Job Discussion Forums

[MO39]

I have been following the discussions on this forum with great interest, especially regarding the job outlook in Madrid for non-EU passport holders. (I have one from the USA) Do reputable language institutes pay both legally and non-legally hired teachers the same rates of pay, if their qualifications are comparable? Friends of mine who live in Spain (Spaniards and legal residents) have warned me that if I work without papers, I might be treated badly, receiving lower pay than those with papers and subject to arbitrary treatment, not to mention being ineligible for health insurance.

I am considering moving to Spain at the end of August to look for work for the term that begins in October.

Thanks for your help.

Marsha

[Mouse]

I think your friends have given you fair warning: all of that is quite possible. In my town, two American teachers just had their hours (and they're paid hourly, so their pay, too) cut in half, with no chance to protest other than walking out. Sad.

[MO39]

Mouse,

Thanks for the unwelcome but useful information.

MO

[leby26]

What on earth do you mean by saying Mouse's advice was "unwelcome" ??- didn't you post in order to get replies??

[gsbcn08080]

Most Americans I know get paid the same as Europeans, I don't know of any schools that have one salary for Americans and one for Europeans. The post did not explain why those guys got their hours cut, I think that since there's plenty of work in Spain if a school is happy with you they will not cut your hours the only thing I have noticed is that Americans get more hours outside the schools ( teaching in companies etc). But of course you will not get any health insurance, neither would I if I worked in USA with my British passport.
About not being able to do anything if your hours are cut, I don't think I could do much myself If mine were cut or If I didnt get paid since the teachers that worked in Opening, Brighton, Oxford etc, did not get paid for 6 months and there is not much being done either. They actually don't think they will get any of the money they owe them.This is Spain it has good things but I suppose work is one of the bad ones.

[johnslat]

Dear leby26,
My reading is that the reply was "unwelcome' in the sense that it contained some rather discouraging news. I don't believe MO39 was implying that he/she didn't want to know the facts, just that Mouse's information was rather distressing.
Regards,
John

[MO39]

Dear John,

Yes, that's right. I meant "unwelcome" in the sense of "discouraging". Thanks for interpreting my message in the spirit in which it was sent. I do appreciate gsbn's informative message and any others that I may receive on this topic.

Mil gracias,

Marsha

[Mouse]

Well, um, I certainly didn't take offence at the comment, but thank you to leby26 for the defence, and to johnslat for confirmation of what MO39 had meant. As gsbcn08080 (my mission to mention every person posting on this thread continues) said, I didn't explain why the two teachers had their hours cut (the school just lost a company contract, which comprised half of their hours), but what I was commenting upon was the fact that because they were employed illegally, neither of them had any legal recourse, nor effective means to address the balance. MO39 said that [without legal papers] "I might be treated badly, receiving lower pay than those with papers and subject to arbitrary treatment, not to mention being ineligible for health insurance" and I agreed that indeed she might, which I stand by. Which I've managed to say in about as unclear a way as is humanly possible!

[Eric Paice]

Have to agree with gsbcn08080

I'm American and over the last year I've worked for a few companies in and around Madrid. I get paid the same rate as the EU teachers. Most of my fellow Americans over here say the same thing. I don't have work papers but it doesn't seem to make much difference apart from you can't work for companies like Berlitz. As they (and the other big boys) only pay about 9 Euros an hour, would you want to anyway?

[gsbcn08080]

The 9 euros / hour you mention about Berlitz is gross, they take tax out of that so net it works out at 7.52 euros/ hour(at least the Berlitz in Barcelona).
So believe it or not I have American friends that make more money than me ( European) because they don't pay tax ....but this is Spain the country of contradictions.

[Mouse]

7... 50... an hour?!

[gsbcn08080]

They explained to me that they pay your medical insurance and government tax for you and give you some "finiquito" ( end of contract money) in June. So after all that it works out at around 7.52 euros/hour.

[SEndrigo]

Yes that's right, I don't think American teachers get paid less than British teachers, but as Mouse has pointed out, if the school decides to not pay them, they have no legal recourse. The school can also sack them whenever they please, without worrying about anything.

Illegal workers also have no health insurance

Not to mention that some people feel "lower" when they are illegal; you can take some comfort in the fact that the law protects you and that you have rights if you are legal. You have less rights if you are illegal.

I would say don't work illegally in Spain, but if you are young, and just want to have a good time for a little while, I suppose there's going to be nothing stopping you from working illegally in Spain. (though I do not under any circumstance condone breaking the law and staying in Spain illegally).

[stillnosheep]

"Not under any circumstances"? Not even if the alternative was to return to one's homeland to face certain death! Strange!

[SEndrigo]