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Zero
Joined: 08 Sep 2004
Posts: 1402
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 Posted: Thu Dec 30, 2010 5:36 pm Post subject: |
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| wangdaning wrote: |
| I think the skilled (apprentices) craftsmen from our home countries with 5+years and a pension would laugh at us. (Quite possible their pension will fall through based on budget cuts and we can feel sorry for them). |
That is probably true, but in my country, the U.S., who has a pension? Pensions are becoming the exclusive domain of public-sector workers. Private-company pensions are quickly going extinct.
An interesting tidbit: In 2008, half of all Americans age 65 and older received less than $18,208 in income from all sources. http://www.pensionrights.org/policy/stats/stats_sources.html |
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Trifaro
Joined: 10 Nov 2010
Posts: 152
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| Posted: Thu Dec 30, 2010 5:54 pm Post subject: |
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It's all about timing A'Moo. Train yourself to do your #2 at certain times and most could definitely avoid squatting.
I'm proud to type - 6.5 years and have always sat down. This camper has never squatted and will never squat. |
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Teatime of Soul
Joined: 12 Apr 2007
Posts: 905
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| Posted: Thu Dec 30, 2010 6:42 pm Post subject: |
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Some one once commented, don't remember where, to the effect of...
1. Squatting is medically proven superior to conduct the business at hand.
2. Can you imagine if western cultures had developed squatting toilets first? Imagine the outcry, "They expect me to sit on the same seat as total strangers? Barbarians!"
So it kinda depends upon your perspective I guess.
Cheers |
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Ariadne
Joined: 16 Jul 2004
Posts: 960
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| Posted: Fri Dec 31, 2010 1:45 am Post subject: |
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It's alot easier to squat over a seated toilet than a hole in the floor. Just because you can sit doesn't mean you must.
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wangdaning
Joined: 22 Jan 2008
Posts: 3154
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| Posted: Fri Dec 31, 2010 2:42 am Post subject: |
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| Zero wrote: |
That is probably true, but in my country, the U.S., who has a pension? Pensions are becoming the exclusive domain of public-sector workers. Private-company pensions are quickly going extinct.
An interesting tidbit: In 2008, half of all Americans age 65 and older received less than $18,208 in income from all sources. http://www.pensionrights.org/policy/stats/stats_sources.html |
Also from the US, and I know pensions are quickly fading. However, they still exist in many industries (mostly public sectors and publicly needed goods markets). This is why a high school graduate who immediately goes to work in one of these sectors will be more financially secure than someone who goes to uni.
As far as crappers, well, if you got to crap find some hole to do it in. I remember being at the bus station in Dongguan, Guangdong and really needing to go. I was going on a trip to cross the border and only had 100 RMB notes. I crossed the street to a little shop to by paper for my duty. The cost of the paper was 1 RMB, and the lady was really nice seeing that I needed the paper. She woke up her husband to get me the change. Internal body movements are no secret, and when you need to go you will go in a hole. I wonder where the non-squatters go when they are camping. Maybe they must always be near a seat, but for the rest of us, you go where you can. |
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igorG
Joined: 10 Aug 2010
Posts: 1473
Location: asia
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| Posted: Fri Dec 31, 2010 6:30 am Post subject: |
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| 7969 wrote: |
| igorG wrote: |
| 7969 wrote: |
| igorG wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Cost of living in China may be rising, salaries may be stagnant, but the packages on offer with most Chinese employers are still very generous for the industry. |
I agree with most of this, except that "generous". The word in case is a relative term here. Salaries of locals have gone up quite a bit in past decade, haven't they? FTs terms and conditions have worsened rather than improved, and that does not compensate in the same way as before, does it? |
perhaps your plight has worsened, but many of us are seeing improved conditions. my salary increased 1500/month at the start of this year for the same amount of work as last year. it's my belief you will get what your employer thinks you're worth. for some of us that means improving conditions, not worsening. |
10 years ago, unis around offered 5000-6000 RMB for 10 teaching hours weekly. Little or no paperwork was required then. Is it the same today? And, office hours are becoming quite an issue around, don't they? Needless to compare the level of respect from locals today to what it was then, or to discuss the private language institutions on mainland. |
I got to china in 2003 and worked 16 hours per week for 3500 (first job in china). I now work 12-14 or so per week and earn more than twice as much and the job is far better than that first one.
i dont think you have a leg to stand on if you're complaining about a workload going from 10 to 14 or 16 hours per week. most of us are working hours here that barely qualify as part time work in most places. how much time off did you get back home each year? i have about five months off per year with pay give or take a week or two.
as for the paperwork (you didn't specify what paperwork, so i assume you mean visas, letters of reference etc), there were people lamenting that in the past china didn't require any paperwork to work here and that anyone who had two legs and could breathe had a job waiting. now that there are some actual requirements for the job some people are still unhappy. at least paperwork might keep out some of the riff raff who either cant, or wont bother to meet minimum requirements.
office hours? never had any and i'm willing to bet most people at a college job dont either. language mills have them but i'd never work at one of those places anyway.
respect from locals? I firmly believe that if you treat people well, they'll treat you well. I've been in the same location for five years now and cant remember one time when i felt disrespected here.
| A'Moo wrote: |
| 7969 wrote: |
| to address one part of the poll: if 59% of Canadians are living paycheque to paycheque and would be in financial difficulty if their pay were even one week late, then there isn't much saving going on in Canada. . |
59% of Canadians are living paycheque to paycheque-whilst driving and paying off a 2010 Jeep Wrangler X or H3 and paying a mortgage on a 500k home-thats why they are just making it...
