Job Discussion Forums

[Stosskraft]

Sorry I have not been able to post, it's been a crazy week.

Monday morning I went to the PSB with a friend to help me translate. Well this was useless as the lady who I was dealing with us was friends with my headmaster. This is why he laughed in my face when I told him I was going to contact my government and the PSB. She told me "just pay him and get the passport back" I tried explaining that someone keeping my passport and breaking the contract are separate issue and I will contact the Canadian government. She said, word for word "IF YOU MAKE TROUBLE WITH YOUR GOVERNMENT, YOU WILL HAVE MUCH TROUBLE IN CHINA !!". This can't be for real.

At this point my friend told me we should leave because it might be bad for us to stay there. At this point we decided to the police. The police were much more helpful, but they said basically "that I am a foreigner, so they cannot do anything and to contact the Chinese government because their department does not handle f"oreigner affairs". At this point they offered to accompany me to the school and watch over(witness) the dealings with my headmaster. Also my friend that was with me called her two uncles who happen to be police at the same station (they were not working this day) and explained the situation to them. They offered to meet us and accompany us to the school. This made me feel a little better as I knew things would get a whole lot worse real soon.

At this point I called my headmaster and told him that I would like to have a meeting with him to settle this. Realizing that I had no options left, I borrowed the 2000 RMB from a friend and decided to just pay the headmaster the money and get the passport back. Once I had my passport back I would be able to go to the bank and pay my friend back no problem. On the phone I explained to the headmaster I was going to pay the 4000 RMB minus the (approx) 2000 RMB in salary I had earned up to that point. I also said I would pay for whatever utilities I had use in the apartment as well. At this point he said "what about the 500 RMB for the visa ?". I told him that it was not in contract, that I needed to pay for the visa and that is why I am paying a 4000 RMB termination charge, to cover any cost I have produced by terminating the contract. At this point he said
"if you don't pay for the visa, I am GOING TO DESTROY YOUR PASSPORT !". Now here is were 2 weeks of stress and anger got released and I told the headmaster I was coming to the school and taking the passport from him after a thorough ass-kicking.

Within 20 min my friend, her two uncles and myself showed up at my school. We were greeted by about 5 uniformed police officers whom my headmaster called because he was afraid of what might happen when I got there. Luckily these officers were good friends with the 2 officers with me, and they started patting each other on the back and having a good laugh. It was also fun to watch the head master turn death white at this point.

During the "discussion" with the headmaster I told him "you cannot take something that is not your's, it belongs to the Canadian government" he replied with a laugh "this is China we can do want we want, and the Canadian government means nothing here".

Now I am going to clearly demonstrate what not to do in this situation.

I got up and grabbed my headmasters briefcase and emptied it on the floor. I started kicking the contents around the room looking for my passport. At this point my headmaster got really stupid and jumped on my back in an attempt to stop me. Now after training in ju-jitsu for several years and being quite enraged at this point, the headmaster found himself sailing through the air and landed on the back of him neck with a sickening thud (well it was music to my ears). Once hit the floor, I then had about 6 police on top on me, yelling in Chinese (sounded like "resistance is futile"). To my shock I was only escort to my friends vehicle and told not step back into the school.

After several hours of waiting I was FORCED to pay 2000 rmb to get my passport back. I also had to leave my apartment under police supervision.

Well to sum up, I find it hard to believe that a Chinese can hold a Canadian Passport and extort money for it ! Also the PSB is breaking Chinese law by letting the headmaster hold my passport and then threatening me when I mention the Canadian government. But this is china and I can't say anything surprises me anymore. I am staying in a hotel until Monday and then leaving for Canada Tuesday morning. I don't think I will ever step foot in this country again, and I don't think most people realized that foreigners don't have any legal rights with the local police. The police even said straight up they understand that someone cannot hold my passport, but they are powerless to do anything. I think people should be aware of this and their had been a few post about foreigners having things stolen from them, and I am afraid as Chinese realize that we are easy targets with little legal protection, this is going to happen with more frequency.

Well take care.

[Spiderman Too]

In respect of the issue of your passport being held by another party, it would be really good if someone with actual knowledge & experience of international law could enlighten us all of the facts. I think many people make incorrect assumptions on this issue.

Here are some real-life examples.

1

A fellow on holiday in Indonesia gets very drunk one night, climbs up onto a retaining wall and falls off. Hurt his back quite badly - touch & go for awhile as to whether he would be left with a permanent back injury. Anyway, he spent 2 weeks in an Indonesia hospital. The hospital contacted his travel insurance company but they won't pay. Policy fine print excludes accidents and injury resulting from self-intoxication.

While in hospital they (the hospital) asked for his passport so they could lodge a claim with the insurance company. When the insurance company said they wouldn't pay the hospital said they would keep the passport until the bill was paid.

The fellow's friend goes to the Australian embassy who tell him to pay the hospital bill to get his passport back. They also tell him they will not issue a replacement passport (must be lost or stolen, must sign a statutory declaration to that effect and must have a copy of a Police report).

