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canadianinuae
Joined: 24 Sep 2011
Posts: 30
Location: Al Ain
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 Posted: Fri May 06, 2016 3:33 am Post subject: |
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| nomad soul wrote: |
| rosalind wrote: |
A major goal for me is to finish paying off my debts and save as much as possible. My needs are fairly simple, and I can live pretty frugally. So this seemed like a great opportunity to me.
....
This discussion of the cost of housing (and the up-front requirements!!) are really making me rethink whether it's worth it. If housing will eat up half the salary, then it might make more sense, after all, for me to look to KSA, where at least housing is included. |
You'll definitely be able to save in KSA. |
Was looking at ksa. The offers aren't as good as a few short months ago even. Seems the oil situation has had one major effect. Some jobs for males are well paying, but out in the middle of nowhere. |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Fri May 06, 2016 4:32 am Post subject: |
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| canadianinuae wrote: |
| Was looking at ksa. The offers aren't as good as a few short months ago even. Seems the oil situation has had one major effect. Some jobs for males are well paying, but out in the middle of nowhere. |
It is what it is. However, compared to the UAE, the cost of living in KSA is lower and the benefits are better. If you want top pay in the Gulf, consider beefing up your qualifications. |
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canadianinuae
Joined: 24 Sep 2011
Posts: 30
Location: Al Ain
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| Posted: Fri May 06, 2016 4:08 pm Post subject: |
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| nomad soul wrote: |
| canadianinuae wrote: |
| Was looking at ksa. The offers aren't as good as a few short months ago even. Seems the oil situation has had one major effect. Some jobs for males are well paying, but out in the middle of nowhere. |
It is what it is. However, compared to the UAE, the cost of living in KSA is lower and the benefits are better. If you want top pay in the Gulf, consider beefing up your qualifications. |
Yes, I realize Saudi is considerably cheaper. And I didn't say I was looking for myself re, Saudi. It was for a friend who was wondering how they compared, but thanks again for that tip about qualifications  |
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rosalind
Joined: 02 Oct 2005
Posts: 28
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| Posted: Sun May 08, 2016 4:59 pm Post subject: |
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| oceanbound wrote: |
| rosalind, my husband and I have been exploring too what it's like to work & live in the UAE, following an invitation to interview with an MOE job in the northern emirates. |
As I said earlier, I'm glad to have found this thread. I've been doing more digging and I am curious: _Does_ anyone have, or know where to find, more information from or about people living this on the ground? I am really wondering about my apparent inability to Google the experiences of people currently in this programme. (Is the programme, in fact, brand new? Can anyone point me to some other keywords I might be able to use to find folks discussing life in this job? Surely they must exist _somewhere_.
oceanbound, if you don't mind my asking: You say you've already had your interview(s)? What (if I may ask) has the timetable been like for you? Have you received an offer, and are trying to decide; or are you still waiting to hear from the MOE, and, if so, how long has it been (and did they give you an estimate of when you should expect to hear back)?
Regarding the eternal rent/ upfront costs/ cost-of-living question: I also wrote to my recruiter (perhaps also your recruiter! Who knows?) with this question. She replied:
"When candidates are doing their own research they have found www.dubizzle.com useful. On average a one bed place appears to be 5,000-6,000 AED, which leaves 75% of the 21,000 AED Tax Free (you earn a month) in your pocket, after you have paid for your accommodation. I hope this is useful.
"As I said before you need to be flexible and 'go with the flow'. I know that some people prefer everything exact and I don't think that's the best suit for this position and obviously we want people to be happy and settled, but you need to think what would suit you best."
Hmm.
Finally, I attempted to also gather some numbers from this site:
https://www.expatistan.com/cost-of-living/dubai
"Cost of living in DUBAI, United Arab Emirates
"Monthly rent for 85 m2 (900 Sqft) furnished accommodation in EXPENSIVE area:
Dirham 8,929 ~= USD $2,431 (this would be ~ 107,000 AED/yr)
"Monthly rent for 85 m2 (900 Sqft) furnished accommodation in NORMAL area:
Dirham 6,897 ~= USD $1,878 (this would be ~ 82,800 AED/yr)
"Utilities 1 month (heating, electricity, gas ...) for 2 people in 85m2 flat:
Dirham 677 ~= USD $184
"Monthly rent for a 45 m2 (480 Sqft) furnished studio in EXPENSIVE area:
Dirham 6,687 ~= USD $1,820 (this would be ~ 80,200 AED/yr)
"Monthly rent for a 45 m2 (480 Sqft) furnished studio in NORMAL area:
Dirham 4,815 ~= USD $1,311 (this would be ~57,800 AED/yr)
"Utilities 1 month (heating, electricity, gas ...) for 1 person in 45 m2 (480 Sqft) studio:
Dirham 489 ~= USD $133
"Internet 8MB (1 month):
Dirham 306 ~= USD 83 "
This looks like 2x+ more than the costs you found searching on Dubizzle and Property Finder, but of course these costs are for Dubai, not the Northern Emirates.
