Job Discussion Forums

[Jayray]

Anyone may PM me for a mirror url that isn't blocked.

[mnguy29]

Is this "black list" true? I have worked in China for two years. Only finished one contract of three for various reasons. However, each time I had a good reason for ending the contract early. I was never a "runner". One was due the health of my father, another simply because they gave us no time off for travel or social life(private training school), another because they wanted me to go to a different city and I said "no". We had a meeting and they all agreed to let me out. I even got a letter from them I think stating this. Could I be black listed??

[johntpartee]

I doubt it. Personally, I doubt that there is a black list. As I said in an earlier post, why not just come clean to any potential future employers? Tell them that the facilities, treatment, whatever, were unacceptable. IT HAPPENS.

[Jayray]

I thought at first that there was an "official" blacklist of FTs who have not committed a crime or engaged in egregious behavior. The FAO may contact a recruiter who, in turn, may pass your name to other recruiters. FAO's do, however, talk to each other, and FAO's(as I have been told by an FAO himself) can contact each other regarding FTs.

Barring the actual commission of a serious crime, it is very unlikely that one's name would appear on an official or national list.

The flip side to the coin is that an FAO who constantly complains about its FTs may acquire a reputation for having adversarial relationships with their FTs. Until I worked for my last employer, every FAO I had ever met made an effort to maintain good relationships with their charges.**

There ARE, however, school blacklists online where one may report school actions that are not SAFEA sanctioned. One must consider that even though a school's actions are not SAFEA approved, the SAFEA will not necessarily do anything to rectify the problem. **

Part of this arises from the fact that (in my experience, anyway) very few people who answer the phone at SAFEA are willing to help because 1. they don't speak English 2. they're too lazy to transfer your call or tell you how to reach arbitration counselors, 3. they don't want to cause trouble for their bosses. When you DO find someone to speak to you, you won't get anyone's name, not even the name of the "arbitrator." **

I'm not talking through my hat. I've gone through the inane "arbitration" process with an FAO as well as through SAFEA. It's just not worth anyone's time. Your best course of action is to finish the term gracefully, get a release, and then move on and warn others about the school after you are well out of reach of the offending school. If you DO decide to report the school to the SAFEA, send it anonymously via fax. If the SAFEA receives enough complaints, it MIGHT do something.

I have read stories in forums about teachers who encounter problems with their schools, and I couldn't believe that such crazy things can happen, or that FAO's could possibly be so incompetent. I'll believe anything now.

My last school didn't even know what the SAFEA was, even though they print their own contracts and enclose them in non-numbered SAFEA covers.

Another route might be to contact the Ministry of Education. I haven't pursued that route, though. Has anyone had experience with the Ministry of Education?


** Results may vary
,
,
,

[Jayray]

[Badmojo]

The Dean is a typical ass. Not worth respecting as she doesn't respect you. That was a very large invasion of privacy. Who does she think she is?

If you don't need this job, then leave. Don't worry about any blacklist, what you have to worry about is the reference letter - at least if you're in Hebei Province. In this province when you want to go to a new school, you have to provide a reference letter from your previous school. Not sure if that applies in your case or not, but its something to consider.

[KarenB]

How awful -- you must have felt really violated. I've heard of this happening before.

What I would suggest doing:
1) Post the name of the university and FAO so others can be forewarned
2) Change the locks on your door. That's what we do. Then, if we go out of town, we give the key to a trusted FT or Chinese teacher, and let the FAO know who has it in case there's a valid reason to get in.
3) Something we also sometimes do is have a student we trust stay at our place to look after things

I don't recommend trying to get revenge by disarranging the guy's desk or disappearing. Just finish out your contract, but in the meantime check out other unis. When you're doing this, ask for the email or phone number of a current FT there, and get the scoop from that person on what to expect.

[KarenB]

As far as black lists, I've been in China 10 years, and don't think there is one regarding Foreign Teachers. Chinese employers are remarkably negligent in checking references -- I've seen really horrible FTs (like the ones who think seducing middle school kids is fun, or the ones who call in sick 3 days a week, but have a remarkable recovery later in the day, etc., etc.) breeze from one job to another -- but generally in a different province. The Deans at universities in one province get together for meetings, etc. so they have an informal network of who's good and who's bad.

