Job Discussion Forums

[richtx1]

I'm updating my little booklet for Mexico City teachers. "Minority" TOURISTS give me mixed information on their experiences. Any African-American or Black Canadian teachers out there?

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[Ben Round de Bloc]

What about black teachers from Cuba, Jamaica, Belize, and Africa? I've known black teachers from all of those places here in La Rep�blica de Yucat�n. I now teach with a guy who's black and was born in Holland.

[moonraven]

I am teaching with a guy from The Congo. He and I have had a few chats about racism. I am Native American and because of my coloring and mistaken for an Anglo--and I can say that racism does exists in some of these little Oaxacan towns. Some folks are not conscious of it--but I am not shy about describing exactly what they said or did that was racist.

[richtx1]

... maybe I wasn't as clear as I should have been. The audience for my little booklet are people from "first world" countries who are a little overwhelmed coming to Mexico. I appreciate hearing from those teachers from other English-speaking countries, like Nigeria, Jamaica, Belize, etc.

I'm not sure the experiences and challenges faced by a "third-world" person are the same as those from the "first world" countries. In other words, "black" Americans and Canadians are Americans and Canadians first, and arrive with the same cultural baggage that "white" Americans and Canadians do. My brother worked in Kenya several years ago, and was bemused when African-American co-workers complained about the Africans -- the Africans saw them as gringos (... or whatever the Kiswahili equivalent of that is) and the "black" guys had just as hard time adjusting to Kenya as any other American worker.

moonraven -- I have to admit I hadn't considered the question of "Native Americans" working in Mexico. If you'd like to email me about any specific issues I need to consider, I'd appreciate your observations.

[moonraven]

Many of us Natives--woowoowoo--are taken for Mexicans. Especially if we speak decent Spanish.

[schely10]

I�m a Black American female working in Guadalajara. Are you only interested in people working in the DF?

In Guadalajara, it seems as if the locals have never seen a Black person before. I receive plenty of stares all the time. The guys yell out "Morena" all the time also. I have been here for about 3 months now and I am used to the stares. I dont know if they know that it is very rude to stare at someone. I can understand the children, they dont know any better, but the adults are worse than the children. Once, I visited the zoo and felt as if I were one of the animals! More people were looking at me than the animals!

There is also another Black female here too whose complexion is very dark and a guy called her "blacky". I have also been called "Negrita", but I dont think they meant anything negative by it. Ive been told that "Morena" and "Negrita" are terms of endearment, but I dont know.

[delacosta]

Everyone calls me guero, even sometimes guerito! Can you believe it!?
We used to have a teacher here that would get extremely offended because people called her guera, even more offended when they called her gorda!
But you know ,she was a fat white lady...I like that about Mexicans, they call it as they see 'em. My girlfriend's family all call each other gordo/gordito/a. I often call her morena.
You know the saying- I don't care what you call me, just call me in the morning...

[thelmadatter]

schely - I think the Mexicans dont mean any harm in calling us "morena" "negra" or "guera" especially when the "ita" ending in on it. Im dating this guy who almost constantly calls me "Se�ora Guerita" in the most deferential of tones. He is a really really sweet guy and I really like him but it does grate on my nerves at times. Although I know he feels he is complementing me - sometimes I feel that maybe Im some kind of "trophy"? Sheesh I hope not!

Ive also gotten a lot a compliments on the fact that I have green eyes. Seems to be a big thing for a number of guys here.

As for the stares - yeah probably pure curiousity. My best friend came down here once and she is a natural blonde. A guy I was dating at the time (not the guy above) really fawned over her. At dinner he leaned over just to get a chance to touch her arm. He told me he had never been that close to someone of her color before. She got freaked out cuz she thought he was hitting on her, but fortunately I knew him well enough to know what he was up to.

But I know not all attitudes are so benign. "moreno" is usually associated with indigenous people and I know Mexican attitudes here about that can be kind of sad. (But I got to say, Ive seen some guys with really strong indigneous features that were quite HOT! and exotic --- so I guess Im just as guilty at gawking at what Im not familiar with either eh?)

[saraswati]

[Ben Round de Bloc]

[saraswati]

Sweet of you to say that, Ben, but I grew up in Santa Fe, NM where most people have green or brown eyes, blue being that anomality and I never had anyone get in my fact the way they do in Mexico. It's probably got to do with the definition of personal space, which is culturally defined. It's also more common for men to shout out their admiration down here too.

[moonraven]

If your personal space is invaded it's because you lack what is called "presence" here.

When customs are different, and some of them cause you discomfort, you need to develop and project your own rules. A large percentage of body language is universal. Someone whose body language indicates insecurity and vulnerability is going to have his/her personal space invaded almost constantly. If you project that you expect folks to keep a respectful distance, they will.

[saraswati]

Moonraven, I neither solicited your advice nor intimated that having my personal space invaded was still a problem. You also imply that I have no "presence" and lack self-confidence. What a presumptious, aggressive person you are.

Your response is why, unfortunately, many hesitate to post on this forum. They later find themselves having to explain to you what was obvious to the rest.

[moonraven]

Saraswati--Thanks for over-reacting and insulting me--seems to be your typical MO. When you have your own ESL site you will be able to legislate in regard to who posts there.

I was merely giving the same kind of advice or survival tips that are commonly given in travel books and people's guides to countries. Have you seen contradictory kinds of advice?

The "you" in my post was a "you plural"--referring as well to other previous posts. Although we are writing in English here, and not in Spanish where it would have been clear, I thought that it was obvious.

[saraswati]

I insulted you? To coin YOUR phrase, this is precisely your MO. You constantly insult and offend people but when someone responds in kind you cry foul.