Job Discussion Forums

[VisualSyntax]

Does anyone have POSITIVE experiences in ESL schools in Russia?

I'm currently looking through possible jobs, and using this board as a research base, and I have to say that I'm getting scared b/c I have yet to find anything positive.

I'm looking for a school that is NOT in Moscow. Personally, I hate the city, couldn't see myself living there, and don't want to deal with the living expenses. I found information on the Serendipity school in Vladimir, which sounds fantastic. Does anyone want to burst my bubble on this?

If anyone has info on schools that are not in Moscow, I'd love it. I was an AFS exchange student to Yaroslavl, know the language passably well, and am really looking forward to returning to Russia.

[spiral78]

While I'm not wildly experienced in Russia, having done just one project based in Moscow, I think there might be a sort of general thing I could say regarding ESL schools.

Private language schools universally offer a way to GET STARTED in a region. Except in a few parts of the world where the demand for teachers is really high, private schools pay subsistence wages across the board.

If you really want to be in a region for more than just a year, a private language school gig is a good way to get going, but to have anything really worthwhile long-term, you'll need to build a local reputation and contacts, and use them to work your way into jobs that offer better pay and security.

So, if you look at it as a way to get in and get started, then the less-than-stellar wages and benefits get put into a different perspective.

[BELS]

[quote="VisualSyntax"]Does anyone have POSITIVE experiences in ESL schools in Russia?

I'm currently looking through possible jobs, and using this board as a research base, and I have to say that I'm getting scared b/c I have yet to find anything positive.

I'm looking for a school that is NOT in Moscow. Personally, I hate the city, couldn't see myself living there, and don't want to deal with the living expenses. I found information on the Serendipity school in Vladimir, which sounds fantastic. Does anyone want to burst my bubble on this?

If anyone has info on schools that are not in Moscow, I'd love it. I was an AFS exchange student to Yaroslavl, know the language passably well, and am really looking forward to returning to Russia.[/quot

First of all , what are you looking for, if you are not looking for Moscw. Obviously you want to be ripped off by some employer. Well go ahead.

It's also useful if you could give us some links to know what you are talking about. I found this, is that what you are talking about??

http://www.serendipity-russia.com/engculture.htm

[zeke0606]

You are all right!

I have lived and taught in Ufa, in the heart of Russia, for eight years. I believe that Russians have no idea about legal contracts, as they break then for any reason and at any time - private school or univeristy - it really doesn't matter. You are a foreigner and have NO legal rights there. Now I am a resident and I now have legal rights - so the schools are a lot more careful about their contracts and who they hire. If you don't have the correct visa or work permit or tax ID or or or --- I will go see my friends at immigration and report the school -- that amounts to a 500,000 ruble fine. I believe in a little payback once in a while.

That advert for Serendipity School is great if you want to live on a stipend and with a Russian family...............................


Zeke

[VisualSyntax]

[zeke0606]

What is wrong you ask ---

If you do this, you give the Russian schools one more reason to lower salaries and not give any benefits to 'real' teachers. Before you were a student and now you want to lower the standards for professional teachers.

So it is not much I guess, as I think of you as a typical packpacker type.

[BELS]

[ecocks]

Incredible negativity folks. Let's all lighten up a bit.

It is what is. The Serendipity program looks reasonable to me, IF that is the type of gig you are looking for. If you are comfortable with a room in someone's home, which is particularly attractive to those wishing to work on their Russian, and if you can clarify that the stipend is a livable amount, then it seems reasonable. I would suggest You take the TEFL before you go over there though and I would try to contact some of the former teachers.

Alternatively, consider some other areas - Ukraine is equally good for the Russian and we aren't nearly that negative.

[sukoma]

In the spirit of the original post, let's PLEASE hear some actual positive experiences. It seems no matter what the post is about, these all start to sound the same after a while.

I currently work here in America for the typical public traded corporation which lays hard working people off so the CEO can get a raise (or known as tightening the belt) and sends jobs to China...so getting screwed around isn't exactly going to be a new experience for me. I've been back-stabbed, thrown under the bus, and lied to myface...if that isn't quality preparation, I don't know what is. Maybe a lot of you have only worked in education (which is a world unto itself), but I don't know too many career paths that don't involve a fair amount of BS in some way.

I've got a job and am heading over in September (unless disaster strikes). Before accepting this, I corresponded with several schools and was able to filter out the garbage. I've been to Latvia, Russia and Ukraine several times and have a fair idea of how I will be treated (if not by the schools, at least by the average person living there)...AND I DO HAVE A FEW BACKUP PLANS.