I haven't been on this forum for several years, but I was thinking there was a place to post "black listed" schools right here. Maybe that's a thing of the past? I know there's a place called Nate's School Review (or at least there used to be) where you can check on a potential new uni

[mrwslee003]

I just thought of another angle:

The Dean may be "good hearted" after all- She may think that the Ft is out of town for a few days and I, who is responsible for the Fts welfare, would just chech on her abode to make sure all is well, no B & E's and mean while tidy up her place so when she does return then she'll have a neat and safe place to pull off her shoes. Yea, that is what a good mother
would do if I were her mother and she were in her native country.

So, rather than feeling violated as a Ft. You may check with her that you
noticed someone had visited my place and did not steal any thing but even had the place tidied up a bit. You wondered if she has any idea who
it may be or should I report it as a thief may have entered my premises and found nothing of value to steal?

The reaction from her will tell you tons of where she is coming from.

So don't jump into the conclusion that she is all nosy and controlling yet!

[Fred Nietzsche]

My jaw dropped reading about strangers squatting in your apartment, going through your stuff and urinating all over your bathroom, with the blessing of your dean who gave them your keys! Really? I can understand landlords entering empty rooms to turn off gas. But they would not trash your place, right? Seems to me a CRIME has been committed here, called "Burglary." You should call police and file charges, right?

And your senior tenured professor may not know the dean gave his keys to a married couple who are soiling his bedsheets and bath towels!?!?! In America, anyone ESPECIALLY the landlord would be blowd down with a shotgun blast through the door if he attempted to enter an occupied apartment without permission. Hey that's what makes America GREAT. Doesn't matter how much we pay in rent. Once we have the keys, the room is OURS and not even the police can enter without a warrant. Only exception are firemen who may enter if your room is on fire.

Is such Burglary covered in your SAFEA contract?
In Chinese court, would "free housing provided with job" imply the dean has a right to rent your room to strangers even while you live there?
Should I add my own private room clause in my SAFEA contract?
How long were you out of town? If dean knew you would be out over a month, I might understand, but a weekend holiday, no way! Such a breach of privacy must be clearly stated in SAFEA contract. Right?

[mrwslee003]

Sorry Raven,

Ignore my last message please.
They used your place and they should not have!
Even though they may not have intentionally did it to insult you but never the less the end result is the same.

Find another job unless they make amends!

[Moon Over Parma]

A national blacklist of teachers based on unprofessionalism or poor job conduct that does not breach regional, provincial or national laws does not exist in China. The closest thing you are a likely to find are provincial "tags"on foreign affairs police computers. Even then, palms would have to be greased, or serious offenses must be committed.

Most universities foreign affairs offices do not communicate with one another beyond brass tacks, and contrary to what one poster mentioned, when FAOs and deans from other universities meet, talking specific waijiao probably never comes up. Most deans rarely remember FTs unless they're given a reason to (see: illegal activities) and FAOs generally operate by an, "out of sight out of mind" philosophy. There are exceptions, but they are exceptions and not the rule.

There is definitely a national database of unwanted waijiao. They tend to be criminals or had to be involved in political activity, religious activity, or overstayed visas one too many times. Immigration usually stop blacklisted individuals before they can even enter the country, but embassies can often reject granting a visa before the unwanted foreigners ever depart for China.

To the original poster: booby traps. Seriously, spend time online and learn how to set up Home Alone-style booby traps that will teach any uninvited guests a lesson about being snoops. Seriously, how would your director deal with being doused in flour or conked on the head with a bucket of water? If they take you to task, then you can take them to task for even entering your apartment without notice. You could even mess with them, play innocent and tell them you're "sorry,' and you did it to get, "that other person who entered my room." I think after one booby trap you won't be having many unannounced visits.

There's only a couple of catches: you have to be prepared to clean up after the mess, and you have to change booby traps once they've been triggered.

Trip wire in numerous locations, the bucket of water and power gag, and so on. Make your revenge fun.

[flyingscotsman]

Is changing the locks not an option?