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spiral78
Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 11534
Location: On a Short Leash
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 Posted: Sun Oct 16, 2011 4:49 pm Post subject: |
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| 'Probably' indicates a fairly high chance of the condition being a reality, which is why I objected to the statement. At this stage, the information we have does not indicate that it is 'probable' that the trainers are persecuting lydia. |
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_smaug
Joined: 08 Sep 2010
Posts: 92
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| Posted: Sun Oct 16, 2011 4:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Sashadroogie wrote: |
| Nope, don't get that point at all. lydia.bainbridge has said that the tutors were supportive, so don't know how that could be read as if they are going out of their way to make anyone feel as though they are floundering . . . The CELTA trainee is probably feeling overwhelmed by the intensity of the course, as do many other trainees. Nothing new there. To suggest this confusion is due to some sort of sadism on the tutors' part (on account of them being British) is ... OK I'll stop now before total descend into silliness. |
Never said it was sadistic. I'm not sure it's even conscious. It's "learnt"; passed from teacher to student; culturally transmitted.
It�s in the genes, so to speak: What is and isn�t a �proper� classroom environment. |
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_smaug
Joined: 08 Sep 2010
Posts: 92
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| Posted: Sun Oct 16, 2011 4:57 pm Post subject: |
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| spiral78 wrote: |
| 'Probably' indicates a fairly high chance of the condition being a reality, which is why I objected to the statement. At this stage, the information we have does not indicate that it is 'probable' that the trainers are persecuting lydia. |
They're not persecuting intentionally. They're just maintaining what they consider to be proper rigor; the proper rigor they were exposed to, and their teachers were exposed to, and their teachers before them were exposed to . . . which involves suffering and enduring. |
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spiral78
Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 11534
Location: On a Short Leash
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| Posted: Sun Oct 16, 2011 5:05 pm Post subject: |
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Again, we simply don't know what they are doing in this case, whether it's conscious or not. Lydia hasn't elaborated on what the actual problem is. Jumping to conclusions based on ones' own experience and perception is fine - but it's not really fair to project that onto someone else's unknown situation.
It's similar to those teachers who have experience in only one country, and who give advice to teachers in entirely different regions of the world based on the assumption that what works, for example, in Japan will also be applicable in Europe or North America. It's simply not accurate. |
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Sashadroogie
Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 11061
Location: Moskva, The Workers' Paradise
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| Posted: Sun Oct 16, 2011 5:23 pm Post subject: |
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_smaug have you been to a British school? In reality, I mean. Not just watched a flick or something.
"Rigor". As in mortis?  How about some intellectual rigour? |
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_smaug
Joined: 08 Sep 2010
Posts: 92
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| Posted: Sun Oct 16, 2011 5:27 pm Post subject: |
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| spiral78 wrote: |
Again, we simply don't know what they are doing in this case, whether it's conscious or not. Lydia hasn't elaborated on what the actual problem is. Jumping to conclusions based on ones' own experience and perception is fine - but it's not really fair to project that onto someone else's unknown situation.
It's similar to those teachers who have experience in only one country, and who give advice to teachers in entirely different regions of the world based on the assumption that what works, for example, in Japan will also be applicable in Europe or North America. It's simply not accurate. |
Well, yeah, my belief is based on my perception and my experience. But I think my belief is justified by fact. British schools are more demanding, more rigorous; and the feedback (grades/evaluations) tend to be �harsher� � if I can use that term � than any in the world.
This isn�t something that�s set out explicitly in a national curriculum; it just is -- by virtue of long tradition.
(This is all good-natured, right? I wouldn�t want anybody to get offended or mad or anything) |
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_smaug
Joined: 08 Sep 2010
Posts: 92
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| Posted: Sun Oct 16, 2011 5:37 pm Post subject: |
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| Sashadroogie wrote: |
_smaug have you been to a British school? In reality, I mean. Not just watched a flick or something.
"Rigor". As in mortis? How about some intellectual rigour? |
I've attended and taught at several British schools. And I've attended and taught at several American schools. I�ve also known many British and American teachers.