I will say that it troubles me considerably that -- as far as I gather -- teachers don't know where they'll be placed until _after_ they sign the contract. Is that right? So one has no idea whether one is looking at paying Dubai prices, or non-Dubai prices, until _after_ one has signed on? I must say, that seems a little... troubling... to me. I mean it's an enormous financial consideration, isn't it? Is it really reasonable to ask people to go into this blind in that way? o.O
Or am I overreacting? Do I need to "go with the flow," as the recruiter said?
I really just wish I had more information on this, since I have to decide whether to make this initial financial investment in flying out for the interview in the first place. ... |
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mrpianoman
Joined: 27 Mar 2016
Posts: 171
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| Posted: Sun May 08, 2016 5:35 pm Post subject: |
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| and how much does it cost to 'move in' to an apartment in UAE? How much do you actually need to pay upfront to move in? I heard you might need to pay 6 months rent in advance. Is this true? |
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dragonpiwo
Joined: 04 Mar 2013
Posts: 1650
Location: Berlin
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| Posted: Sun May 08, 2016 5:38 pm Post subject: erm |
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I'm in the UAE now.
If you get posted in Abu Dhabi, it's even more than Dubai.
PM me. |
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rosalind
Joined: 02 Oct 2005
Posts: 28
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| Posted: Sun May 08, 2016 6:08 pm Post subject: |
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dragonpiwo, thank you! I will.
For the particular program that I -- and I believe oceanbound and husband -- are considering, there seems to be no chance (no risk? hm) of being posted to Abu Dhabi. (I don't know if mrpianoman is looking into the same program, or something different.)
According to the recruiter I'm talking to:
"You have to be flexible on a Northern Emirate location, which includes Ajman, Dubai, Fujairah, Ras Al Khaimah and Sharjah (Excludes the emirates of Abu Dhabi and Al Ain). - You are allocated an Emirate nearer the time but you can live in another Emirate and commute to work, that's fine."
I take it that Abu Dhabi itself has a different program (ADEC? The alphabet soup confuses me). That program seems to require a national teaching license, whereas the MOE one in question, apparently, does not.
I don't seem to be able to discern the actual _name_, if any, of this MOE program. (Again per the recruiter:
"The Contracts are for 2 years, but renewable - on going. ... The Programme is a huge on going programme with the MOE UAE. ... Below is some information on the organization based in the UAE who are looking for English Classroom Teachers (Grades 8 to 12) for a project within MOE Schools throughout the UAE [...]" )
The only link she gave me was this one: https://www.moe.gov.ae/english/pages/default.aspx/
, from which I really can't find any helpful information. |
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oceanbound
Joined: 14 Apr 2016
Posts: 5
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| Posted: Sun May 08, 2016 6:10 pm Post subject: |
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| rosalind wrote: |
This looks like 2x+ more than the costs you found searching on Dubizzle and Property Finder, but of course these costs are for Dubai, not the Northern Emirates.
I really just wish I had more information on this, since I have to decide whether to make this initial financial investment in flying out for the interview in the first place. ... |
The majority of the MOE project positions are in the five emirates north of Dubai, only very few are in Dubai, according to our recruiter. (And yes, this is a new project so we won't be able to find people who are already working in that context.) Given the small possibility that we'll end up in Dubai, we've been focusing our research on the other emirates. So, rosalind, yes, the costs in Dubai can be considerably higher, and it does seem like it'll be very difficult to save with higher rent and higher cost of living.
I don't know if people will be asked to sign a contract before knowing where they'll be posted. I certainly hope that won't be the case. If we somehow get assigned to Dubai we probably won't sign.
We haven't gotten the interview results, and the interview was a week ago. The exam was easy if you prepared according to the recruiter's directions (they sent out an email a few days before the interview explaining what to expect and how to prepare), and the interview was short with three very friendly MOE reps. If you did your homework you'll have no problem.
| mrpianoman wrote: |
| and how much does it cost to 'move in' to an apartment in UAE? How much do you actually need to pay upfront to move in? I heard you might need to pay 6 months rent in advance. Is this true? |
According to other threads in this forum, the move-in cost or "startup" cost can be hefty in Dubai and Abu Dhabi. I imagine it'll be the same if you choose an unfurnished property. Dubizzle lists many furnished 1BR properties in the five emirates north of Dubai that are within the 35k-50k range, which is much lower than unfurnished properties in Dubai and AD. In the northern emirates, at least as it appears on Dubizzle, the rent payment situation greatly varies, from 1 year upfront, to 6 months, to quarterly payments. Even monthly payments are available though rare. |
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rosalind
Joined: 02 Oct 2005
Posts: 28
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| Posted: Sun May 08, 2016 6:23 pm Post subject: |
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oceanbound, thank you, that's very helpful. (It sounds as if your recruiter is more informed and/or responsive than mine.)
Re the up-front rental costs: According to my recruiter, "... as have a government contracts banks have offered 2-3% loans and some Teachers have taken that option and just paid their rent for the year."
