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Qaaolchoura · Posted: Fri Oct 14, 2011 3:17 pm Post subject: Phone card scam?

So about a month ago, I went into a Turkcell store in a brick and mortar building, and bought a phone card. When I bought the card, it came with a larger orange card with a number, and an orange envelop. The man at the store kept the envelop, and gave me the card, which I kept in my wallet.

I used it to make phone calls until yesterday (probably around the one month mark), when I realized it wasn't working. Though I had only made about six local calls, one US call of less than a minute, and one text message, I assumed that a large part of the 50 YTL I paid must have gone to the card itself. I wasn't happy, but went into another Turkcell store to get it refilled.

At this store, and showed me on a calculator 2.79 lira (either the amount I was overdrawn, or the fee. Then he put it in his phone, fooled around with it, and showed me the balance on the calculator (47.31). Now when I tried it in my phone, it still showed "emergency calls only," so I showed it to him, and when he acted like he didn't understand, I tried to call someone and got a "not on network message." He put in back in his phone, showed me the balance by dialing *123#, and made a call to his landline. Then I put it back in my phone, tried calling *123#, and it again showed it as "not on network."

At this point, he told me that the problem was with my phone, which I needed to register, at the Aksaray branch. So I went down there, and was told that the system was down throughout Turkey.

I went down again today, and he told me that there was "no name." I assumed he wanted either the phone number or the bar code, so I fished in my wallet for the orange card, and noticed it wasn't in my wallet. Either I left it at the store by accident, or he deliberately kept it. So I went back to the store I refilled my card at, hoping it was the latter, but he insisted he didn't have it.

So I went and got my phone number off my Skype account, wrote it down, and went back down to the Aksaray branch. There, after waiting in line, he once again told me there was "no name." I still didn't understand him, but fortunately there was a Turk in line who spoke fluent English and translated for me. He claimed that the SIM Card was not registered in my name, that he could not register the phone without the SIM Card. He also told me that I needed the receipt, which neither store had given to me. When I said this, another customer piped up and said that it was a scam, though I'd bought it at a brick and mortar Turkcell store, and that the only thing I can do is buy a new card.

So I'm trying to piece this together:
1. It worked in the phone of the guy at one Turkcell store.
2. I don't see how either of the Turkcell stores benefited by scamming me. (Maybe the first one gave me less credit than he was supposed to, or the second one somehow pocketed the money I gave him.)
3. Did the second guy set the registration to his name, which is why it worked in his phone? (I can't get anybody to let me try it on their phone.)

So I want to piece together what happened, and if there's anything I can do about it.
If this is a common scam, perpetuated by Turkcell affiliates? How does it work, and what can I do about it? Whether scam or simply serious negligence on the part of the first guy, is there anybody I can contact in Turkcell about it? If it's the second guy, and he registered it to his phone, could I get help from the Tourism Police? If it's not the second guy, would I be able to use this card once I've got my phone registered?

Why the hell won't they let me register the SIM Card anyways? If it's in nobody's name, and it works on any registered phone, then it seems obvious that it's been paid for. If it's in someone else's name, it will be a Turkcell affiliate, and they can track it down pretty easily.

Thanks and regards,
~Q

curious&wiser · Joined: 07 Oct 2011 Posts: 8

To my knowledge there are 2 ways to buy a sim card from any network...

One involves the registering using IDs and photocopies and the other is the way I think you did... the 'no name'. These cards are used particularly (if not entirely legally) for kids under 18.

The question is did you use an ID or not? If not then your number is not registered against your name.

Also is your phone from outside Turkey? You can use it with a Turkish sim for 30 days before they block it. You need to register your phone against your passport. The sim you have would work in another phone because its the phone that is blocked not the sim. You can register one phone per passport per year (unless they've recently changed it) it's their way to stop people travelling abroad and buying phones WAY cheaper than the Turkish counterparts.

No sim will work in your phone until it's registered with a network. I think they charged me 5 or 10 Liras to do it last summer. You'll need a main branch office not an off-shoot to do this and it doesn't take long to do but it can take a couple of days to activate.

Hope this helps and not a clear as mud!!!

curious&wiser · Joined: 07 Oct 2011 Posts: 8

Oh I forgot ... you can also buy a new sim card without much credit on it from any network and register it and your phone at the same time.... it maybe the easiest way to go and should cost you around 20 TL

Good luck

Qaaolchoura · Posted: Fri Oct 14, 2011 8:36 pm Post subject:

curious&wiser: Thanks.
Yes, I have a foreign phone. An unlocked Galaxy Tab. I had a fun time explaining that it wasn't an iPad to one customer service woman, who seemed to be trying to explain that the iPad is locked.

