|
Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Students and Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
iwonder
Joined: 21 Jun 2008
Posts: 7
|
 Posted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 12:58 pm Post subject: Private/separate schools |
 |
|
Are the requirements the same for teachers at both public and private schools?
I don't have a teaching certificate, how likely is it for me to find a position at a private school teaching English? |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
eslstudies
Joined: 17 Dec 2006
Posts: 1061
Location: East of Aden
|
| Posted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 1:54 am Post subject: |
|
|
If you're teaching minors, public or private, you must be qualified and registered.
Language schools catering for adults are different: no registration, and each school will spell out it's own qualification requirements. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Def
Joined: 09 Sep 2007
Posts: 58
Location: London
|
| Posted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 9:10 am Post subject: |
|
|
| iwonder wrote: |
| I don't have a teaching certificate, how likely is it for me to find a position at a private school teaching English? |
The short answer: You won't.
The informative answer: You can't work in a public or private primary/highschool without having teaching qualifications (here the choice is out of 4-year Bachelor of Education course, or a 3-year degree, then the 1-year Graduate Diploma of Education). Either path qualifies you to teach in public or private schools.
As eslstudies said, you then have to be registered in the state you're wanting to teach in - can't speak for anywhere else, but in WA that means registering with WACOT first, and then with the DET. This in turn means you can only teach in the state you're registered in. If you want to go interstate another year, you need to register again in whatever state you're going to. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
eslstudies
Joined: 17 Dec 2006
Posts: 1061
Location: East of Aden
|
| Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 6:24 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
| This in turn means you can only teach in the state you're registered in. |
Registration transfers across the states pretty easily now. I know South Australian reg., which is also good for Queensland, covers NZ and Canada. Additionally, I didn't have to jump through any hoops to teach in the UK. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Def
Joined: 09 Sep 2007
Posts: 58
Location: London
|
| Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 11:31 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Yah... I only looked at going from W.A back to Vic, and that's not too bad if you're already registered in W.A. Some mutual agreement thing. I'm just sick of dealing with registering in one state at the moment, let alone two. Heh. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
iwonder
Joined: 21 Jun 2008
Posts: 7
|
| Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 4:18 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Strange cause I have a 3 yr BA in history, a graduate diploma in corporate communications and a TESL certificate and the principal of a school in WA said this will suffice to teach primary level subject English. They said they'll help me get my teaching certificate.
Dunno legistics, but I start in August. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Def
Joined: 09 Sep 2007
Posts: 58
Location: London
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 2:46 am Post subject: |
|
|
| iwonder wrote: |
| Strange cause I have a 3 yr BA in history, a graduate diploma in corporate communications and a TESL certificate and the principal of a school in WA said this will suffice to teach primary level subject English. They said they'll help me get my teaching certificate. |
How depressing.
Is that at an actual... school-school, if you know what I mean? Like a state/public K-12 type of school? Or more like a language centre?
Do you know if you need to be registered with something called WACOT?
Oh, and just out of curiosity... do you know what district this will be in? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
iwonder
Joined: 21 Jun 2008
Posts: 7
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 4:08 am Post subject: |
|
|
Depressing? That sounds rather unkind.
It's at a small private elementary school, not a language institute. Btw, I taught highschool English and ESL at a school in Canada.
I have no idea what region it's in. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
keitepai
Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 143
Location: Istanbul
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 4:16 am Post subject: |
|
|
| eslstudies wrote: |
| Quote: |
| This in turn means you can only teach in the state you're registered in. |
Registration transfers across the states pretty easily now. I know South Australian reg., which is also good for Queensland, covers NZ and Canada. Additionally, I didn't have to jump through any hoops to teach in the UK. |
Are you sure that you don't need to apply for registration with the New Zealand Teachers Council as well??? When I left NZ this was absolutely required for all school and state kindergartens, provisional registration then full after completeing an advice and guidance programme. I have never heard of the NZ Ministry of Ed accepting other countries teacher reg. Maybe I've been away too long!!
I was also required to register as a teacher in Australia (Queensland) before taking a position even though my NZ registration was current. Istanbul is a different story though - nobody cares too much about it!! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
eslstudies
Joined: 17 Dec 2006
Posts: 1061
Location: East of Aden
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 5:25 am Post subject: |
|
|
| A bit like a driver's licence I guess. You need to go through the process and pay the fee. Checking with the Teachers' Reg Board wherever you are/want to go should provide the answer. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Def
Joined: 09 Sep 2007
Posts: 58
Location: London
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 8:35 am Post subject: |
|
|
| iwonder wrote: |
| Depressing? That sounds rather unkind. |
Maybe so. But it's in attack of educational standards, more than yourself. I would never expect a 'school' (as distinct from language centre, etc) here to hire someone who didn't have teaching qualifications, be it from Australia, or in their home country. It's nothing to do with you personally. It's just strange, considering this is what I'm dealing with at this very moment in time, and it's been made quite clear by several governing bodies that you must be qualified and registered. If there's some loophole I find it strange, and yes depressing, because I feel slipping standards is ultimately the demise of education.
| iwonder wrote: |
| It's at a small private elementary school, not a language institute. Btw, I taught highschool English and ESL at a school in Canada. |
Okay, so how did you teach in a Canadian highschool without qualifications? Do you not need something? Is there no course that people do to 'become' teachers? This isn't meant to sound 'unkind', I really just don't know the system there. But if you have some sort of teaching qualification there, it'd make more sense why you'd be able to teach here. For instance, I could go and teach in the UK with my Australian teaching qualifications. That's fine.
