Job Discussion Forums

gerard · Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Posts: 581 Location: Internet Cafe

Going with my FAO next week to get a bank acct. She says at Bank of China the ATM cards are only good in issuing province. Is that true? It sounds odd. So we will go to the Agriculture Bank or something. Would be an odd thing to lie about but I am always suspicious...I thought B of C was the best one for wire transfers etc...I travel here though so I need a card good in all PRC>

Also what about these US $ accounts people talk about on here. Do you need 2 accts or is it like home acct A and B??? This might be good instead of walking around with US hundreds all the time. I assume you can only deposit what your contract says you can. (Mine is 30% which bugs me since with overtime I could save a lot more.) Anyway if a person stayed a few years can you just walk in and take out the eqvnt of -say- 60000 RMB and say have a nice day??? Or are there a lot of catches---better to wire it away???

Last is there a good bank for expats. Is the steel bank better than the farm bank or whatever??? Thanks in advance...

Roger · Joined: 19 Jan 2003 Posts: 9138

If I remember correctly, you are in or near Guangzhou, right? In my opinion, there is no difference between the Agriculture Bank of China and the BOC. The former also hosts offices of Western Union, but you can't use WU to carry your cash out of the country.
I have some very good experience with the BOC branch in the Friendship Store next to the Baiyun Hotel (opposite the Garden Hotel), on Huanshi Donglu. Its opening hours are in line with those of the store, and their staff are relatively competent.
They run foreign-currency accounts. I once withdraw 24'000 HK$ without giving them prior notice, and I had no problem. I guess if you tell them by phone you want to withdraw a large amount of your own American dollars they will ready that money for you!
You can open a foreign-currency account just about anywhere, the only drag is that you must deposit a minimum amount that you cannot buy from the bank.
In your case, it would perhaps be advisable to make a trip to Hong Kong or Macau and buy HK dollars, then convert them into the currency of your choice there!

noyb · Joined: 22 Feb 2003 Posts: 93

Yes, basically bank ATM cards are only good within the province that you opened the account in. However, that is starting to change. Ask your FAO to help you get a bank Visa debit card. Those are able to be used all over China.

At most of the major banks, you can get one passbook which encompasses various currencies. This does not mean, however, that your accounts are a mechanism for exchanging currency.

I have yet to see any limitations on how much you can deposit and withdraw. Although things may have changed, because of terrible results obtained when wiring money through Bank of China, I'd find an alternative to using them. I have had great results using HSBC in China to transfer funds to HSBC in Hong Kong.

gerard · Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Posts: 581 Location: Internet Cafe

Hmmm. I'm near Hangzhou actually so HK is a bit of a trip. A lot of a trip. On the ATM issue I think my FAO will steer me right-been great so far.

The thing is this . At the moment I am saving more than I can legally convert. Can I stuff my pockets and go to HK. A pal here said he actually went home (USA) with a bunch of RMB and got rid of it. I suppose a solution will present itself. I suppose having a bunch of cash -no matter what the currency- is not a big problem.

noyb · Joined: 22 Feb 2003 Posts: 93

In theory, carrying out more than x amount of RMB (I'm not sure what the limit is, but something on the order of 8,000 RMB) is not allowed. However, I haven't heard of any foreigner being stopped and searched for excess cash. So, odds are you can do it without worry.

Roger · Joined: 19 Jan 2003 Posts: 9138

noyb,
please update me on the HSBC status in Guangzhou: Is it a "branch" or a "representative"? How did you manage to wire money from there to HK? Did you open a bank account there? Was that possible, when?I am asking because one yar ago, this was NOT possible due to the status of HSGBC as a "representative office of a foreign bank".

MyTurnNow · Joined: 19 Mar 2003 Posts: 860 Location: Outer Shanghai

I'm happy to assure you that China has the finest banking the 1940s can possibly offer. Oy.

It is true that most banks' ATM cards can only be used at ATMs in the same province. You can go to the window in the same bank anywhere. This seems to depend on location and is gradually changing. Just last night I was rather surprised to be able to use my old Jilin province Construction Bank card at an ATM in Jiangsu province!

You can use the Ag Bank/Western Union to send dollars to a bank in the USA. I think this ONLY applies to the USA. I The last I heard the limit was something like $1500-2000. It's the cheapest and easiest (legal) way to send funds out that I've found yet. Fortunately you don't have to have an account there to use it.