The Australian embassy did offer emergency funds for which THEY would take the guy's passport as security as soon as he arrived at the airport in Australia.

2

A fellow on holiday in Thailand rents a motorcycle and, as newbies are inclined to do, gives the rental 'company' (they're not actually companies, but anyway) his passport as security.

As an aside, if you ever rent a bike in Thailand DON'T give them your passport. Offer a photocopy. If they don't accept then go to another rental company - there are thousands of them.

They gave him a chain lock for the bike, which he insists he used, but nonetheless the bike was stolen. They want to be paid for the bike. No pay, no passport. He says it wasn't his fault. He didn't read the rental agreement thoroughly. Basically, if anything happens to the bike, the renter pays. If a meteorite falls out of the sky and lands on the bike, the renter pays.

He goes to his embassy. They tell him that HE broke the law by using his passport as security for a 'commercial transaction'. They tell him they cannot become involved. He must settle the matter with the bike owner.

He goes to the Thai police - no joy. They tell him to pay the money first, then they will help him get his passport back (dah!).

3

A case the got a lot of publicity internationally and, especially in Australia. An Australian man is arrested in Cambodia on allegations of having sex with a minor. He gets released on bail but the Cambodian authorities keep his passport.

So, here is one example where your passport can apparently be legally held by another party.

Anyway, in this case the guy goes to a small police station and reports his passport as having been lost. He then goes to the Australian embassy and gets a new passport (the Australian government changed their laws about replacement passports effective January 1 this year). Next, off to Cambodian immigration and gets a replacement visa.

Then he goes back to Australia. Major embarassment for the Australian government!

Anyway, the point is, I don't think the issue of other people holding your passport is quite as black & white as some of us seem to think.

[lagerlout2006]

Fine print on my passport says: "...bearer surrenders passport to third party(eg. for pupose of obtaining a visa) and...not returned bearer shall report to aforementioned..." So in a case like stosskraft go and tell the embassy the truth and cover your butt.

In a hospital I can understand but giving your passport to a bike rental guy sounds almost criminally insane.

[Roger]

Much as I can empathise with stosskraft, I must say he acted a trifle silly.
With this incident on record, maybe he is barred from entering China for some time.

On the other ha with Chinese authorities is not the same as dealing with authorities in western countries. Chinese are far more aloof and inaccessible to the public. They still regard the public as their subjects, not the other way around.
That's why the law this year had to be amended. The cops have seen their powers curtailed.
It is for example possible to lodge a complaint against them - problem is: you need to know where and how. But if you succeed they are made to answer your comion can be taken against them.
As a foreign national you are well advised to seek the help of a lawyer immediately when a case starts spiralling out of control!

The lawyers may not be too knowledgeable, but if they happen to know about this legal provision then they also know who to contact to get you out of your predicament.

Sorry to read that they got that far at your expense!

[struelle]

What a story! When negotiation fails ...

Most alarming was the threat the headmaster made to destroy the passport. In front of the cops! And the statement: 'this is China, we can do what we want, the Canadian govt means nothing.'

If the headmaster turned white after seeing this many cops who knew each other, I would have played that to my advantage. A possible conversation:

Boss: If you don't give me 2000RMB, I wil destroy your passport.
Me: Well, <glancing at cops> then how will I legally work for you? I can't exactly teach nor obtain valid documents without a passport.
Boss: Then, I .... will .... without the passport ... um
Me: <to cops> Can he do this? Is this a good idea?
Cops: <to boss> No. It will mean lots of ma fan (trouble)

<30 min of discussion in Chinese>

Cops: <to me> We think you should give him the 2000RMB.
Me: That's fine, but first he gives me the passport.
Cops: No, give him the money first.

So it becomes a deadlock, just like the DPRK - USA nuclear weapons talks.

Me <to boss>: How about this. You give the passport to the police, then I'll pay you tomorrow.

Meanwhile, I call the Canadian Embassy again and have them contact the police directly and they try to get my passport to me.

Anyway, that's all a moot point, as the story's over.

Steve

[bgreytak]

Three of us broke a contract and were threatened with the exact same thing. We found work elsewhere in China and there was no problem. Our boss at the new job said that they could not stop us at the border or throw us in jail. My advice is go to the PSB and tell them you want your passport back now! They can not refuse to give it back to you. If they do refuse, call your embassy ASAP and they will get it for you. Make sure you write down the names or numbers of any people and PSB officers that you talk to. Make sure that they see you writing down their names. That scares them and they back down. Trust me, it works. Good luck.

[Stosskraft]

Here is the information for this school, (in case anyone is looking for a new job )

School name: Fushun Feifan English School

Country: China
City: Fushun

Contact: Mr.Wang ([email protected])

[milkweedma]

Sorry to dredge up an older thread but this school : Feifan English School in Fushun, Liaoning province are constantly advertising for teachers on another well known job board which makes me suspicious of them.
So does anybody out there have some more up to date details about working for them?
The OP of this thread had a nightmare with them, so have they improved at all or are they still terrible to work for?