Job Discussion Forums

[sharter]

I thought I'd post this on the newbie board and it's just an opinion, so please don't get all hotheaded.

First of all, something about my background. I'm qualified and have been teaching for 16 years. I've taught everyone from beginners to proficiency and everything from YL GE to university EAP. In recent years I've taught exlusively for oil companies because that is where the real money is, especially if you're direct hire. I'm currently in the Middle East again.

Let's start with the positive and probably the obvious. TEFL is great fun and a top way of travelling and meeting new people. You'll have lots of carefree times, often with exotic partners and it may well be just the tonic after 5 years of studying or a career in banking or some other field. You can learn new languages, embed yourself in foreign cultures and catch weird and wonderful diseases. This period, in which it's all so cool, is for many a honeymoon period and life sooner or later gets in the way.
Any newbie getting into this game should be aware of the following facts;
the majority of overseas language outfits are unscrupulous and exploit naive foreign teachers;in many places the owners or managers don't actually care about your pedagogical ideas or learning; it can be a lonely job when you're in some shythole in China for 10 months; the money in 90% of jobs is barely subsistence level; good local salary means abject poverty; organizations can and do keep your passports 'for admin reasons'; when you meet someone and have kids life will become really unaffordable unless you move somewhere or have a working wife....or work 40 hours a week;there is no career; most good posts recruit by word of mouth; an MA doesn't necessarily get you better pay; Saudi unis now pay badly; it's a really hard industry to get out of; many TEFL teachers are plain weird; there are lots of other teachers who want to supplement their incomes proof-reading or doing voice overs; materials writing is dominated by a few big publishing houses; most of the certs and quals you do will be meaningless in the Arab classroom; you might not have proper healthcare and you certainly won't ever get a pension.

Don't do this long-term or you'll be remembering this post in a decade and kicking yourself. I've had 4 teaching gigs in the Middle East and they've all been filled with penniless, older teachers, many divorced with kids in some far off land who regret they day they ever left their original careers. TEFL is a kind of life upside down.

[Glenski]

Without getting hotheaded, can people agree to disagree with what you wrote?

TEFL is indeed a career for some.
Not everyone flits about to various countries.
Not everyone enjoys their time "often with exotic partners" or catches exotic diseases (whatever was meant by that).

I think the statement about "the majority of overseas language outfits are unscrupulous" is overstated.

And "the money in 90% of jobs is barely subsistence level" and "good local salary means abject poverty" are not entirely accurate. It's dependent on country, and maybe for entry level jobs, but take into account that many/most places don't even ask for more than a generic BA degree and no teaching qualifications, so should someone with only that expect more?

"it's a really hard industry to get out of" deserves some explanation, I feel.

Do many/most newbies really know what they are getting into? I would hazard a guess to say no, but that is one reason forums like this exist. If the TEFL biz was more tightly regulated, things might be different, but that's not going to happen, so here we are!

[contented]

The original post is reminiscent of an article I read not too long ago about how horrible the TEFL industry is. I disagree with much of what was said, however I'm not hotheaded about it. Not all employers are unscrupulous and the pay hasn't been "barely subsistence level" in my experience, though it may be for some unfortunate ones. If you are not happy with your position you can always change at the end of your contract.

[sharter]

It's an opinion...I just didn't want the usual rants from the usual suspects telling me what an ahole I am or telling me I'm not a real teacher or assuming I'm unhappy and deranged....my ex-wife maybe but ....

Regarding the abject poverty? well, that certainly covers Europe and North America and since most of my current colleagues have come from Thailand broke I'd say it covers there too. Wages in Japan have not increased during the 16 year period I've been in EFL.

Regarding career? I don't think I'm off the mark. A job is something you do whereas a career has a structure and usually some sort of upward mobility and pay spine, which is all extremely rare in EFL. At the uni level you'll get a local pension and medicare but most of the top jobs are for the locals. At the language school level, becoming a DOS is usually a pitiful step up in terms of salary. In oil companies, the management is always local.

Nope...I stick to my OP based on the evidence all around me of older teachers trying desperately to get out or counting their pennies in a way that borders on the obsessive. TEFL is a really good short-term way of seeing the world and having great expereinces but it's like getting into debt.....fun at the time but hard to get out of. And, you won't always be able to work or depend on the folks.

[HLJHLJ]

So in Europe, for example, entry level jobs for the virtually untrained and inexperienced newbie don't pay well. The places that employ you may have a higher than average number of unscrupulous bosses. There isn't a great deal of career progression.

So what careers are you recommending instead? Which jobs in Europe guarantee an untrained, inexperienced newbie a fantastic wage, great employer, ample opportunities for career progression, etc etc?

