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Oh My God
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 273
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 Posted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 11:00 pm Post subject: |
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drama queen wrote:
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| Fortunately, another poster saw the light at the end of the tunnel. |
What's wrong? Don't you like MY style of sarcasm? |
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baygioimdi
Joined: 28 Jan 2011
Posts: 44
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| Posted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 11:33 pm Post subject: |
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| the bank in question may actually be doing such things . How would you know? How can you prove it never happens? The burden of proof is on you to find a way to counter these claims, since the poster already gave a personal account. Do you understand how basic speech argument works? you cant dismiss someone out of hand. Such blanket dismissals of another's claims are not a part of debate. Have you ever taken rudimentary debate course? its a sport where I come from and a popular pasttime for young and old alike! really!. |
Well, that's an interesting concept that the burden of proof is on the person who disagrees with a particular claim. Unfortunately, you gave no real examples on why this is the case. In fact, it is the complete opposite. The burden of proof is on the one who makes the claim. for example, If you say that I committed a crime, it is your responsibility to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that I am guilty. It is not my responsibility to prove that I am innocent. If you believe in the flying spaghetti monster, it is your responsibility to proof that it's true not the person who disagrees with you.
If you think that dropping bombs on Libya is legitimate, the burden of proof is always on the person who says that violence is necessary and legitimate, not the person who says it is illegitmate. I can also discuss the role of the scientist and the hypothesis-the scientist who makes the claim that the aids virus causes HIV is responsible for conducting the experiments and publishing the results, the researcher has the burden of proof. The concept that the person who makes the charge, statement etc has the responsibility to prove it is elementary logic. You may want to read Dawkins, Hitchens, Chomsky, the late Stephen Jay Gould and others so you can get a better understanding of this issue.LOL
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hen you make the point that it all should be about black market exchange- when in fact its just about one actual bank. So why try and deflect the point? The thread posted talked about purchasing currency at a bank. Not black markets. Teachers after all aren't illegal in any way shape or form. They want to use official means whenever possible. Are you directing teaches to shop for currency (dollars which cant be gotten easily) at black markets?
And finally, you make the point that expats can always sell their foreign currency anywhere at the legitimate rate. Ah ha!. Don't you see? thats not the issue. The issue is unequal exchange is systemic, and always its a one way street. Expat getting tapped. Expat getting the short shrift. No recourse.
Your example only proves this. You claim that all is well and everything is just fine and fair because everyone can sell their foreign currency for Dong.
A lie of omission when buying dollars is the real matter. Everyone knows they can buy Vietnam Dong no problem. Buying dollars is the real issue And it is at a usurious rate, when anyone can even get them at all.
By the way. You should read the many reportages of scams and swindles on both a corporate and local level that appear in your newspaper, at great risk to the reporters who publish them. Congratulations on your command of English !.Do you need a teacher? |
Again, we need to look at the facts. It is interesting that you did not quote me. Why? These are figments of your imagination. Regarding all of my discussions on this thread concerning the buying of USD or the black market rates:
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| I would also like to clarify that this thread is not about the black market, buying usd etc thats on a different thread. |
I have made only the above comment on this thread concerning this issue.
You have of course changed the topic of this thread now to focus on buying USD and the black market exchange rates. As you already know, this is being discussed on a different thread. Please explain your actions, is this due to deflecting attention from the discussion because I am right concerning the issues that are being discussed on this thread? |
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Kornan DeKobb
Joined: 24 Jan 2010
Posts: 242
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| Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2011 8:00 am Post subject: |
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| baygioimdi wrote: |
The facts-foreigners in Vietnam will not have any issues concerning exchange rates(state bank of vietnam exchage rate)-when selling foreign currency-counterfeits are rare in Vietnam, a few issues with torn or marked notes, but generally easy to pass on depending on the transaction.