No I did not show ID until I tried to register the phone today, and I had no idea that I should. I mean it's a pre-paid phone card. I've never used one, but I assumed I wouldn't need ID any more than I would with a pay phone or an Istanbulkart (Which I actually keep more money on). And nobody told me otherwise.

Would I be able to use my remaining time if I bought a card from VodaPhone or Avea?
I feel like given the absolutely horrible customer service from Turkcell (the first store didn't do anything he was supposed to do, the second didn't tell me about registration until I tried to get my money back), I might like to use another carrier from now on. I don't want to give Turkcell any more money if I can avoid it (neither for a new card nor for device registration), but I don't want to write the 50 lira I spent off as a loss.

Thanks,
~Q

curious&wiser · Joined: 07 Oct 2011 Posts: 8

Yeh Iphones are king here!

Once you've registered YOUR PHONE you can use any sim card in it. I'm not sure if it's still there but there was an English version of how to do it on the Turkish Consulate London page. Even if you choose another network to register your phone you'll be able to switch to your Turkcell to use the credit up as you want.

Another thing to remember for the future is that once you have a registered sim card to your name you can switch networks and keep your number. But the trick is that it has to be registered to your name to do it. Be careful..... ALL sim card sellors will have these 'no name' cards so make sure that if you get another one that it's registered.

Have fun waiting in those lines! Laughing

Englishteach · Joined: 01 Oct 2010 Posts: 33

These place is good at scams .. foreigners, especially, should be careful. I recently had a similar situation with my Ipad.. went, dealt with those morans, registered it, bought a sim card for it.. and few months later learned it had not been registered properly. You cannot believe what I have to go through to re-register it. A nightmare. So, don't expect good customer service, and always be on the lookout for a scam. Gotta cross the t's and dot the i's or it might come back to bite you in the butt.

coffeespoonman · Joined: 04 Feb 2005 Posts: 512 Location: At my computer...

As curious&wiser said, the problem is that you did not register your phone when you arrived in Turkey. Unfortunately, this information is not advertised when you enter...

All phones must be registered, whether you buy them in Turkey or abroad. However, the reason they do it is not to stop Turks from going abroad and buying cheap phones. Anyone, including Turks, can register their phone foreign-bought at the airport. It's to provide security in case your phone is stolen (not that it helped when mine was).

I'm not sure what to do now that your 30 days is up. I've heard that you simply have to buy a new phone. However, there must be another way. Good luck - the law has good intentions, but poor implementation (better get used to this in Turkey!)

Qaaolchoura · Posted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 12:47 pm Post subject:

OK, so I'll be certain that I found a way to do it without leaving the country. I'll be certain when my phone is reactivated tomorrow, Sunday, or some time in the indefinite future, depending on what "two days" means.

