don't get me wrong, I love Vancouver. I have lived everywhere from a mountain in the Fraser Valley to a little box across from Metrotown. Unfortunately, housing prices are so unreal that it is impossible to buy. The traffic is a nightmare. The city has gotten quite dirty. I used to have a government job and barely scraped by on a $50-60K salary! My mortgage alone was 50%. Seattle is just cleaner (yes, even Pike Square), housing costs are low, and of course, the grass is greener on the other side!

ESL jobs are plentiful in Vancouver but finding one that pays more than $15/hour and more than one sub shift per week is another story!

Vancouver is like living in Southern California. The scenery and nightlife is spectacular for a visitor, but living there is a financial struggle. If you want a 2 bedroom condo in a decent area of Vancouver, you are looking at a $400,000 mortgage minimum. Rent for the same would be about $1500.

[ls650]

Vancouver is a great city to visit but I wouldn't want to live there. The rents are very high and the traffic during commute hours is horrible - and these will only get worse after the 2010 Olympics.

[Vanica]

I cannot reconcile a $400,000 mortgage with $1500 in rent. The rent is much too cheap. Don't buy in Vancouver, just rent.

There are some websites discussing the Vancouver housing bubble about to burst. If the housing costs were less, would you live there?

[jdl]

Didn't know there was a Seatle in B.C.?

[Vanica]

[lorientravel]

HI,

I have lives and grown-up in Vancouver.
I live just outside Vancouver now and still can't afford it on a public school teachers salary, which is far better then what an ESL school would pay.

If you have great qualifications, a BC teaching certificate, and patients then you can probably get a job on any of the district school boards, Vancouver, North Vancouver, Surrey. Best off living in a suburb if can afford a car and don't mind sitting in traffic for an hour.

My rent in the suburb is $900 for a nice one bedroom and I work in the district that I live in so the commute is minor, as Vancouver commutes go.

Big problem in Vancouver is declining enrollment, thus lay offs at the end of the year. I have been laid off every year that I have worked as a teacher and always scrambled to get a job in September.

I don't have first hand knowledge of Seattle but I don't think US teachers get paid as much and I know the cost of living is still pretty expensive.

I really don't think anything on the pacific is cheap. Even up in the northern parts of BC living can be expensive because of the remoteness.

It's all very beautiful though and if you like the outdoors your set.

Good luck on the job hunt
Lorien

[Tiger Beer]

Probably comes down to your nationality.

From reading here it sounds like Vancouver is way overpriced.

However, it isn't said here, but Seattle is as well...I don't know if it is as much as vancouver is or not, but it is still very overpriced and still way overdue for a pop to its housing bubble. Cities like Vegas, Phoenix, etc. have back down to earth, but Seattle doesn't seem to be moving in that direction whatsoever (and neither is California).

Additionally, I am also unsure about the Canadian economy, but the American one is horrible right now..and places like Seattle, it is something a bit over 10% unemployment at this time (things use to be steady around 4% unemployment) just a few years ago.

[Mercury Morris]

Hello,

I lived in Seattle for 10 years of my life. Since nobody on this thread seems to know much about the Seattle end of the question here is my two cents worth.

Seattle is situated in a region of incredible natural beauty: mountains, ocean, and national parks galore. The city is actually smallish, you can walk across the entire downtown core in less than a half hour. Its easy to fall for this city as a visitor and want to pack your bags and move there.

...the problems begin when you move there. I've lived in many cities in USA/Canada and Europe. The people of Seattle are exceedingly distant, provinicial and unfriendly to newcomers. This is a FACT. There are even websites devoted to "what the hell is wrong with Seattle people"? Here is an old website to substantiate my claims:

http://seattle.shmeng.com/

The above website is called "Seattle Shmeng: the mystery of why Seattle sucks". The website has been inactive since the author of the website finally stopped complaining and moved away from Seattle.