As I stated before, keep the stories coming. LOL |
Maybe not selling foreign currency, but regarding buying dollars there are HUGE problems with exchange rates - like how about the official state bank of Vietnam telling you to go to the illegal black market if you want dollars. This would of course be at a rate around 10% higher than the official rate. Funny, but my employer does not convert my dollar salary into VND at the black market rate, but then I am supposed to pay everyone else at that rate.
NO ONE at Vietcombank has yet been able to answer the question, "What is the official way for the foreigner to convert his VND into USD at the official rate?" If you show them an international air ticket, then they will sell you a measly one hundred dollars. |
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Andy123
Joined: 24 Sep 2009
Posts: 206
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| Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2011 11:29 pm Post subject: |
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| Drama Queen for President! |
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baygioimdi
Joined: 28 Jan 2011
Posts: 44
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| Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2011 2:41 am Post subject: |
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| Funny, but my employer does not convert my dollar salary into VND at the black market rate, but then I am supposed to pay everyone else at that rate. |
Unfortunately, I don't believe you will get any help on this website concerning the issue that you pay for everything at the black market rate. This is due to the fact that the majority of expats etc in Vietnam do not pay black market rates for any kind of transaction. Of course, there are a few who pay their rent in USD or at the black market rate, but that is their decision. It's similar to the foreigner who tries to pay everyone in USD in Vietnam even though they know it is not necessary. My only advice is to possibly pm some of the other posters on this thread who have translated their figments of imagination into reality. They will probably agree with you. However, I do have sympathy for individuals who have pathological issues. Therefore, please accept my apologies if you indeed do pay everyone at the black market rate.
Also, why do you need USD? Why not Euros, GBP, etcetc?
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| Drama Queen for President! |
Thank you for the recommendation, it's highly appreciated. |
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Kornan DeKobb
Joined: 24 Jan 2010
Posts: 242
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| Posted: Sat Mar 26, 2011 10:08 am Post subject: |
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| baygioimdi wrote: |
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| Funny, but my employer does not convert my dollar salary into VND at the black market rate, but then I am supposed to pay everyone else at that rate. |
Unfortunately, I don't believe you will get any help on this website concerning the issue that you pay for everything at the black market rate. This is due to the fact that the majority of expats etc in Vietnam do not pay black market rates for any kind of transaction. Of course, there are a few who pay their rent in USD or at the black market rate, but that is their decision. It's similar to the foreigner who tries to pay everyone in USD in Vietnam even though they know it is not necessary. My only advice is to possibly pm some of the other posters on this thread who have translated their figments of imagination into reality. They will probably agree with you. However, I do have sympathy for individuals who have pathological issues. Therefore, please accept my apologies if you indeed do pay everyone at the black market rate.
Also, why do you need USD? Why not Euros, GBP, etcetc? |
Very good, glad you told me all that. Now please tell me where you get your USD at the official rate?
If you must know, I need USD because I am American and have payments to make back home. |
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The Mad Hatter
Joined: 16 May 2010
Posts: 165
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| Posted: Sat Mar 26, 2011 4:28 pm Post subject: |
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baigoimdi (translates as shut up now) asked me to explain why the statements he made were so unproven. Here you go- It explains how wrong about burden of proof you are, and what a BS'er.
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Includes: Appeal to Ignorance ("Ad Ignorantiam")
Description of Burden of Proof
Burden of Proof is a fallacy in which the burden of proof is placed on the wrong side. Another version occurs when a lack of evidence for side A is taken to be evidence for side B in cases in which the burden of proof actually rests on side B. A common name for this is an Appeal to Ignorance. This sort of reasoning typically has the following form:
Claim X is presented by side A and the burden of proof actually rests on side B.
Side B claims that X is false because there is no proof for X.
In many situations, one side has the burden of proof resting on it. This side is obligated to provide evidence for its position. The claim of the other side, the one that does not bear the burden of proof, is assumed to be true unless proven otherwise. The difficulty in such cases is determining which side, if any, the burden of proof rests on. In many cases, settling this issue can be a matter of significant debate. In some cases the burden of proof is set by the situation. For example, in American law a person is assumed to be innocent until proven guilty (hence the burden of proof is on the prosecution). As another example, in debate the burden of proof is placed on the affirmative team. As a final example, in most cases the burden of proof rests on those who claim something exists (such as Bigfoot, psychic powers, universals, and sense data). |
So as the explanation shows, in this case, the burden of proof is on you because the situation allows only personal anecdotes as evidence which the poster had already provided, and all you have is empty unsupported statements that he must not be true.
