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[billy orr]

Well, sash, a good question. Difficult to be sure. I know people always say that others are cheating but...

I cannot see how the actual exam score can be manipulated (apart from by copying in the exam itself, which is actually quite difficult given the precautions that are in place). The papers are machine marked, in theory at least no human hand touches the papers between collecting in and the computer regurgitating the results in their various combinations and rank orders from number 1 to 2 million. And the computer places students in departments in a similar way. Maybe I am naive, but I am reasonably confident the entry into the state universities is done according to performance in the exam.

On the other hand there may be manipulations taking place where people's opinions are included in making the selection. That would include selection for Masters programmes and admission of 'foreign' students into the state universities for example. And of course, admission to the private universities may not be as transparent as to the state universities.

But I am always impressed with the fairness of selection processes, especially considering the social practices that can be found in wider society, for example in selection for jobs.

But I remian to be enlightened on this subject, if anyone can tell me how the jiggery pokery might be done.

[Sashadroogie]

That's fair enough. However, I suspect, though I have very little real basis for this admittedly, that no matter how many machines are involved, the human factor will always find a way to bypass them. For example, in IELTS, scores have to be entered manually into the database by an administrator of some kind. It doesn't take much on that administrator's part to simply enter in the desired score should the administrator have a material benefit in doing so. Sure, there is a minor risk of being found out, and the actual test papers and other documents may not match the entered data, but if nobody is actually looking..... And clerical error is a great excuse too.

I imagine that something similar could be in operation outside of IELTS. I have always believed that this was standard practice in Turkey, though, again, I admit I have no concrete evidence of any sort to back this hunch up. Could be totally wrong. Would like to believe so.

[billy orr]

That's interesting. But isn't it only the ielts speaking and writing marks that are dealt with locally? Aren't the reading and listening papers sent to UK for marking? How could an administrator in UK manage to bump up the scores for one particular candidate?

As for the �ss, the exam is a single multiple choice paper marked entirely by machine, so no administrator needs to collate marks. Presumably is possible to get into the computer system to deal with appeals or check for computer marking errors, and to locate the marks for specific candidates, so that might be a way to cheat, but if that were being done on a large scale I am pretty sure someone would grass them up.

And last year there was the famous algorithm scandal, but that is rather complex and belongs on a separate thread.

[Sashadroogie]

As far as I know, all IELTS papers are marked locally, even the clerical marking, though I am not absolutely certain about that. So, it is surprisingly easy to manipulate.

The reason why I am fairly sure all marking happens locally is because if the subjective scores seem to high or low re the absolute scores, then the system alerts the administrator to a possible mismatch, and possible examiner error. Writing and speaking are then blind-checked by another examiner. But all this happens so fast that I can't see papers being flown back to Australia or the UK. Exam takers are promised their results in two weeks remember, unlike Cambridge where it takes much longer.

The mind boggles at the potential security issues, and indeed I seem to remember various scandals in Australia last year related to this very matter. So, the OSS, it seems to me, would be at least as likely if not more so to be open to possible abuses from within the system by the higher-ups. It would not be the only institution in Turkey to suffer from this...

[_smaug]

I�ve heard test scores aren�t manipulated, identification is manipulated, and that native speakers can earn up to 4,000TL impersonating an IELTS or TOEFL candidate. One simply shows up at the test center, presents the provided (fake) I.D. and takes the exam.

All hearsay, of course, but that�s what I�ve heard.

[Sashadroogie]

More of a Chinese problem that. It is really so, so much easier just to get the admin to fiddle the scores than to go through the whole impersonation routine and invite possible detection and or costs to effect your fraud.

[Dedicated]

I'd really like to know how "identification can be manipulated" considering each IELTS application must bear a passport photo of the candidate.
I've heard of students trying to take exams for others, but never native-speakers taking IELTS/TOEFL exams for students.

[_smaug]

[Dedicated]

Sorry if I'm labouring a point, but the ID is a passport, and the passport must match the passport photo on the application form.

[_smaug]

[sohniye]

I was just reading through this thread...

[billy orr]

None of the above persuades me that cheating is widespread, neither for the local nor the international exams.

Personation is very hard to do, invigilators check faces on id and impersonators do get caught and thrown out. As for putting somoene else's photo on a Turkish id, that is an incredibly serious offence, it is not worth risking prison just to get a higher exam grade. As for native speakers standing in for 4000TL, given the risk it would surely need to be much more than that. A teacher caught doing that would find it difficult to work again anywhere decent. And getting any old native speaker off the street to sit ielts for you? I doubt if someone like Wayne Rooney would find it very easy to get a 7.

Inequalities in Turkey are addressed to some extent, I do not believe the UK or US are better at dealing with inequality. For people trapped in private kolej, lise or private university prep schools, Turkey probably seems much more elitist than it actually is. Turkey is a big, diverse country, and foreign teachers need to get out more into the real Turkey.

[Sashadroogie]

Billy Orr, I hope you are right. It is just hard for me to believe it is so, seeing as so much else in Turkey seems to be less than transparent and straight, and based on personal, tribal connections etc.

The ID manipulation thing is a red herring on this thread. For an IELTS situation, it really only occurs in China. This is so because, at risk of a racial slur, foreign IELTS examiners have a hard time matching the candidate's face with the face on the ID, or detecting a mismatch. Hence the FBI-style ID fraud training that is sometimes part of the IELTS training. However, this is not something I could see happening in Turkey. Conditions are different.

[PC Parrot]

Yes .. I had to attend a facial-recognition session given by the Australian immigration department ..

Apparently, you look at the ears first ..

[gloomyGumi]