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katisaninja
Joined: 09 Dec 2011
Posts: 5
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 Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 10:23 am Post subject: Borderlink: to accept or to reject |
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I recently got accepted for a job by Borderlink. I, of course, have read a lot of negative things about the company, which is why I can't decide whether to accept the job or not. I sent applications to other dispatch and eikaiwa companies but never got a reply, perhaps due to the fact that I'm not a native speaker of English (I'm Filipino). Most of the job ads I saw online specified the companies only want native speakers. 
I have a BA in English from the University of the Philippines and am currently teaching English to Japanese online and to other Filipinos as well. I don't have any teaching certifications as of yet, but I am planning to take the TKT and eventually, CELTA and DELTA, but for now, I only have my degree.
Should I take the risk? I've always wanted to go to Japan and teach, but I'm scared of getting screwed over by Borderlink. Have the working conditions of ALTs employed by the company improved at all?
By the way, they're offering to pay me Y185,000 (before taxes). From what I've read, this is quite low for an ALT job. So... help? |
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rxk22
Joined: 19 May 2010
Posts: 1629
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| Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 10:32 am Post subject: |
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That's really low pay. On top of that, are there pay contract gaps and reduced pay during the holidays?
If it is that rate every month, that's one thing. But if you have some pay cuts, I'd say boo on that. |
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katisaninja
Joined: 09 Dec 2011
Posts: 5
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| Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 10:38 am Post subject: |
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| rxk22 wrote: |
That's really low pay. On top of that, are there pay contract gaps and reduced pay during the holidays?
If it is that rate every month, that's one thing. But if you have some pay cuts, I'd say boo on that. |
They said I won't get paid during summer break.  |
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rxk22
Joined: 19 May 2010
Posts: 1629
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| Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 10:57 am Post subject: |
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| katisaninja wrote: |
| rxk22 wrote: |
That's really low pay. On top of that, are there pay contract gaps and reduced pay during the holidays?
If it is that rate every month, that's one thing. But if you have some pay cuts, I'd say boo on that. |
They said I won't get paid during summer break. |
Oooooh, I wouldn't do it, then. 18k is pretty tight without a massive layoff. Honestly, that is insulting.
Try Interac, my Filipino friend makes 19k a month, and makes 60% of that in Aug, and 70% in Dec. |
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katisaninja
Joined: 09 Dec 2011
Posts: 5
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| Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 11:17 am Post subject: |
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| rxk22 wrote: |
| katisaninja wrote: |
| rxk22 wrote: |
That's really low pay. On top of that, are there pay contract gaps and reduced pay during the holidays?
If it is that rate every month, that's one thing. But if you have some pay cuts, I'd say boo on that. |
They said I won't get paid during summer break. |
Oooooh, I wouldn't do it, then. 18k is pretty tight without a massive layoff. Honestly, that is insulting.
Try Interac, my Filipino friend makes 19k a month, and makes 60% of that in Aug, and 70% in Dec. |
Thanks for the info.  Was your friend hired overseas? 'Cause I tried sending an application to Interact but I didn't get a response. |
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seklarwia
Joined: 20 Jan 2009
Posts: 1546
Location: Monkey onsen, Nagano
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| Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 12:33 pm Post subject: |
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| rxk22 wrote: |
| Try Interac, my Filipino friend makes 19k a month, and makes 60% of that in Aug, and 70% in Dec. |
Is that 190k (I'm assuming you missed off a zero  ) after rent and tax?
@ the OP:
Putting aside the fact you are talking about the most notorious of the dispatch racket, I agree with rxk22 about that kind of pay (and lack there of in the summer).
Figure that you are going to have monthly expenditure of about 125,000 on essentials. That means even if you are living quite frugally, you might only be able to save up to 50,000/month. If they pay on the same schedule as many other employers, you will have only received less than 4 months pay (Likely April will be pro rata and thus only a partial salary) before you end up skipping likely more than a month of pay due to the zero pay for the summer. If you do the maths, you'll see that you will have to save damn hard for the entire time just to make ends meet for that pay break.
So not only will you have a miserable time due to not being able to take part in any form of socialising or leisure activities, but you will not even be able to put aside even the slightest amount to go towards emergency funds for things like should you get sick or need other medical treatment should you have an accident or even need to fly back home last minute.... I would not want to living in constant fear knowing that I wouldn't be able to afford to see a doctor should I be the slightest bit unlucky.
