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ShioriEigoKyoushi
Joined: 21 Aug 2009
Posts: 364
Location: Japan
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 Posted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 8:15 am Post subject: |
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Last edited by ShioriEigoKyoushi on Tue Mar 23, 2010 3:21 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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seklarwia
Joined: 20 Jan 2009
Posts: 1546
Location: Monkey onsen, Nagano
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| Posted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 10:22 am Post subject: |
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| Apsara wrote: |
seklarwia, in response to your post a few days back (I've been out of Tokyo so only just coming back to this thread), I never had any student be rude enough in an eikaiwa class (and I taught a lot of them) that I would have needed to tell him/her off. There were some weirdoes that we complained about because they made other students uncomfortable, and the management took these complaints quite seriously because the other students were also paying customers. At Gaba it was one on one lessons, so hard for a student to misbehave really.
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I don't think that a complaint about a slouching teacher is "highly pedantic"- you don't think that's at all justified? |
You are lucky. Pretty much all the eikawa workers I know have a couple of infuriating customers that the school does nothing about. And since we don't have Gaba, in all our local private schools the workers are teaching mostly groups. Lots of rotten groups of JH and HS friends in classes around here. They chat with their friends in the lesson then when they don't even know what they were supposed to have done in class and they do crap in their oral tests, the parents then complain and guess who gets the blame.
And as to the slouching, it depends what they are referring to as slouching. If the teacher really has a no-care unprofessional attitude then fair enough. But if they are simply nit-picking to prove they have power as a paying customer, then that is out of order. Not all students are so wonderful and not all eikawa so serious about any real teaching if they are getting paid.
Not long after I arrived I was told a great story from a local eikawa worker who got a complaint for being disrespectful to and highly embarrassing an older student when the student called them out in the middle of the class for not writing letters in a certain way and with the right stroke orders. When the worker explained to the student that not only was it not necessary to write "w" in four strokes, but that it was perfectly acceptable to round off the bottom points too, the student went to complain. It's these types of students who are mostly likely to be making the crazy-perdantic complaints. |
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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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| Posted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 12:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Yawarakaijin wrote: |
Option one:
Get seriously hardass on all these students all of a sudden? What will this cause and in the long run would it actually benefit the society? Imagine, suddenly, an entire generation of children who would be unable to move onto university |
Why do you figure that? With the declining birthrate, universities will have a 100% acceptance:application ratio. Forget grades.
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| and therefore never be able to get a job. What kind of effect would that have on unemployment, crime and families? |
Many young Japanese now have given up on the notion of lifetime employment, with companies showing them it is not true, too. Freeters and parasite singles are commonplace. Temp jobs are on the rise. Crime (by Japanese, not foreigners) is also on the rise).
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Option two:
Maintain the status quo, let them graduate, and leave it up to the companies to sort them out. Isn't this what is already done in Japanese society? It is the company that takes on the responsibility of training and molding the young adults into what is needed. |
They try to mold them into jobs, not society. With kids these days living in their bedrooms glued to Nintendo DS, Playstation 3, and their cell phones, social skills are practically gone.
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| It is a totally different situation than from the West. We expect our schools to educate children both morally and intellectually. |
Morally? Now where I came from unless you refer to a Bible belt.
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| Here is just seems like school is a filler, someplace you need to endure before you are taken on by a company and given a purpose in life. |
University, yes. HS, no. |
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Yawarakaijin
Joined: 20 Jan 2006
Posts: 504
Location: Middle of Nagano
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| Posted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 2:19 pm Post subject: |
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Perhaps moral education was a poor choice of words as it may sound like I was referring to some kind of religious education.
When I think back on my school days though I can definitely recall a certain slant and primary theme than ran throughout the entire length of it.
As a Canadian that theme would have been multiculturalism/diversity/equality and all the lessons in morality that accompanied it. Don't get me wrong, I don't think I was hard done by by the Canadian education system, but looking back on it the system was about as subtle as a freight train. 
Quick question in regards to the declining birthrate, discipline and university entrance. Is it possible to be expelled from school in Japan? Even for say a week or 3 days? Quite common place back in my day. *not for me personally*
Secondly, do Japanese universities have a history of admitting problem students? Could just be my warped perception of the way things are in Japan but I always believed any kind of black mark against you in high school basically kept you out of a university. This is why I jumped to the conclusion that suddenly disciplining all these horrible students would screw up Japan in the future  |
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ssjup81
Joined: 15 Jun 2009
Posts: 664
Location: Adachi-ku, Tokyo, Japan
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| Posted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 4:57 pm Post subject: |
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| Yawarakaijin wrote: |
| Quick question in regards to the declining birthrate, discipline and university entrance. Is it possible to be expelled from school in Japan? Even for say a week or 3 days? Quite common place back in my day. *not for me personally* |
For us, expelled meant kicked out of that particular school for the rest of the year or maybe permanently. Suspension is like how you described Canadian expulsion, based on how it was here. |
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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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| Posted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 9:51 pm Post subject: |
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| Yawarakaijin wrote: |
| Quick question in regards to the declining birthrate, discipline and university entrance. Is it possible to be expelled from school in Japan? Even for say a week or 3 days? |
Yes, rare but possible. Such a short-term period would not be called expulsion, though. The word is suspension. My old HS in Sapporo did that a couple of times.
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| Secondly, do Japanese universities have a history of admitting problem students? |
They don't seek them out, of course, but they do take on students who are lazy and undereducated. Students can get in through regular entrance exams, or they could bypass those (in the case of a private uni with ties to a HS, or in the case of recommended students). The latter (recommended) doesn't mean anything in terms of a student's true capacity to learn or excel. It might be a sports reason (we need a pitcher, e.g.). Bottom line is money these days. The bar is definitely getting lower with respect to academic qualifications on who gets in!
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| Could just be my warped perception of the way things are in Japan but I always believed any kind of black mark against you in high school basically kept you out of a university. |
As far as I know, unis don't ask for this sort of information, nor are HS's obligated to announce it. Why should they? Having worked for a HS, I can tell you when Feb/March rolls around, the teachers' staff room is a'buzz with talk of who got into what uni. Wall charts are sometimes posted to show this.
Disciplining hard cases properly should set the tone in any culture for the youth of tomorrow. Japan prefers to sweep things under the carpet (ever hear of honne and tatemae?) and hope for the best. |
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seklarwia
Joined: 20 Jan 2009
Posts: 1546
Location: Monkey onsen, Nagano
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| Posted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 10:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Glenski wrote: |
| Such a short-term period would not be called expulsion, though. The word is suspension. |
Although we use the expulsion and suspension in the same way in general, its not always so clear cut in practice.
Many UK schools (under our LEA at least) tend to use suspension for temporary exclusion from school for a predetermined period of time or internal suspension for separation from the rest of the students during school hours (I've seen the latter quite a few times in my JH this year). Expulsion can mean permanent exclusion from the school, but we also have temporary explusion when a student is excluded from school without a predetermined return date. Temporary expulsion can last less than a week in some cases or much longer depending on the severity of what the student did and what circumstances are discovered after the exclusion. |
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