I have a pretty realistic view of what to expect and what to hope for based on this and other posts and like the originator of this chain, I'd really appreciate hearing some of the positives of working in Russia...there must be some as it seems there are plenty of people posting here that either currently work there or have worked there in the past. Beyond the girls and the fur hats, there has to be a reason why people still want to go there (not to mention their economy is actually growing). Let's here some good stuff and not just bad.

Thank you...

[rusmeister]

FWIW, Sukoma, (in an attempt to explain the "negativity"), career teachers have a lot of resentment towards "backpackers" - people who just come for a year or two to "teach" and then move on, kind of like locusts. Career teachers in places like Russia, China, or whatever, know that it is very difficult for most westerners to handle stays significantly longer than your average tourist trip, so to that extent, the negativity is an honest assessment/warning of problems. One thing backpackers don't care about is that they have an impact on the market, just as migrant workers in the US bring salaries down to minimum wage and below for something that would otherwise be reasonably well-paid. A great many of the career teachers have a lot of teaching experience, which means they bring and offer a quality product. Backpackers bring only eagerness and excitement, but are generally clueless as to HOW to effectively teach the present perfect verb tense or articles, or what the specific problems, say, Russians have and how to overcome them, never mind things like awareness of psychological attitudes and effective use of student interaction in a classroom, etc etc. (It is true there are exceptions, and a small number of backpackers do become career teachers but I'm talking about the rule.) But because a market environment can't recognize quality in teaching - it takes years for results to become obvious - they wind up seeing pay offers reduced to the minimum wage offered to the backpacker. The backpacker flips his lid over difficulties of living in Russia and leaves 6 months later, or sticks the year out and leaves, only to be replaced by another at all the McSchool language mills that make out from this situation. The people learn poor-to-mediocre English, but don't know where else to turn. The career teachers can't advertise themselves as if they were a big business, so have to sew together their own businesses or turn to the McSchools for the same conditions offered the backpackers.

Is it any wonder then, that career teachers should not cheer the arrival of more backpackers?

Of course there are positive experiences in teaching in Russia, or we wouldn't be here. But the difficulties are real, too, and should not be underestimated. And if you see a glowing report of how wonderful things are, it is probably from a representative of a McSchool that wants you to come and help keep teacher pay low.

If you hang out on the site, you will pick up occasional positive reports. Just don't expect lots of them.

[zeke0606]

rusmeister -

Thank you so very much! Now back to the slaughtering of backpackers!
Just joking!!!!!!!

[canucktechie]

[GF]

To Sukoma. I hear what you are saying about corporate culture back in the states, but the problems one can run into in Russia can be things totally beyond one's experience. For example, another American was working at a private school with me (they pay better than language schools). For various legitimate reasons, he decided to quit before the end of the school year. Since the school sponsored his visa, the director promptly cancelled it with the result that someone from FSB (internal security) showed up at his flat and told him he had 72 hours to leave the country. Now he had a flat with a one-year lease (with the subsequent deposit paid), a live-in girlfriend (also American) who had a job and couldn't just pick up and leave, many possessions that were next to impossible to arrange the shipment of on such short notice (and to where?), plus the cost of getting last minute travel arrangements. He didn't realize the consequences of his actions until it was too late. Most people don't.

[zeke0606]

dear sensitive Canada reader, canucktechie ----

I have the feeling that you are missing the point of our discussion. Real teachers should expect a living salary and at one time Russian schools provided one. However, with the fly-by-nighter backpacker taking any salary offered, the russian schools have lowered the standard for salaries. And this lowered salary standard is below liveable - maybe not for Russians as they will usually have a dacha and lots of family suport. But foreign teachers - the real ones that want to stay - can not exist on substandard salaries that the backpackers have created by their acceptance of no benefits and lower salaries.

Not to mention that the real teacher brings real teaching experience and understands how to teach English. The usual backpacker can somewhat speak English, but lacks any idea of how to communicate the use of idioms or articles or even English prepositions so that the Russian students can actually learn something. After the backpacker leaves and a real teacher comes in --- then the unlearning starts and the students are now totally confused and the real teacher must teach to undo and redo the language that the backpacker so skillfully and totally confused .

[zeke0606]

GF

That canucktechie sounds like the poster child for a McSchool or a recruiter for one.

Zeke