And if you have loan repayments or whatever to make, then you will probably have to choose to either have a roof over your head or food in your belly during that pay gap, because you certainly aren't going to be able to afford both! GIVE BORDERSTINK A WIDE BERTH!! |
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rxk22
Joined: 19 May 2010
Posts: 1629
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| Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 1:30 pm Post subject: |
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| katisaninja wrote: |
| rxk22 wrote: |
| katisaninja wrote: |
| rxk22 wrote: |
That's really low pay. On top of that, are there pay contract gaps and reduced pay during the holidays?
If it is that rate every month, that's one thing. But if you have some pay cuts, I'd say boo on that. |
They said I won't get paid during summer break. |
Oooooh, I wouldn't do it, then. 18k is pretty tight without a massive layoff. Honestly, that is insulting.
Try Interac, my Filipino friend makes 19k a month, and makes 60% of that in Aug, and 70% in Dec. |
Thanks for the info. Was your friend hired overseas? 'Cause I tried sending an application to Interact but I didn't get a response. |
Yeah, he is from Luzon, and was hired from there. Maybe they just aren't hiring that much right now. I don't know how it works, but I have heard that they have quotas for how many Filipinos they can hire.
You can always reapply. Don't get too discouraged. A lot of people went home after the quakes, and so a lot of new people were hired to replace them, so this year may not be a big hiring year. Who knows?
To seklarwia, yeah I meant to write １９万、but ended up doing it the other way. Didn't want to confuse the ts with kanji, so I confused em with being wrong.
Yeah, as for pay, you'd prolly be breaking even. Def not saving much if anything. So, you prolly can't go home or on vacation during the holidays.
Only way I'd take that job, would be if they truly treated it as PT. Where you can come in late, and leave early. Which would make a second job easy to do. |
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katisaninja
Joined: 09 Dec 2011
Posts: 5
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| Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 1:56 pm Post subject: |
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| rxk22 wrote: |
| katisaninja wrote: |
| rxk22 wrote: |
| katisaninja wrote: |
| rxk22 wrote: |
That's really low pay. On top of that, are there pay contract gaps and reduced pay during the holidays?
If it is that rate every month, that's one thing. But if you have some pay cuts, I'd say boo on that. |
They said I won't get paid during summer break. |
Oooooh, I wouldn't do it, then. 18k is pretty tight without a massive layoff. Honestly, that is insulting.
Try Interac, my Filipino friend makes 19k a month, and makes 60% of that in Aug, and 70% in Dec. |
Thanks for the info. Was your friend hired overseas? 'Cause I tried sending an application to Interact but I didn't get a response. |
Yeah, he is from Luzon, and was hired from there. Maybe they just aren't hiring that much right now. I don't know how it works, but I have heard that they have quotas for how many Filipinos they can hire.
You can always reapply. Don't get too discouraged. A lot of people went home after the quakes, and so a lot of new people were hired to replace them, so this year may not be a big hiring year. Who knows?
To seklarwia, yeah I meant to write １９万、but ended up doing it the other way. Didn't want to confuse the ts with kanji, so I confused em with being wrong.
Yeah, as for pay, you'd prolly be breaking even. Def not saving much if anything. So, you prolly can't go home or on vacation during the holidays.
Only way I'd take that job, would be if they truly treated it as PT. Where you can come in late, and leave early. Which would make a second job easy to do. |
Oh wow, thanks.  I've finally made up my mind. I'm gonna reject the offer and try applying for a position in Interac instead. I just realized I haven't completed my application with them (the essay part XD). Thanks a lot for the info! |
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katisaninja
Joined: 09 Dec 2011
Posts: 5
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| Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 1:59 pm Post subject: |
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| seklarwia wrote: |
| rxk22 wrote: |
| Try Interac, my Filipino friend makes 19k a month, and makes 60% of that in Aug, and 70% in Dec. |
Is that 190k (I'm assuming you missed off a zero ) after rent and tax?
@ the OP:
Putting aside the fact you are talking about the most notorious of the dispatch racket, I agree with rxk22 about that kind of pay (and lack there of in the summer).
Figure that you are going to have monthly expenditure of about 125,000 on essentials. That means even if you are living quite frugally, you might only be able to save up to 50,000/month. If they pay on the same schedule as many other employers, you will have only received less than 4 months pay (Likely April will be pro rata and thus only a partial salary) before you end up skipping likely more than a month of pay due to the zero pay for the summer. If you do the maths, you'll see that you will have to save damn hard for the entire time just to make ends meet for that pay break.
So not only will you have a miserable time due to not being able to take part in any form of socialising or leisure activities, but you will not even be able to put aside even the slightest amount to go towards emergency funds for things like should you get sick or need other medical treatment should you have an accident or even need to fly back home last minute.... I would not want to living in constant fear knowing that I wouldn't be able to afford to see a doctor should I be the slightest bit unlucky.
