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AdamtheJohnson
Joined: 10 Nov 2008
Posts: 157
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 Posted: Fri Jun 24, 2011 9:10 pm Post subject: Japan calling/Hostel Question |
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Japan has been calling me lately. The only thing keeping it off my list was the key money/start up fees for a place to live.
What about using a hostel as a start up residence? Not any cheaper, except for the key money, etc. Has anyone done this? |
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seklarwia
Joined: 20 Jan 2009
Posts: 1546
Location: Monkey onsen, Nagano
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| Posted: Fri Jun 24, 2011 9:32 pm Post subject: |
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Hostels are not necessarily cheaper in the long run and not all hostels will allow long-term residency.
If you are working in a city, you could start off in a guest house. But outside of decent size cities, this will not be an option.
My advice would be to stay where you are for the time being and save more money before coming.; Japan isn't going anywhere.
Not all apartments will require huge start up fees, and some employers may have company housing which will require no keymoney payments and may even come with decent furnishing. But there is always the chance that you may have to fork out for these start up fees and it is better to have the money on hand than to be forced to take a loan from your employer which will not only eat into your salary but also leave you in a sticky situation if you are forced to leave the job before you finish repaying it. |
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AdamtheJohnson
Joined: 10 Nov 2008
Posts: 157
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2011 12:23 am Post subject: |
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Going from Glenski's advice,
Since I started this thread only hours ago, I'll ask further questions here.
I've been saving up for a while, finally making decent enough money to put some away. Ive got about 2K in the bank today, but that number will go up. (Certainly not down.)
I've *heard* that it costs between 4-5K just to get in the door. That seems like too much. Im exploriing Hostels (for the first few months only), guest houses, and I even have a friend living in Japan with his wife, so there's that. Frankly, the only thing stopping me is this:
The teaching. It's very intimidating. I have no teaching experience whatsoever, no more shy than the average person I guess. Just honestly scared about up and doing it. My friend tells me even if teachign doesnt work out, I shoudl be alright doing photography, which I have a degree in and which, lets jsut say, "caters" to certain japanese markets.
Anyway, I was planning on traveling to China and seeing if the ESL market there was something I want to pursue - maybe that's a better "starter" country for me, since I've read (in cities like Yangshuo) the work week is very, very short but the pay still supports. Better idea? Worse idea?
Anyway, ramblin' man rambles on. |
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seklarwia
Joined: 20 Jan 2009
Posts: 1546
Location: Monkey onsen, Nagano
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2011 3:13 am Post subject: |
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| AdamtheJohnson wrote: |
I've *heard* that it costs between 4-5K just to get in the door. That seems like too much. |
It can but it doesn't have to.
Certainly when I moved to my new apartment in January it cost me a bit shy of 400,000 to move in but there were cheaper options available; I simply wanted that specific apartment. My apartment had key money, a large deposit and I had to pay a chunk of rent upfront. Those are what made up the bulk of my payment. So yes it did cost to move in, but I didn't have rent to pay for about a month and half and when I moved out, I got about 100,000 yen of my deposit back and a few other refunds from the insurance company, guarantor company and apartment support because I had only been there a couple of months.
Some apartments don't require key money or large deposits.
And there is always Leopalace:
Leopalace places may be small but they come ready to go complete with internet and furnishings and the initial costs are substantially lower (cost me 200,000 to move in which included two months of rent to cover me until the first pay day).
For many, they don't make a great long term option, but in your first year they can be a good stepping stone whilst you save up to move into a bigger and nicer place.
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| Im exploriing Hostels (for the first few months only), guest houses, and I even have a friend living in Japan with his wife, so there's that. |
As I said some hostels don't want to long term residents for a number of reasons. Plus if you are still there when a peak period hits you are going to hit with a price spike.
Guest houses are good stepping stone option, but they are not always widely available.
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| My friend tells me even if teachign doesnt work out, I shoudl be alright doing photography, which I have a degree in and which, lets jsut say, "caters" to certain japanese markets. |
Have you checked out visa requirements for a photography job? Different visas have different requirements. If (and that is a big if) you managed to get a decent photography job to support yourself on but your were no longer teaching, special permission is no longer going to cut it with regards to your status of residency and you are going to have to apply for a new visa.
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The teaching. It's very intimidating. I have no teaching experience whatsoever, no more shy than the average person I guess. Just honestly scared about up and doing it.
... ...