Seattle natives, e.g. those born in Seattle usually hate those to relocate to Seattle, and do their best (usually in passive aggressive fashion) to make you feel unwelcome. It is best to move to Seattle if you have friends there, so you don't struggle to make friends.

Seattle is NOT cheap, its maybe a little less than Vancouver for rent and real estate. It is not an ESL mecca, there are not as many immigrants coming there as Vancouver has many, many more Asians.

Seattle weather and Vancouver weather are the same: get ready for nonstop dark, damp, rainy days from October through May. In February or March you can have even 3-4 weeks solid of nonstop, daily rain without any sun whatsoever. Don't believe me? Many people cannot handle this much constant rain.

One theory as to why Seattle is so unfriendly to newcomers is that in the USA, misanthropes and misfits kept moving further west from the more developed east coast during the pioneer days. People who did not fit in, were anti-social, or shirked the trappings of modern cities and civilization kept going further and further west--to the farthest northwest corner of USA: Seattle, Washington. This theory makes sense. There are many strange, anti-social, weird people in Seattle. People in Seattle often complain that its getting too crowded, too much traffic, and how they wish more people would leave so it would be better. This is the "welcome" you will get when you move there.

I'm not saying you will fail if you move to Seattle. You can make it, especially if you are independent minded, sociable, and can handle lots of rejection well. Also if you love hiking, kayaking, etc this is a great way to make friends there--go on outings and make friends. Forget about the natives, you'll make it by getting to know other transplants--that is the key to making it in Seattle. I don't think there is much of an ESL scene in Seattle, forget it. Just get some other type of job--there is a good economy in Seattle--MUCH better than Portland to the south (I lived there too--DO NOT go there! There are NO JOBS).

While I lived in Seattle I often would go up to Vancouver for weekends. What struck me was how MUCH more friendly folks were in Vancouver. BIG difference in the people!!! I always wished I could live in Vancouver, as people were sooooo much nicer there than in Seattle.

Like I said there isn't much ESL action in Seattle--if you really want to teach English definitely, definitely go to Vancouver as it is much more international than Seattle is (Seattle is the most white city in USA, aside from Boise Idaho). You don't hear anything but English being spoken in Seattle--in Vancouver every other person is speaking another language.

Hope this helps. If you really want to move to Seattle get a job in something else, bring a friend or spouse (so you won't be so lonely), and if you love the outdoors and nature you will be in outdoor heaven!

[CJD]

I'd rather live in Vancouver primarily because it's in Canada. Canada is a better country to live in than the United States, although I'm sure Seattle/Washington State is one of the nicer places to live in the States.

[MrG]

I lived in Seattle for twelve years, ditto the above description of the city and people. The way I met folks was to join several clubs. If you speak another language there are several places to practice and meet others, and if you like the outdoors, which is why I moved there, there is lots to do: skiing, biking, hiking, and even swimming (it has one of the nicer outdoor pools I ever been to). Vancouver is also a very nice city, and if you ski, one of the best skiing areas in North America, Whistler, is just two hours North of the city.

[ramble right]

4 years living in Seattle, myself. Heard a lot about the "Seattle Freeze" -- people's distance/unfriendliness. However, I found people there, including locals, to be quite friendly and decent. (Someone please name a city where it's somehow magically easy to make friends!) Truth be told, I met far more non-locals than Seattleites. But people will not be your problem. No, the real difficulties you'd face would be constant rain (also true for Vancouver) and comparably low ESL job prospects. I love Seattle, it's the most beautiful US city in my opinion, but I had to move to get my career moving. You come to Seattle because you love the city, not because you want job prospects.

MA TESOL required for even your $21/hour no-benefits ESL job. And that job is hard to come by. It was before the downturn, I can only imagine it's worse now.

If I were in Seattle now, trying to make it in ESL, I'd advertise in the hostels for private lessons or take out an ad in a foreign paper or something, try to tap into a niche, because the jobs ain't there. Yes, I said ain't.

And Portland -- don't even think about Portland. Really. No. Jobs.

[Cubic09]

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