And if you have loan repayments or whatever to make, then you will probably have to choose to either have a roof over your head or food in your belly during that pay gap, because you certainly aren't going to be able to afford both! GIVE BORDERSTINK A WIDE BERTH!! |
 It's really scary, especially since this is my first time going abroad. I was also worried about not being able to save and send money back home to pay off debts I might incur if I do push through with my application. Thanks for your help! |
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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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| Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 11:31 pm Post subject: |
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That amount of pay is barely subsistence wages. Combine that with the many negative things you have heard, and you should already know what to do.
Most people get paid 220,000-270,000 yen/month. For decades (and up until about 5 years ago) the standard accepted wage was 250,000. Five years ago, employers (especially ALT dispatchers) started offering less pay because there is no legal minimum wage in a technical sense. Legally, you are supposed to get what Japanese teachers do in equivalent positions, but not a lot of people call employers on this. |
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rxk22
Joined: 19 May 2010
Posts: 1629
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| Posted: Sun Dec 11, 2011 7:27 am Post subject: |
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katisaninja, one last thing, I think Borderlink in some cases doesn't pay for your transportation.
At least Interac does, despite how much hate they get ( I don't work for them now), they do pay for transportation. |
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quixote
Joined: 12 Dec 2011
Posts: 3
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| Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 8:20 pm Post subject: |
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Based on the letter of acceptance I've read, I do know that BorderLink is offering at least 220,000 to other applicants.
OP: Did you look over your letter of acceptance for a "service bonus" amount? In the letter I read, the service bonus pushed the salary up to the range shown in their advertisement (21万円 ~ 24万円）
While I don't want to hijack this thread, I am curious what others' experiences have been in regard to negotiating salary offers with ALT dispatch agencies. Is this an option for applicants like the OP? |
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cat mother
Joined: 22 Sep 2009
Posts: 62
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| Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 9:02 pm Post subject: |
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I also know that Borderlink is offering higher salaries to other applicants who are native speakers.
At all my previous companies, Filipinos (and other non-native non-European looking people) were getting paid substantially less. So this may be the case here, too. |
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seklarwia
Joined: 20 Jan 2009
Posts: 1546
Location: Monkey onsen, Nagano
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| Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 9:55 pm Post subject: |
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| quixote wrote: |
| OP: Did you look over your letter of acceptance for a "service bonus" amount? In the letter I read, the service bonus pushed the salary up to the range shown in their advertisement (21万円 ~ 24万円） |
Assuming that what cat mother posted isn't true (although I'm inclined to believe her that that could be happening in this case, too), based on posts by people who have worked for Borderlink, I know they have a tendency to find reasons to not pay bonuses. So I would advise people not to assume that they will get any bonuses in full each month.
Besides even if he did get that bonus and received 210,000, that doesn't change the fact that the OP will not receive any pay throughout the summer. Other companies pay at least partial salaries during the breaks... very important when you consider that depending on the placement location, the summer could be anything from 3 weeks up to almost 2 months!
So the issues I outlined before still stand, especially since the OP has already said he will need to send money back home to cover debts that he will incur from moving over here.
| Quote: |
| While I don't want to hijack this thread, I am curious what others' experiences have been in regard to negotiating salary offers with ALT dispatch agencies. Is this an option for applicants like the OP? |
Negotiate? With dispatch companies?
No way! You take what they offer graciously or they ditch you and make an offer to one of the next 100 applicants that are queuing in the wings. With people so desperate to come over and the crappy job situations in many of the countries that we come from, even companies making the lowest offers have waitlists.
Newbies have zero negotiating powers. And even employees who have put in their time run the risk of losing their job (and possibly the jobs of every other dispatch ALT working under their BOE regardless of their company) everytime they bring up the prickly subject of pay or benefits. You need to remember that dispatch companies are in it for profit; not for educational reasons. They would rather pay less to somebody who is able to do the minimum to keep the BOE satisfied, rather than pay a little more to a super teacher who knows their stuff and may go in with big ideas that disrupt the status quo and possibly loses them a contract or few. So they certainly aren't going to pay more to an unproven newbie just because they asked.
And don't assume that the BOE is going to be on your side either since they too want to spend as little as possible and realise that if the company pays you more, they are undoubtedly going to have to pay more as a result. You can see the BOE mentality towards ALTs in some of the unbelievably poor job offers they occassionally post for direct hire positions. Many BOEs don't care all that much for ALTs who they only bring in because MEXT forces them to, so they want to pay as little as possible and would rather have a 3rd party involved who can easily replace the ALT at a drop of the hat should they not be too keen on the current one.
Basically ALTs are expendible to their dispatcher; doubly so for the BOEs. |
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