I suggest you avoid The Bank of Mei-You and its siblings (ICBC, Ag Bank, Construction Bank) and instead explore the private banks. I'm now with Bank of Communications and so far it seems a lot better. Its ATM cards usually work in the ATMs of other banks; only ICBC has given me problems with it.

Good luck,
MT

juneinchina · Joined: 17 Mar 2003 Posts: 9 Location: Guangzhou, CHINA

According to this article money can be sent OS from China through China Post:
QUOTE: Deutsche Bank has signed an agreement with the State Post Bureau of China, or China Post, to process electronic international money transfers in US dollars and euros. The deal sees China Post connected to Eurogiro, the global electronic payment network operated by post offices worldwide.
Up until now China Post's 150 million retail clients have been limited to transferring and receiving cash from overseas parties through a tie-up with Western Union which has been in operation for 18 months. But the new deal with Deutsche Bank will allow them to transfer money electronically from account to account.
ref: http://www.financeasia.com/articles/728DE831-9DEC-11D6-81E40090277E174B.cfm

I haven't tried it yet, but I'm about to... will let you know how I go.

June

MyTurnNow · Joined: 19 Mar 2003 Posts: 860 Location: Outer Shanghai

June,
is this up and running yet, or just agreed? This would be great...

One other note on ATMs...have you noticed the fees for many out-of town ATM withdrawals? It can be dreadful...something like 10%!!! They don't exactly shout this at you when you sign up, even if you speak Chinese, so check it out.

MT

noyb · Joined: 22 Feb 2003 Posts: 93

Never seen a 10% fee on any out-of-town ATM withdrawls. I know that banks are now in the initial phases of allowing their ATM cards to be used outside of the province where the account was opened.

Bank of Communications is not a private bank. It is 100% state owned and finding branches in even big cities can be challenging.

Regarding HSBC, it is a qualified bank. In Guangzhou you can open a foreign currency account. In Shenzhen you can open both RMB & FC accounts. Shanghai is the same is Shenzhen. You can use HSBC China's online banking (online@hsbc) to wire your FC to any bank for a fee much less than the normal wire transfer fee (at this time 100 RMB). I usually wire from China HSBC to Hong Kong HSBC. The transfer costs me 100 RMB and has never taken more than one working day to arrive in Hong Kong. Note: they say that the online@hsbc transfer fee of 100 RMB is promotional so I'm not sure when, if at all, the cost will increase.

Transfer from Hong Kong using online@hsbc to any point in the world is HKD 100 and has been this way for the past 5 years.

arioch36 · Joined: 21 Jan 2003 Posts: 3589

I see we can continue to argue about HSBC until the cows come home. My personal opinion, if I have more RMB then I need, I just ask my FAO to "help" me out. money changing isn't really black, just grey. All my FAO's have helped me convert RMB into dollars. Or ask a Chinese friend. In Qingdao, we were followed into the bank by a money changer, offering slightly better rates then the official bank. The money changer was wiling to wait in the bank while the money was deposited to make sure the money was legit.

gmat · Joined: 27 Jan 2003 Posts: 274 Location: S Korea

Roger, NOYB et al.

FYI the Dalian "office/branch" of HSBC only offers FC accounts, and not RMB (visited them last week).

noyb · Joined: 22 Feb 2003 Posts: 93

GMAT: So far on the Mainland, only Shanghai and Shenzhen offer RMB accounts.

MyTurnNow · Joined: 19 Mar 2003 Posts: 860 Location: Outer Shanghai

Noyb,
I have seen very high fees. Not quite 10% but still pretty stiff. The 10% warning came from my foreign liason, who occasionally gets one right. I simply suggest that people be aware and find out what their cost is.

You are absolutely right on the ownership of Bank of Communications. Despite my impression they ARE state-owned; thanks for reminding me to do my research.
But I'm fairly close to Shanghai, where they are based, and at least in the cities in this area there's a branch about every 3 meters.

MT

noyb · Joined: 22 Feb 2003 Posts: 93

Yeah, I just found out (though not the hard way) that the day before yesterday a new banking policy went into effect in Guangzhou. If you use Bank X's ATM card to withdraw money from any other bank's ATM there is a 2 RMB service fee on a maximum withdrawl of 2,500 RMB.

However, if the Bank X is China Construction Bank, the fee is 5 RMB.

Not sure, but could this possibly be in all of China and not just Guangzhou?