But your original post was just a statement about not having a teaching certificate, which is what puzzles me about allowing you to teach here. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
illegalme
Joined: 19 Sep 2007
Posts: 13
Location: Melbourne, Australia
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 9:28 am Post subject: |
|
|
| iwonder wrote: |
Strange cause I have a 3 yr BA in history, a graduate diploma in corporate communications and a TESL certificate and the principal of a school in WA said this will suffice to teach primary level subject English. They said they'll help me get my teaching certificate.
Dunno legistics, but I start in August. |
You may be getting shafted here. It would be unusual to start in August for any positions because most teachers start at the beginning of term 1, 2, 3, or 4 (of course not always, but it seems very unusual to recruit especially for an August start).
Also, there is no such thing as a 'Primary level subject English' teacher in any state in Australia. All primary school teachers are generalists, except for physical education, music, Languages Other Than English (LOTE) and Art.
You should research this employer thoroughly, it may simply be a tutoring centre, not an actual registered school, and if this is the case you will not be working fulltime, and you won't be considered a 'teacher'. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Def
Joined: 09 Sep 2007
Posts: 58
Location: London
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 11:26 am Post subject: |
|
|
| illegalme wrote: |
| You may be getting shafted here. It would be unusual to start in August for any positions because most teachers start at the beginning of term 1, 2, 3, or 4 (of course not always, but it seems very unusual to recruit especially for an August start). |
Heh, ah, that's a very good point. Everything I need to do for registering at the moment spans several August cut-off dates, so anything that says 'August' doesn't surprise me at all at the moment. But yes, typically, August would be a bizarre time to start teaching in a 'school' (presuming we all know what I mean by that now). Term 3 in W.A starts on July 22.
Having said that though, there are teacher shortages in rural areas in W.A, so knowing what district you (OP) are in would probably help make more sense of an August start, if you're actually at a school. If you're in the Pilbara or Kimberly district for instance, in a rural school, it may be plausible that they'd accept you whenever.
But this is all still very strange. You must be registered with WACOT (West Australian College of Teaching) before you can teach in a W.A classroom - whether it's a public, independent, private, etc school. And there are 3 categories to choose from, when registering, if you want to be a teacher - all 3 require you to have teaching qualifications. However, you can apply for Limited Authority To Teach if you have specialist skills... I have no idea what constitutes that, though.
Regardless, none of what you're saying sounds at all consistent with the qualifications you have to have/processes you have to go through, to be allowed to teach in W.A... so I can really only pose the question: are you certain it's a school?
If you want to PM me the name of it, I can help find out exactly what it is, if you're not sure. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
iwonder
Joined: 21 Jun 2008
Posts: 7
|
| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 1:53 am Post subject: |
|
|
Thank you all for your concern, but I am quite sure that everything legit. The position is with the same network of private schools that I taught at here in Canada.
My employer mentioned that they will ensure I get my teaching cerfiticate, perhaps this means registering me as an unqualified substitute instructor or assistant until I can complete whatever I need to via internet.
I'm sure you feel like the standards of education are going to pot in WA with my addition to the workforce, but I intend on getting certified. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Def
Joined: 09 Sep 2007
Posts: 58
Location: London
|
| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 4:57 am Post subject: |
|
|
| iwonder wrote: |
| The position is with the same network of private schools that I taught at here in Canada. |
If that's the case, then it may simply be a chain of language schools, which isn't the same thing as a 'school' in Australia. You would be perfectly entitled to work there. You haven't really explained to us just what type of place it is you're working at. If it isn't just an 'Australian K - 12 school', then none of what we're saying is relevant.
Certainly none of what I'm about to say.
In case it is a regular AU school though, I'll go ahead and reply with this, then leave it be.
| iwonder wrote: |
| My employer mentioned that they will ensure I get my teaching cerfiticate, perhaps this means registering me as an unqualified substitute instructor or assistant until I can complete whatever I need to via internet. |
For reference, this 'certificate' is called the Graduate Diploma of Education - Dip Ed for short. Might want to check that's what they're talking about. Secondly, you can't register as any of those things. The closest you could register as, as I mentioned, is with Limited Authority To Teach. This is the description of that, as given on WACOT's site:
A person who has specialist skills or holds a completed teaching qualification that does not meet the requirements for registration as a teacher, and who bas been offered employment as a teacher may be granted, in conjunction with a prospective employer, a Limited Authority to Teach.
I'm also unaware of any Uni here running the Dip Ed via the internet, but I guess that's all relevant to personal situations, so I won't comment further on it.
| iwonder wrote: |
| I'm sure you feel like the standards of education are going to pot in WA with my addition to the workforce, but I intend on getting certified. |
That isn't exactly what I said. That isn't what I said at all, in fact. As I stated, it wasn't a personal attack. Again, you haven't been clear on what sort of place you're working at, so we're responding to you with fairly limited information at hand. If you're working at a K-12, ordinary ol' 'school', without being registered at WACOT or having suitable teaching qualifications, I can assure you this isn't 'legit'. In that event, I didn't mention a word about your own ability or skills, merely what that might say about education in Australia. There is a reason you have to have a B.Ed or the Dip Ed to teach here first, and a reason you have to be registered. Personally, I don't think expecting teachers-to-be to have a high level of education themselves is a bad thing.
Regardless, to work at a regular school in W.A., be it public, private, etc, you must be registered with WACOT, and depending on the situation you may also require a Working With Children Check. Which you can find out about if you google 'working with children check wa'.
If you could tell us specifically what type of place you're working at, I could offer more information. Until such time though, I think that's about all I can suggest, and assure you it's all quite accurate. Given the bizarre proportion of people who get upset at replies that simply don't fit in with their plans, WACOT and WWCC's can both be researched online if you think any of this is me just trying to upset any ambitions you might have. (Not saying you are, just on the off-chance.) |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
This page is maintained by the one and only Dave Sperling.
Contact Dave's ESL Cafe
Copyright © 2018 Dave Sperling. All Rights Reserved.
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