Step 0: Go to the phone store and wait in line half an hour to buy a SIM card. Try to register it, be told via Google Translate that your entry date is illegible. Don't think to lie about the date. You can skip this if your entry date is legible.
Step 1: Have the service representative write down in Turkish very specifically where you need to go, and what you need to do. After some resistance, use Google Translate on CSR's computer to insist on it. Refuse to leave until CSR does this. It helps if you come in just before closing time.
Step 2: Using WiFi on your phone, go onto Google Translate, and have any phrase that you think you will need translated. You'll miss about 90% of the phrases you think you will need, and half the phrases you do have will be unintelligible to Turkish speakers.
Step 3: Using the vague directions given to you by the customer service representative, go 300 or 400 meters (about half a mile or ~8-10 minutes' walk) in the direction indicated. Show the paper, and a phrase asking "Where's the government office" to passerbys once you've gone about 300 meters. Be told that government office is 300 or 400 meters in the same direction. Repeat as needed Whenever you see what looks like a government office, or a police officer show them the paper, and be told that the office you need is 300 or 400 meters thataway. The actual building will probably be 1.5-2.5 kilometers, though you will walk 4-5 kilometers trying to find it.
Step 4: When you reach a police officer that tells you to go in the opposite direction, go into every building that looks like a government office, and show them the paper, and every phrase you might need.
Step 5: With luck a police officer will eventually point you to a security checkpoint near the right building. Take off your jacket and belt, but are fortunately allowed to keep your shoes on (one point against American bureaucracy). Go to a desk, where they will look at your passport, and the paper the telephone people gave you. Show them any relevant phrases on your phone, which they will examine before returning your phone and passport.
Step 6: The desk people will tell you to go to some floor in another building. Building 2 is likely the right building inshallah, but the wrong floor. The desk staff at that floor will tell you to go to another floor. Repeat as needed.
Step 7: When you see a floor that looks busy, find a back office with police officers at their desks, barge in, and show them the paper. Refuse to leave until they help you.
Step 8: The desk staff will take you to a person who speaks English. Explain your situation. The English-speaker will tell you to get a photocopy of your passport, and an entry/exit petition, write down instructions on a piece of paper, and tell you where to go.
Step 9: The person at the copy shop will understand what to do, and charge you 5 lira for a piece of paper stapled to your passport. Bring it up to the English speaker, who will direct you to the place you need to go. Hopefully the place you barged into uninvited, and not the part with horribly long lines.
Step 10: Sign the paper and get the police you barged in on stamp it. Start to think you're finally done.
Step 11: Try to get an entry exit stamp, and be directed back to the English speaker. English speaker will tell you to go to the "foreigner department," in the otopark, and gesture in the general direction of building 1.
Step 12: Return to building 1 through another door, and marvel that security isn't on this side as well. Argue with them until a friendly bilingual Turk comes along and translates for you. Find out they can't and won't help you, and return to building 2.
Step 13: Ask the English-speaker in building 2 where the office really is. English speaker will write down the Turkish name, and give you more specific directions.
Step 14: The foreigner department actually is in the garage. Learn that despite the fact that it's Thursday and the office isn't closed, they can't help you until Monday.
Step 15: Refuse to leave. Try to argue using your stamped documents and all the papers in the Turkish language you've accumulated to date. Watch as they try to use your phone for Google Translate, and try to communicate through mime, faces, and the Turkish you know that your SIM card won't work, because your phone isn't registered. Sit there while they try to reach whoever it is that can actually do the stamps, and nicely offer you some fruit. Assume that they're merely getting permission to use the stamps, and think things are finally sorted out.
Step 16: The people in the foreigner department will write something on Turkish and direct you back to the floor where the English-speaker is. Show the paper to the English speaker, and try to impress the urgency of the situation.
Step 17: The English speaker will ask if all you need is to register your telephone. Confirm. He will then call down to the foreigner department, and tell you to go back down there.
Step 18: The foreigner department will welcome you back, take your papers, and give you a new paper to give to the phone company. Then they'll give you some more fruit and try to teach you some Turkish.
Step 19: Praise God, Budda, or the invisible pink unicorn that Turks are so nice, and return to the telephone company.
Step 20: Wait again until the person who started to help you yesterday is free. Give her the paper and from her reaction observe she is just as relieved as you are. Ask her about the SIM card and be told you don't need to register the SIM card. Repeat yourself several times while she fills out a wide variety of forms, which you sign in about a dozen places.
Step 21: Ask about the SIM card again and stand there until she opens up Google Translate. Be told through Google translate that it's been registered on your behalf. Hope that that actually means one of those forms was to register the SIM card. (She will have taken a sticker from the packaging and placed it on one of the forms.
Step 22: Ask for the paper you got from the foreigner office back. Be given a copy and told that company policy requires them to keep the original.
Step 23: Wait two days for your phone to be registered. Hope that two days actually means two days.
Step 24: Wonder if that the friendly "see you again soon" the foreigner office gave you has taken on and ominous tone.

The whole process only cost me five lira and about six hours, which as I understand it is pretty good for Turkish bureaucracy. And it's certainly quicker and cheaper than taking a trip to Bulgaria, though during the process I seriously considered throwing in my towel and doing just that.

Major lessons learned:

Regards,
~Q

curious&wiser · Joined: 07 Oct 2011 Posts: 8

Wow I'm impressed! Good job and welcome to Turkey!
Praise be to that pink unicorn it certainly was looking after you!

Qaaolchoura · Posted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 5:04 pm Post subject:

c&w: Thanks.

Right after I posted this, I turned my phone on (it was off because it was charging) and I found I'm connected to the network. So less than a day. Either I got lucky, Avea's exceptional, or Turkcell (based on what I hear) is exceptionable.

Any rate, I'm glad I went with Avea this time. They not only gave me a data plan, they confirmed that I wanted "internet." Whereas the Turkcell guy, in addition to not telling me to register, either didn't understand me or ignored me regarding the same translated phrase I showed to the Avea people, and just gave me a phone plan (and apparently a pretty awful one at that, given how quickly I ran through it).

~Q