Job Discussion Forums

[Big Poppa Pump]

Give the middle east a try, they give ample time off to visit Geneva.

[Justin Trullinger]

Hey there- welcome to the boards heart.


I wanted to back up what several posters have said- Don't bother with going to London to do a CELTA. You seem to be thinking along the lines of "the best place" to get the qualification, but it really is the same cert, wherever you do it.

There are any number of CELTA courses in London, of course, some with good reps, some less good, and yet it's all still the same qual. Even the question of making connections there is limited- it's only a four week course, and those are high volume centers, running a course a month. Trainers get so frazzled they won't even recognise you 2 months later. Even if you really get their eye, you can't work in London with only a CELTA, and it's not likely trainers in a course in London have hiring connections elsewhere.

It's true what you've heard that, in theory, a company may hire a non-EU applicant if they are able to make a clear, convincing case for having researched the market and been unable to find a European with your skill set. I've encountered this in very very specific niche markets- exam design in English for Aviation according ICAO SARPs, for example. (I don't expect you to know what this means- hardly anybody does. Which is why my friend, who is an expert in this area that most people have never heard of, gets visas.)

For regular English teaching, though, this NEVER seems to happen. It just doesn't come up. To get you a visa, a company has to prove that they looked for a European candidate, and couldn't find one. It's an expensive process, a time consuming one, and one not guaranteed to work. This is why most companies never even go there. To go there in your case would involve commiting a few hundred working hours to the proposition that A) your qualifications are indispensable to their teaching needs (unlikely, because none of your high level quals are even teaching related, and that B) they cannot find a European with equivalent qualifications. (Which isn't true. There are a lot of English business-types who have wound up with CELTAs.)

YOu understand business; most businesses don't like long-shots. Because they can get someone locally, with much lower costs and time investment, and with the same or similar background.

Look at eastern Europe, where the rules are often less strict.

Finally, as a weird aside- do you have an aunt who is an EFL teacher? Very strangely, I've recently met an old-ish lady who teaches, and asked me for advice on her niece's situation. It would be a long shot, but...she described you exactly. (Same age, same degrees, same interest in Europe, connection to Switzerland...) Just wondered.

All the best,
Justin

[spiral78]

I've encountered this in very very specific niche markets- exam design in English for Aviation according ICAO SARPs, for example.

Interestingly, I actually do know exactly what this means, as my spouse is international ATC. But I couldn't do the job, unfortunately

[Justin Trullinger]

You could. Really. If there's a good one going, contact me for training.

In the context of this thread, it's just an example. A job I was interviewed for, and didn't take, was in your neck of the woods, though. Point is, they really had advertised for, and not found, an English instructor familiar with international civil aviation rules and guidelines, experienced in training teachers in aviation material, who held a passport from an EU country. Turned out I wasn't available, but the guy they got wasn't EU either.

But they only hired him because they HAD to. Their weren't European apps that met the requirements.

And that's where a business background, though useful in teaching in many circumstances, isn't specialized enough to get an American sponsored to work in Europe.

It really has to be a literal case of trying to find a European who could do it, and not finding ANY. If there is one adequate European available, the American loses. Always.

Best,
Justin

PS- Which airport is the hubby at, Spiral? I may have heard his voice! (Was once involved in a fairly extensive project of analyzing English used in ATC, based largely on recordings from Schipol...)

[spiral78]

Eurocontrol...upper air space. Not Schipol. But now in approach/tower in Canada. So you probably didn't ....


But they only hired him because they HAD to. Their weren't European apps that met the requirements.

And that's where a business background, though useful in teaching in many circumstances, isn't specialized enough to get an American sponsored to work in Europe.



Exactly. It applied to me (well, still does, except I'm declining to be renewed).

[ugottahaveheart]

Interesting information about the niche markets.

My MBA concentration (2006) is in the management of innovation and technology. European market analysts talk endlessly about the critical need for highly skilled workers and innovation in Europe. I can certainly teach companies the environment and methods to spur intrapreneurship and innovative thinking but that would be a one in a million position. It could happen, but not without a lot of searching and connections. If a position like that did open, I would need to have a couple of years of teaching experience under my belt first, so it all leads back to teaching for me.

@Justin: Thank you for the welcome. I can't find a CELTA certificate program near my home. I am going to have to go away for the training anyway. I should go to an inexpensive location if possible. London isn't cheap at all so I'll choose some other site.

I am not aware of anyone asking around for me, but it is quite possible given that I have a lot of friends who would call me "their niece" in order to gain information. I wish I knew because that would be quite a coincidence.

[ugottahaveheart]

[ugottahaveheart]

[spiral78]

You are declining to be renewed? Why?

New Management from Hell.

Are you familiar with Brussels? The teaching market is pretty dire there....

[naturegirl321]

[Kevin in SF]

"... Are you considering Latin America at all? It�s a good place to get both training and a first job. With a year�s experience you�ll have a lot more options."

Hi,

I'm male, 50, Anglo, and have a BA in English. Can you point me in the direction of where in Latin America I'd be best looking for work as a complete novice at teaching ESL?

My big goal is Buenos Aires, but since I have no previous experience teaching ESL, I figured I'd better try to get work for a year in China, probably Beijing, first. But Latin America is really where I want to be and would rather be.

Thanks very much in advance,

Kevin in SF