Anyway, I was planning on traveling to China and seeing if the ESL market there was something I want to pursue - maybe that's a better "starter" country for me, since I've read (in cities like Yangshuo) the work week is very, very short but the pay still supports. Better idea? Worse idea? |
I've done teaching in China and yes whilst it is easy to find pay that supports pretty well, the hours depend of the job. I had a uni job with very good pay for very few hours. I did participate in other things that took place on campus but they were not actually required and I got paid extra as a result. But in regular schools, you could find yourself at work for just as many hours as you would being an ALT in Japan.
The only problem with the pay is that Chinese money has no value outside of China. Whilst you can live like a king and still save a huge percentage of salary in China. But when you then exchange it, that money that could put you well on the way to buying an apartment in China becomes barely enough to get you a return flight so that you can holiday in your home country and of course gets you very little yen. So unless you have extra savings or have worked and saved in China for several years, you are going to find a China to Japan transition even harder than a transition from most Western countries and overseas recruitment is not going to be possible unless you can find one of the rare Skype interview jobs.
The teaching work itself is often pretty similar in both countries; I wouldn't say that China is any easier and on occasions more difficult. And there are no ALT positions over there. So yes, in regular schools you will be dumped infront of classes of upto 40 students and expected to teach solo. I was in a uni so normally had lecture halls full of double that number for 90mins per class. There were curriculums but how a teacher chose to deliver the contents was up to them so all my lesson plans were 100% my own.
Some jobs will supply a text book, materials or curriculum whilst others will give you a room with not even a proper blackboard and say, "See you in an hour." (or more, since many classes run longer than the 50 mins typical in Japan)
My flatmate worked in a biligual kindergarten. She was in that place from 8am-5pm (she did get a long lunch break of about two hours in which she would come home and take a nap - we lived and worked on campus). When she wasn't singing, dancing (and ever so occassionally teaching) she was just another member of staff and expected wipe snotty noses with the rest of them. And had to work one Saturday out of every month which was a parents day. To add insult to injury, we technically had the same employer but she was paid substantially less than me for the considerable more hours and days she had to put in... it wasn't a salary that had her living as a pauper by any means, but considering how much time she was there it did seem wrong that her basic salary was half of mine and she earned about a 3rd of what I did once you counted all the additional payments I received from activities, events, etc that I had the free time to participate in.
So if you think that your concerns about teaching in Japan are not going to apply so much in China, you are greatly mistaken. |
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jcook77
Joined: 08 Oct 2010
Posts: 32
Location: Tokyo
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2011 8:42 am Post subject: |
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If you're coming to Tokyo, there are TONS of guesthouses with multiple availabilities. People come and go in the Greater Kanto area on a weekly basis. Some of the major guesthouses (Sakura House, Oakhouse) cost about 80,000 yen total to move in, with rent between 50,000-85,000 yen/mo. for a small single room.
I frowned upon living in one when I moved to Tokyo, but it is, in fact, a cheap and convenient option for someone with only a limited amount of cash. Plus, you can meet new people and have other veterans point you in the right direction regarding jobs, cost of living, etc. |
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whispechoes
Joined: 07 Feb 2010
Posts: 20
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2011 9:07 am Post subject: |
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AdamtheJohnson,
You mentioned that 4-5k to start sounds like too much, and maybe that sounds like a LOT... however, money gets eaten up really quickly here, and some of that is meant as a buffer to help you out in case of emergency (i.e. you don't get a job right away, you have an accident, you freak and want to go home and need the next plane out of the country, etc.).
That said, there are a number of other options besides hostels, and I encourage you to consider what seklarwia mentioned in regards to options; guest houses, LeoPalace, temporary apartments, etc. If you're moving to a city that has a university, check the university's site for ideas on housing in the area (they sometimes list places they're affiliated with that might also accept you).
Keep in mind there are loads of startup costs too. Not only the apartment, but cell phones, insurance, car stuff (if you get a car upon arrival), anything you might need for your apartment/room/whatever, etc.
Take it from someone who only recently moved here; the more you have in the bank, the more comfortable you're going to be. If you're in a massive rush to get out of your home country, though, then I recommend you look into China or Korea instead, as they at least pay for airfare and still tend to cover rent for you.
Good luck! |
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AdamtheJohnson
Joined: 10 Nov 2008
Posts: 157
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2011 2:56 pm Post subject: |
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Yeah, 5K to move in is a bit much. The 600-700 US/month range for guesthouses etc, is certainly much better, but I still better pack a fat chunk of cash! 
Ive just seen hostels in Yangshuo, China going for $2/night, and it seems realistic to live on $5/day there. It would be more difficult to save in China, but the lifestyle may be more what I like.
Im not sure if I want to live in a city in Japan or the countryside. Both have their pros and cons of course. (I get the feeling Tokyo would be a bit "much" for my tiny Texas brain to handle right away.) |
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