I think I can say with some confidence that there is a distinct difference between the two nationalities where educational philosophy is concerned.
"Rigor", sorry. I've had a few Efes. ; ) |
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spiral78
Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 11534
Location: On a Short Leash
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| Posted: Sun Oct 16, 2011 5:53 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| (This is all good-natured, right? I wouldn�t want anybody to get offended or mad or anything) |
No, don't worry - I'm just a bit pedantic.
I agree with you about the differences in the systems, and as I pointed out in an earlier post, I tend to think that the British approach to these things is somewhat more appropriate to teachers in international contexts than a US approach would be.
I'm just saying that we can't paint lydia's trainers with this brush (yet) because we really don't know what exactly is going on in her specific situation.
I'll generalise with you endlessly, though, if you want, though I'm sadly lacking Efes at the moment  |
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Sashadroogie
Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 11061
Location: Moskva, The Workers' Paradise
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| Posted: Sun Oct 16, 2011 5:56 pm Post subject: |
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Efes! That's where you are going all wrong!!! Vile concoction. Break out the good stuff, the vodka, and watch all these preoccupations float away, hic! Even watch yer occupation float away too...
Don't doubt that there is a difference between the methods employed. But I can't but help sense a value judgement behind some of the other statements. If so, let me add my own: education is immeasurably 'better' with regular thrashings to punish weaklings. Failure to punish is the death-knell high standards. I wish, oh how I wish that CELTA would allow me to continue my pioneering EFL training research in this area. But no. After that unfortunate incident that I am legally not allowed to speak of publicly, Cambridge has gone all American and touchy-feely. so, I'd have to argue that UK training is not nearly harsh enough hic! |
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spiral78
Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 11534
Location: On a Short Leash
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| Posted: Sun Oct 16, 2011 5:57 pm Post subject: |
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Rats. It's no fun to be the only one sober at the party.
I'm not the designated driver, am I? |
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Sashadroogie
Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 11061
Location: Moskva, The Workers' Paradise
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| Posted: Sun Oct 16, 2011 6:32 pm Post subject: |
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Rats. Seen plenty of them too, the buggers! Pink ones, betimes. They'll get a good hiding and all.
Spiral, you can be the dedicated adviser, and I'll be a medicated riser hic! |
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lov2travel
Joined: 18 Oct 2008
Posts: 42
Location: Istanbul
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| Posted: Sat Nov 12, 2011 10:35 am Post subject: |
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What is the price of this Online CELTA course with ITI? I can't find it anywhere on the site.
I seem to remember it being either $1000 or $2000.
I've promised my employer I'd get it and plan to get it so I can work in the EU next year. |
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jamessmart50
Joined: 14 Nov 2005
Posts: 91
Location: Istanbul, Turkey
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| Posted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 11:08 am Post subject: |
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| I think it's the same price at both ITI and British Side, 950 pounds. Not dollars. |
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spiral78
Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 11534
Location: On a Short Leash
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| Posted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:55 pm Post subject: |
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luv2travel, CELTA is a good cert to have and I'll be interested to hear how the blended version of it goes. However, I think you're aware that if you don't have the right passport, a CELTA won't get you into most of the EU. It WILL help in countries where you can legally apply for a work visa (Czech Rep, Poland, etc) but not for Western Europe. So long as you're planning to go for the countries where you can work legally and you time your arrival for end August preferably, to co-incide with the peak hiring periods, you should have a decent chance.
Do let us know how the online version goes - where are you going to do your practicuum? |
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delal
Joined: 04 Oct 2005
Posts: 251
Location: N Turkey
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| Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2011 6:31 pm Post subject: |
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I'm leaping in to defend the Brits
Many, many moons ago I did my CELTA in Bournemouth in the UK and had the most amazing open-minded, positive, kind and supportive trainers I could have ever wished for, as well as a great bunch of fellow CELTA trainees
Yes, the course was intense because everything was new but it was also fun
I certainly don't remember anybody being sadistic or trying to make me or anyone else feel bad and-should it ever be possible-I'd love to go back and do my DELTA with them |
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