Job Discussion Forums

[jb1980]

I suppose a brief introduction is in order as this is my first post. I’ve just finished my CELTA and also have Bachelor of Arts and Bachelor of Laws degrees (I graduated from university 10 years ago). I currently work in property management but also have experience in sales and have worked in the wine trade.

Based on my education and employment history what are my chances of getting employment teaching English in Warsaw. Ideally I would like to teach business English or other type of ESP, but would be happy to teach general English to get my foot in the door.

I’m curious as to what rate of pay I could expect and whether I could expect to have a decent standard of living. NB my wife is from Warsaw and we are building a house there so won’t have rent or mortgage payments to worry about. I see a lot of people claiming they don’t earn enough to live when teaching in Warsaw but I do wonder why they say, for example, 5-6k zloty is impossible to live in when I know Poles in Warsaw who earn that much and have a decent standard of living. I currently live in London where of course the rent and cost of living are sky high. By my calculations when I factor in the fact I’ll have no rent or mortgage to pay I could very well be better off in Warsaw than I am here and at the minimum, no worse off. I’m curious to hear your thoughts on this.

[dragonpiwo]

OK, here goes. If you work ONLY for a language school, it will be a struggle and you will be poor. If you are prepared to build up your privates and teach a lot of hours and or proof read etc, you will have a modest but enjoyable life. If your wife works as well, you'll be comfortable.

It might be worth looking into teaching legal English as a usp.

Poland is cheaper than London but about the same as northern England re prices. Having no rent to pay is a real boon. I regularly contend that anything under circa 5,000Zl a month net will not afford you an adult way of living.

Of course, you can live on less if you like parowkas, kebabs, barely drink, go Dutch when dating, don't own a car, have no kids and share a flat, live in a kawalerka (studio) and buy your clothes in C and A or Tesco.

[simon_porter00]

And now the other side:

I have a house, live on the outskirts, kid, 2 cars, have to commute and have mortgages of 500K+ etc etc and I would consider a take home salary of 10k net a month means you'll have an easy life, covering all mortgages, bills, food and fun money.

You'll have no mortgages, just bills to pay and your family issues are your own affair - with no kids (assumption) and a car (as living in a house you'll most likely be on the outskirts) I would say a take home salary of 5k net is more than enough (taking into account 'normal' lifestyle choices, you may of course want more/less). This is easily achievable through teaching working for a school as long as you put the hours in.

60zl per hour is the average in Warsaw for a noob.
60 x 25 clock hours a week teaching (4 hours a day, M-F)= for 4 weeks is 6k. Minus 19% tax (s you'll want to set up your own company) = 4860 for 4 weeks. Minus the ZUS payments (Social security) which you'll have to pay which for the first 2 years are reduced - approx. 400zl means a take home before bills of about 4.5k.

(Of course private lessons etc are cash in hand and of course you can have 10 hours of those a week too.)

After a year (or sooner), once you have got your own privates/clients which you can bill because you're a company, you can charge them 80-100zl (or even more as I did) for 60 min. The game then changes:

25 x 80/100 = 8000/10000 for 4 weeks work. Suddenly life gets a bit easier.

This is not taking into account your wife's salary/expectations.

Bearing in mind you'll be travelling (I'm assuming you'll be commuting as you house is probably on the outskirts) you'll want to find blocks of classes in the morning/afternoon/evening asap. That way you can do the 4/5 hours teaching back to back and not waste time in-between lessons bumming around. Luckily in Warsaw, there are a lot of in-company lessons that'll let you do that.

So:
Life in Warsaw without rent/mortgage is easy
Life in Warsaw with rent/mortgage is still easy
If you are a waster/drunk/idiot/loon/student-type/hippie or have expectations such as dragonpiwo anywhere in the world will be expensive, so don't worry.

If you have life skills/vocational skills try to use them asap to your advantage.
Set up a sole-tradership and then you can find your own clients and off-set office space/internet/phonebills/gas/water/electricity etc in your house for tax purposes
Be patient at first, learn your trade, then build up your own clientele.

If you've build a house anywhere near Ozarow Mazowieckie, then give me a shout as I've built my house nearby.

[Master Shake]

jb1980, both posters have offered you accurate and valuable advice. My only sticking point is with what dragonpiwo wrote about - working for language schools = being poor. Some language schools do pay quite well and are worth looking into (the British Council, Akademia etc.). This is especially true when you first arrive and want to take on a lot of hours quickly, even if the rate of pay isn't fantastic.

[dragonpiwo]

I don't know you Simon, so please tell me what my expectations are.

[dynow]

[Master Shake]

Mission Accomplished, dynow. Your reputation precedes you.

The biggest chunk of your time off, the summer months, don't have to be as grim as you paint them. You can work more, especially in Warsaw.

Summer camps, intensive courses, special teaching projects and privates have kept me very busy this summer. I'm actually making more in August than I would during the rest of the year. I don't think Simon's struggling either.

Sure, it's a bit challenging to find this stuff unless you've been here a while, but there is demand for teachers in the summer, mostly because so many native teachers go back home for the summer, like you used to.

[dynow]

[Richfilth]

I did my usual straight-7 hour shift at a company today (seven 60-minute sessions back to back), followed by an hour's private student and then back home before 5pm for an hour's translation and proofreading. That's 900zl earned today - more than enough to compensate for the loss of wages I'll see on Thursday from the national holiday.

To tide me over the long weekend I've got 180 pages to proofread, six CVs to translate and I turned down a 200-page translation job worth about 5000 zlots because I simply don't have time - I'm too busy making money in the dead summer months dynow likes to moan about so well.

Come to Warsaw. You can live perfectly well if you have an ounce of business acumen.

[dragonpiwo]

Dynow's right about holidays though. People do need time off to recharge and Easter, Christmas, winter break and the summer are bummers re earning. Just about all the language schools close, the camps pay peanuts and your business English clients go on holiday themselves.

The vast majority of of TEFLers don't go to Poland to work 10-hour days Rich....but as you say...it's perfectly possible.

[simon_porter00]

Dynow:
I'm not going to argue with your numbers, seems good to me and a believable representation of what could happen.

I would soften the blow of the (potential & possible) 3& half months by saying it'll happen over the course of the year so with careful management you can work around this - take on 1/2 more students for example, get students to pay for the month in advance etc. Challenges are challenges and all that

Dragonpiwo:
I'm not going to tell you what your expectations are as I have no right to do that. You earn you money and you have the right to spend it how you wish and all power to you - the same goes for me.

Anyway, I'm not going further down this road as there are many other threads on this that have been hi-jacked. The OP was about "is it easy/possible/whatever to live in Warsaw?" The answer is yes.

[Master Shake]

[dragonpiwo]

Agreed Simon...re the OP, the answer is 'YES'. My life is expensive because of choices I make. I like taking the missus out for a good meal and a bottle of wine. I like staying in nice places on holiday. We do run a car and along with the rent I have child support to pay. I have substantial savings, BUPA health care and free dentistry and will bite the bullet re a pension this year. Long-term, these are other things that need to be thought about.

For me the stability of my present job is key. The stress of the hustle in Poland is something I neither enjoy nor need. Doing what I do has simplified my life and although working where I work is ok the rotation is 2 weeks too long in my book. I'm interviewing for a job soon that will give me 6 months off a year. I turned one down in Iraq in Feb because while the money was great, no-one could tell me how long the contract was for. Here, should I want and or need it, I have a job for life and get to spend a lot of free time in Poland where I can and do live in style. My son wants for nothing that is realistic .

[dynow]

shake wrote:

[Master Shake]