I find something a little unpleasant about asking teachers to take out an interest-bearing loan, even at low interest, to pay their rent. But I suppose it seems like one option. |
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oceanbound
Joined: 14 Apr 2016
Posts: 5
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| Posted: Sun May 08, 2016 6:30 pm Post subject: |
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| rosalind wrote: |
I don't seem to be able to discern the actual _name_, if any, of this MOE program. (Again per the recruiter:
"The Contracts are for 2 years, but renewable - on going. ... The Programme is a huge on going programme with the MOE UAE. ... Below is some information on the organization based in the UAE who are looking for English Classroom Teachers (Grades 8 to 12) for a project within MOE Schools throughout the UAE [...]" )
The only link she gave me was this one: https://www.moe.gov.ae/english/pages/default.aspx/
, from which I really can't find any helpful information. |
Here is the info from our recruiter, sent along with instructions for the interview:
[quote="rosalind"]oceanbound, thank you, that's very helpful. (It sounds as if your recruiter is more informed and/or responsive than mine.)/quote]
I think you may receive much more information from your recruiter when you're further along into the process. We didn't get this info until a few days before the scheduled interview.
I think given all the information from various sources, if your goal is to save and pay off debt, Korea/China may be a better bet. The UAE/MOE situation just seems fraught with uncertainties that could prove disastrous (or spectacular.. but it could go either way). Plus, if for one reason or another (uncontrollable students, unreasonable commute--I can't believe they'll ask teachers to commute between emirates to work!) you leave after the 6-month probation period, you'll be back to job search again. This could potentially cost you if you have to sell furniture at lower price than was purchased for, and I don't know if the contract ends early if return flight will be paid by the school/MOE.
Much more info is available about various opportunities in Korea and China, so it's much more likely that you'll be able to settle into the job and focus on making & saving money.
Even with the uncertainties already in this stage of the process, my husband and I have not ruled out UAE because we don't have debts on our shoulders, so we could potentially weather the financial setbacks if the job doesn't work out and end after just 6 months. But if we accept the offer--if we are given the offer--we'll go to the UAE being fully aware of the possibility that the job may not work out. |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Sun May 08, 2016 6:37 pm Post subject: |
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| rosalind wrote: |
I will say that it troubles me considerably that -- as far as I gather -- teachers don't know where they'll be placed until _after_ they sign the contract. Is that right? So one has no idea whether one is looking at paying Dubai prices, or non-Dubai prices, until _after_ one has signed on? I must say, that seems a little... troubling... to me. I mean it's an enormous financial consideration, isn't it? Is it really reasonable to ask people to go into this blind in that way? o.O
Or am I overreacting? Do I need to "go with the flow," as the recruiter said?
I really just wish I had more information on this, since I have to decide whether to make this initial financial investment in flying out for the interview in the first place. ... |
You forgot to add costs for household items (possibly appliances) and airfare over breaks/holidays as well as monthly food, cell phone, satellite tv (optional), and ground transportation expenses.
Keep in mind, the recruiter works for the MoE and not you. If you sign on for this 2-year contract, they get a commission, so of course they'll tell you that living and saving on that the salary is quite doable.
Frankly, if you expect to save a chunk each month but have to list out your specific budget this tightly, then you need to look elsewhere for work. |
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oceanbound
Joined: 14 Apr 2016
Posts: 5
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| Posted: Sun May 08, 2016 6:47 pm Post subject: |
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| nomad soul wrote: |
| You forgot to add costs for household items (possibly appliances) and airfare over breaks/holidays as well as monthly food, cell phone, satellite tv (optional), and ground transportation expenses. |
In one of the five northern emirates, would the following breakdown of costs be reasonable? Assuming renting a furnished 1BR apartment at 45k/yr (which seems standard in RAK, Sharjah, and Ajman).
Salary: 21,000
Rent: -3,750
Utilities: -1,000
Transportation: -600 (taxi)
Gym: -200
Food: -2,000
Saving: 13,450 AED/month
This doesn't take into account travel costs during breaks, assuming this is for someone focused on saving.
I'm basing most of the figures on cost of living in RAK (http://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compare_cities.jsp?country1=United+Arab+Emirates&city1=Dubai&country2=United+Arab+Emirates&city2=Ras+Al-khaimah) |
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Neilboy
Joined: 05 May 2016
Posts: 7
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| Posted: Thu May 12, 2016 4:35 pm Post subject: |
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| Anybody knows how long the security/visa clearance lasts for? I've been waiting for almost 6 weeks now. I completed interview and got a pre-contract that I had to fill out and send back (through my agency, although they've said already that they're not informed about anything until the visa clears). Is this typical? |
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canadianinuae
Joined: 24 Sep 2011
Posts: 30
Location: Al Ain
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| Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 8:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Neilboy wrote: |
| Anybody knows how long the security/visa clearance lasts for? I've been waiting for almost 6 weeks now. I completed interview and got a pre-contract that I had to fill out and send back (through my agency, although they've said already that they're not informed about anything until the visa clears). Is this typical? |
All i can say is...if you're smart you won't do it...BIG mistake ..trust me! |
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steve cactus
Joined: 06 Mar 2015
Posts: 1
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| Posted: Sat May 28, 2016 2:41 pm Post subject: |
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| canadianinuae wrote: |
All i can say is...if you're smart you won't do it...BIG mistake ..trust me! |
Big mistake?? Please enlighten us. |
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