I can assure you, if their greatest pleasures were taking buses from food stall to food stall to decide on which has the best noodles, working at a school which will never pay them a pension, going home to accom that will never be theirs, I suppose you can feel there is a comparison...
Oh-dont get sick here while living paycheque to paycheque... |
your life may have consisted of going from noodle shop to noodle shop, i assure you mine does not, and I'm sure many others feel the same.
i don't now where you're from but you're seriously misinformed on the current living standards and retirement prospects of the average canadian.
many are scraping by because of higher taxation (more to come in the new year), lower pay increases or complete stagnation in pay, higher cost of living year on year, easy credit and an over-willingness to use it, and poor money management skills. expensive homes and cars have much less to do with the problem than the other points listed.
as for the pensions, there is major reform on the way as most canadians don't pay into a defined pension plan (those are almost exclusively for public servants) and fewer and fewer private companies are paying the same pensions as in the past because the costs have skyrocketed. there are two pensions that all canadians can collect at age 60 and/or 65 and they're on pretty solid ground but they max out for most people at about $1000/mo. they'll barely keep you alive unless you've got some other form of savings to reach a living standard even remotely close to what you had before retirement. the government has recognized that too many people have no financial plan for retirement, therefore change is coming.
dont take my word for it though, read the daily articles in any Canadian newspaper and find out for yourself.
ultimately, (have to make some connection to china here) china doesn't offer much in the way of job security (which place does these days?) and none of us will be seeing any pension from this country, but for those of us who have planned carefully that wont matter one iota. the cost of living here is still lower than wherever home is and it's still possible to bank half of your salary here.
| igorG wrote: |
| Steinmann wrote: |
| Teatime of Soul wrote: |
| It's hard to imagine searching for jobs in China today without the Internet. |
Oh, man, that's a lot of shoe leather. |
This has made my day 
There above in my previous post, where I mentioned the internet, I forgot to point out that so many employment agreements around mainland China are very similar and much more difficult to negotiate today than before. |
what exactly is so difficult? judging by the posts some people on here make good jobs with excellent salaries are out there. you just have to find them. as well, some people are simply better negotiators than others. unless you've got a union to back you up when you come to china you take your chances here. you might get a generous offer and you might not. if you feel you got cheated somehow relative to the FT one school over, who are you going to blame?
| igorG wrote: |
| There above in my previous post, where I mentioned the internet, I forgot to point out that so many employment agreements around mainland China are very similar and much more difficult to negotiate today than before. This fact also gives FTs in the country little room to refuse a job today. |
little room to refuse a job? please elaborate? |
I surrender. It's a great country and one doesn't have to be a FT to make it 
Happy New Year to all |
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Teatime of Soul
Joined: 12 Apr 2007
Posts: 905
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| Posted: Fri Dec 31, 2010 1:01 pm Post subject: |
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It's not a surrender if you are accommodating reality.
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A'Moo
Joined: 21 Jan 2007
Posts: 1067
Location: a supermarket that sells cheese
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| Posted: Sat Jan 01, 2011 12:57 am Post subject: |
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[quote="7969"][ your life may have consisted of going from noodle shop to noodle shop, i assure you mine does not, and I'm sure many others feel the same.
If you are making 5000y a month, and saving a good portion of said amount, what are you doing?
Golf on Hainan island?
Mountain climbing in the Himalayas?
Trekking through Mongolia?
I make a fair bit more than 5000y, and im pretty tapped out at the end of each month, and do not live lavishly. |
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7969
Joined: 26 Mar 2003
Posts: 5782
Location: Coastal Guangdong
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| Posted: Sat Jan 01, 2011 1:22 am Post subject: |
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| igorG wrote: |
I surrender. It's a great country and one doesn't have to be a FT to make it
Happy New Year to all |
surrender accepted. now, can you answer my previous question?
| igorG wrote: |
| There above in my previous post, where I mentioned the internet, I forgot to point out that so many employment agreements around mainland China are very similar and much more difficult to negotiate today than before. This fact also gives FTs in the country little room to refuse a job today. |
little room to refuse a job? if people are offered a job and they don't like it, they're not forced to take it and can move on. please elaborate on how these difficult to negotiate jobs are giving us "little room to refuse a job."
Last edited by 7969 on Sat Jan 01, 2011 1:54 am; edited 1 time in total |
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zootown
Joined: 27 Nov 2009
Posts: 310
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| Posted: Sat Jan 01, 2011 1:53 am Post subject: |
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7969
I read that you are thinking of relocating to Xinjiang.
Good luck on trying to bring in the big bucks pay packet your on now more lickely you will be closer to were you where when you first came to China 3500 for a uni gig up there.
Cost of living has also gone up dramatically in the last year and a half.
Hope you like the cold -20 today. |
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7969
Joined: 26 Mar 2003
Posts: 5782
Location: Coastal Guangdong
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| Posted: Sat Jan 01, 2011 1:56 am Post subject: |
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| zootown wrote: |
7969
I read that you are thinking of relocating to Xinjiang.
Good luck on trying to bring in the big bucks pay packet your on now more lickely you will be closer to were you where when you first came to China 3500 for a uni gig up there.
Cost of living has also gone up dramatically in the last year and a half.
Hope you like the cold -20 today. |
my aim there would not be esl teaching, so there's no need to dwell on it further. as for the cold it doesnt bother me and in fact xinjiang would be an improvement over the weather in my hometown. |
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