Job Discussion Forums

[chryanvii]

What is the benefit of working at a university and supporting your income with a second job versus maintaining one job at a private training center and making the same?

My feeling right now is that Private Training Centers pay more money and offer salary increases each year, depending on performance. They give you an allowance to live off campus where you can have a life of your own. If you choose to do so, there is very little preparation time involved, other than social clubs, which are kind of fun to prepare anyway. If requested, they will give you up to a month of leave time to travel. I think 2 weeks at a time is enough for a good solid trip in China, especially if you are paid well.

Universities may provide for you a place to stay, but they pay rather low, and you become a university puppet. There is a lot of extra paperwork to do, like grading. At a language mill, the students handle their own paperwork, and when you're done for the day, you leave the school and have your own life.

It is true that universities offer a lot of extra free time. But from what I have seen, it seems that most people just choose to use this time either to go home or work a second job anyway. My opinion is that if you try to travel all over China during the Summer on a university salary, you would be nearly broke at the end, unless you know how to be really frugal with your money, which I don't. I like my buffets and my hotels.

[thessy]

There are good mill jobs and bad mill jobs just as there are good unis and bad uni jobs.

[Salvatore]

I agree with the above.

14k at Wall Street in Shanghai for 30 full hours.

7k at my university for 18, 45 minute periods. Free apartment too.

[nickpellatt]

The perceived advantages are normally quite clear;

The likelihood of lower working hours is greater at a Uni. If you want to work extra, at least that is your choice rather than terms of a contract. You can top up with privates if available, but if you want to relax more and do others things you can.

Less contact time. Quite often, a 12 class schedule may mean seeing 12 different classes. So some teachers in some locations may be able to limit their prep time to a single lesson per week.

Longer holidays. Almost without fail, a Uni will offer longer holiday periods than a contract in a training centre offers.

And for some, lower levels of student expectation and demands. Students studying English because they have to, will often be less demanding than training centre students who are paying their own hard earned cash for lessons, expecting quick, measurable results.

[sistercream]

The main reason I am totally *over* language mill work is that in all bar one of the mills I've worked in the majority (or more likely all) the students have been told/ bribed/ "strongly encouraged" to be there by parents or teachers who have something to gain by the arrangement. Teaching classes like that is like trying to push honey uphill with a sieve on a hot day.
I am definitely NOT saying that Chinese university students are 100% eager beavers who hang on the English teacher's every word, but in some places it does actually nearly get there, and even if you get a batch of cr@p classes you at least have more time to recover between them than you do at mills.

[Lobster]

Both have pros and cons, and as pointed out, there is a great difference between individual unis and mills. Having worked at both, I'd have to say I prefer the mill. Unis offer much less money. Sure the basic teaching hours are fewer, but there can be a lot of prep, testing and grading. The classes range from large to huge, so it's harder to get to know the students' needs and help them progress on an individual basis. Many of the students have low motivation. You have little say in the way things are done. Unis can be quite political, but not in the western sense. Facilities may be crude.

At a mill, once you have proven yourself you can gain some influence. The students are paying and are more motivated (if they're adults). There is no grading or pressure to make students pass even when they're not showing up or semi-conscious in class. Discipline isn't an issue. You can get to know your co-workers. Classes are generally small, and you can really see progress. Once you learn to use the materials, prep is a breeze. The management may offer you opportunities to earn more through extra activities such as speech contest judging, making presentations or corporate work. Additional hours are often available without chasing privates. However, be preapred to work evenings and weekends.

I think it's really a matter of preference. Most people I know who choose unis are those who are more concerned with having free time than solid earnings; retired teachers on pensions or younger ones who just want to work enough to get by while they party or travel. For personal reasons, I want the cash, and lots of it.

I do enjoy my uni classes, but they're a lot of work. I like evening work. I like small classes. I prefer a smaller establishment. To each their own. I do have to say, however, that a poorly-run mill is often much worse than a poorly-run uni. I hear more teachers complain about treatment at a mill.

RED

[TexasHighway]

In my university job, the only paperwork I have is when I submit the final grades at the end of the semester. I have no meetings and no required office hours. I work eight months a year, four days a week, but get paid for twelve. My first couple jobs in China many years ago were at language mills but never again. I am much happier teaching at universities.

[nickpellatt]

[chryanvii]

But the people who prefer working at the language mills are forgetting one thing...

"oh no...not the 'who is Max/who is Kathy' lesson again!

Boredom, boredom, boredom. You eventually see the same faces over and over again, and you quickly start to see the same lessons over and over again.

I have thought about just working at a mill for several years and racking in money, but I honestly don't think that I would be able to stand giving people the same lessons over and over again after a year. In fact, I have already worked at a Mill for a year...and once I heard somebody remind me on the telephone of the Max and kathy lesson, I cringed...

[auchtermuchty]

A university job gives you the time and flexibility to pursue other opportunities, not just another teaching job, and it also gives you much more control over the length of your vacations (though not the timing). I make more than I'd make from a mill job, but I'll be taking six weeks off this summer.

[cormac]

Since a full semester has essentially ended, perhaps I can give some insight. I've done both now.

[igorG]

[chinanoodles]

As has been said before, there are good and bad jobs on both sides. However some of the folks who say that believe their experience can speak for the entire industry.

Some mills require testing and grading. Some Uni's don't.

I can go on forever but am lazy right now so I'll stop at that one.

Long story short...every position is different. Uni or mill has little impact. Everything negative said about mills can be applied to some Uni's and vice versa.

[cormac]

[TexasHighway]

In my experience at language mills, the bulk of my students were obnoxious, demanding, complaining businessmen who insisted on smoking in class and could have a teacher fired at will. Others were a bunch of lazy, spoiled rich kids who rarely showed up at class. At the university I teach at now, my students are sweet, docile, hardworking, respectful, and never complaining. They also happen to be 95% female. Universities win hands down for me!