And you can not take lack of evidence in side A (my point) to be evidence for side B ( You) , especially since you havent provided any.
In addition, you keep saying everyone can sell dollars and buy Dong at bank rate. That was not the issue. the issue was slipping in bad notes. Now you are making a lot of hay with your depictions of how no one pays bills or buys anything at black market rate. You know yourself that is also irrelevant to what's being discussed. But does this help any? |
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ajc19810
Joined: 22 May 2008
Posts: 214
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| Posted: Sun Mar 27, 2011 7:28 pm Post subject: |
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Vabeckele I feel your pain. I haven't had many good experiences in the banks here and at times it feels like I am dealing with a street vendor. Mind you I always get the result i want, but it takes me a lot of time, questioning and more patience than i have to offer.
Such experiences of mine include short changing, incorrectly spelled names on money transfers, no English speaking counter, not willing to accept my money and the list goes on. I suppose at least in Vietnam they do it to your face while in OZ they just screw you in different ways.
I would love to see Vietnam get up to scratch with internet banking ACB, Vietcomm etc interfaces are terrible and are extremely limited. It would make life a whole lot easier.
However, I accept it as I get an awesome interest rate with no need to lock my money in for a long period. |
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Vietnamarama
Joined: 04 Jan 2011
Posts: 35
Location: Vietnam
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| Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2011 2:08 am Post subject: |
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ajc, I'm not sure the interest rates here on dong deposits is that awesome. At first I thought the same but remember that inflation is probably over (or around) 14%. Just a short whole back the dong was devalued by over 9%, meaning that if you did have any savings, you just lost 9% overnight....In addition to this, USD deposits attract a very high interest rate around here (6%). So IF you had USD then I think it would be better to put them in the bank at 6% interest rather than convert to VND and save at 14%. Keeping VND in a bank account here means you could well be losing money in the long run. I don't know what the best strategy is!
I have only encountered minor problems at the banks here. Mostly I find things to run very smoothly and a lot of services are actually free! Back home I get charged simply for having an account....it's an online account as well! They call it a maintenance fee, go figure. |
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snollygoster
Joined: 04 Jun 2009
Posts: 478
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| Posted: Tue Mar 29, 2011 12:15 pm Post subject: Agribank |
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Most banks in Vietnam suck- Agribank is the biggest suck of all! Even now I have left Vietnam, their inefficiency, non-care attitude and complete incompetence continue to plague me.
They take the prize as the world's most uncaring bank. |
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Andy123
Joined: 24 Sep 2009
Posts: 206
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| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 4:07 am Post subject: |
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| I used to have an account there but the service was so bad. They do not learn. Okay, next bank. |
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LettersAthruZ
Joined: 25 Apr 2010
Posts: 466
Location: North Viet Nam
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| Posted: Fri Apr 01, 2011 3:04 pm Post subject: Re: Agribank |
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| snollygoster wrote: |
Most banks in Vietnam suck- Agribank is the biggest suck of all! Even now I have left Vietnam, their inefficiency, non-care attitude and complete incompetence continue to plague me.
They take the prize as the world's most uncaring bank. |
Dunno.....I had Viettin bank and they literally could care less when I told them that NOBODY SEEMS TO CARE and NOBODY wants to help me solve whatever issues with banking that I was having and I am tired of it! I'm moving to a new bank!!
"OK" came the flat, monotonal, not-giving-a-s**t response from the Vietin Bank "management"!
Moved to Dong A Bank and it is amazing with them.....it has almost gotten to where I wish they would open up branches in my home country! Great, CARING and QUICK customer service.....can't recommend 'em enough!! |
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