If you want to make a lifelong career out of it, it works the same as any other career. Get a proper teaching qualification and head for the International schools or the Unis. If you intend to spend the rest of your life pottering round in the foothills of ESL teaching, then enjoy the benefits that brings and don't expect to make any money out of it. The latter is unskilled labour, and even so, the pay, conditions and job opportunities are still far better than they are for most unskilled labour positions in Europe right now.

[spanglish]

I quite enjoy your contrarian point of view, sharter. Wouldn't you say, though, that many of the washed-up, penniless EFLrs around the world ended up that way due to lack of financial planning and/or the kind of people they were to begin with? A lot of people to whom teaching English abroad appeals to tend to be quite free-spirited. From your other posts, it doesn't sound like you're penniless and it sounds like you've done okay for yourself with ESL, except that you have to live in desolate, hostile environments.

For me, that is the real problem with ESL: the inability to live in your home country and in many cases to live in a very tough part of the (developing) world. That's fine for a while, but after 3 years in Colombia, the crime and all the other things that come with being here have really started to wear on me.

I certainly do see a career ladder here, starting at language schools and ending with a senior teacher position at a good high school, university or the British Council. For me the issue isn't the job or teaching; it's having to live in a far-away land and possibly not having needed skills to get a job back home if you were ever to decide to return.

[Glenski]

No career mobility?

I started in conversation school, went to PT teaching at a private HS, then FT there, and now I'm in university. Of course, if someone doesn't change their credentials and prefers to sit on a BA in anthropology, they will not move up, but that applies to most fields. You are not correct about upward mobility. There are several routes up. Into uni is one way, getting your own business can be considered another, becoming a manager in a school, rising to become a dean (Yes, some have done that even in Japan), going on to become a teacher trainer, getting into the publishing industry, etc., or as HLJHLJ put it, get licensed for international schools It's all how you look at it.

[sharter]

I was teaching at university in 97 and was at the BC in 96........don't turn this into a mine's bigger than yours career contest........

Yep, I'm well-paid, but that wasn't my OP's main point.

[Zero]

The "unless you have an outside source of cash" part is key. If you like living overseas and the jobs you find are low-hours but don't pay enough, develop a sideline. Find something you can do online; supplement your income. Make sure you're taking care of the things adults need to take care: health insurance, life insurance, retirement.

[Glenski]

[Asurai]

OP post is correct on a lot of point but that applies only to people at the bottom of the ladder.What does one expect to get from getting into the education field without the proper cerf(B.ED and the like), no Master , and often no experience.Do you expect to land manager job at a bank or even a high paying job with a BA in political science?

as for salary in Japan, the cost of living has not changed that much therefore the wage stagnation may be due to a lagging economy.I do agree that wages are terrible in Japan though, but that's probably because everyone is ready to work in Japan for pennies.

[naturegirl321]

I kind of agree. A lot of jobs out there are geared towards newbies who are bright eyed and have rose coloured glasses on. They might teach for a year or two, then move on.

However, there are still good jobs out there for those with the proper quals and experience. Maybe they're not advertised as much, since they're found through networking or other channels, but they're out there.

[naturegirl321]

[tttompatz]

I would like to take a moment to differ somewhat without actually disagreeing with the original post.

In my experience and observations, ESL/EFL is primarily populated with 4 classes of people.

1) fresh newbies - may be high school grads with a fresh TEFL or new uni grads looking for a gap year or 2 abroad before they hit the career path.
These ARE transient and are looking for not much more than subsidized travel. The aren't really interested in 40 hour weeks, prep time, etc.
They do their year or two at the entry level and move on.

2) career changers - downsized, made redundant, early retirement, fresh divorce and looking for a change of life. Usually unqualified/under qualified and unwilling to start at the bottom in spite of their lack of formal qualifications.

They may get stuck in it for the long haul due to circumstances. They may or may not do / have done anything to improve their qualifications.

If they don't they firmly fit into the type presented in the original post.
If they do they move into type (3).

3) Career EFL teachers. They started with basic qualifications. They have continued their professional development and there is upward mobility and a reasonable career path (you won't get rich as a teacher (anywhere) but a comfortable lifestyle with decent savings are possible.

4) The odd bunch. They got started in EFL, found it easy, but have become trapped at the bottom end of the scale. They entered at the bottom end, found a nice "job" and stayed for a long time.

Now the job is gone and, in spite of their years of experience, due to their lack of continued professional development and formal qualifications they don't have the "qualifications to move out, up or sideways. Unwilling to stay at the entry level and unable to move. Again, they fit into the model presented by the original post.

There are many variations and shades of grey between the groups but as a whole....

JMHO

.

[sharter]

4 of my last 5 jobs have been with oil companies....the salaries pish on university type jobs for cash....probably not for teaching though.

In 16 years, I've never seen this career people talk about here. People flit from place to place and get good jobs more by luck than design.