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doogsville
Joined: 17 Nov 2011 Posts: 924 Location: China
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Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 4:40 pm Post subject: |
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If the school was employing you while you only had a tourist visa then they are obviously not a professional outfit. A lot of those places hire people then fire them after the probation period to avoid paying the full salary. They no doubt had another probationer lined up to take your place. Ask yourself who was making the complaints. Was it the parents? Were the parents in the class often and long enough to make that kind of judgement? Was it the students? Do you really believe your students would make that kind of complaint? Who was actually observing your classes? It could be that they just plucked an excuse out of thin air to justify firing you and getting someone cheaper.
If you did everything right technically then what is the problem? You obviously didn't live up to their or their customers expectations of what a 'dancing monkey' should provide. Good for you. You really don't want to work for that kind of school anyway. Find a school that allows you to grow and develop as a teacher. Whether you've done an online TEFL course, a CELTA or got an MA, you're still going to have to get out there and teach to further develop your skills and grow as a teacher. Try not to let this experience get you down too much. Just get back on the bike and try again. |
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muffintop
Joined: 07 Jan 2013 Posts: 803
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Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 10:55 pm Post subject: |
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| doogsville wrote: |
| ...Ask yourself who was making the complaints. ... Was it the students? Do you really believe your students would make that kind of complaint? |
Yeah, absolutely. Students say soandso teacher is boring ALL the time. What boring actually means to some of the students is unclear. To some it means that the teacher actually expects the students to put in some effort or at the very least not sleep in class. To others it means that the teacher would not allow the students to play with their phones/tablets/themselves. To some...blahblahblah
Boring is one of my pet peeve words now (so are delicious, nice, and happy/happiness but that's for another time). It's often used incorrectly by students to shift blame from their own failures.
Not pooping on your post, it was a good post. I also believe you are more than likely correct to think that the complaints were made up or simply exaggerated to avoid paying full salary. |
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doogsville
Joined: 17 Nov 2011 Posts: 924 Location: China
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Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2013 12:52 am Post subject: |
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There you go then, you already seem to be feeling better about yourself, which is the main thing. Actually I was thinking more about the word 'inexperienced' in your original post. My language mill students in the past struggled with words like helicopter, so it's unlikely they would use a word like inexperienced. It's far liklier that the school itself or the parents noticed your lack of experience. Shock horror, they hired a newly qualified teacher who turned out to be ... inexperienced. Sounds like your paying for the schools mistake.
Anyway, like most of the replies here are saying, dust yourself off and find another job. This time find a job that will provide you with the necessary visa and permits to allow you to work legally. |
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wawaguagua
Joined: 10 Feb 2013 Posts: 190 Location: China
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Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2013 2:31 am Post subject: |
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| doogsville wrote: |
There you go then, you already seem to be feeling better about yourself, which is the main thing. Actually I was thinking more about the word 'inexperienced' in your original post. My language mill students in the past struggled with words like helicopter, so it's unlikely they would use a word like inexperienced. It's far liklier that the school itself or the parents noticed your lack of experience. Shock horror, they hired a newly qualified teacher who turned out to be ... inexperienced. Sounds like your paying for the schools mistake.
Anyway, like most of the replies here are saying, dust yourself off and find another job. This time find a job that will provide you with the necessary visa and permits to allow you to work legally. |
I'm actually not really sure which one of my posts you're responding to here, or if maybe you're mistaking the post above this one as my own.
I am feeling a bit better about myself and I'll definitely give it another shot. Of course, the whole "experience" thing is a bit frustrating because, just like the job market back home, everyone wants experience but if no one is willing to take a chance on a newbie, there's no experience to be gained.
That's just life, though, and I'm hopeful that with so many schools looking for English teachers out there, someone will value me enough to keep me around long enough to get that experience. It's just a matter of finding the right place.
Thanks to everyone for your support and insight. It really means a lot and it's given me so much to consider. |
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FlyingJames
Joined: 26 Jan 2013 Posts: 23 Location: Australia
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Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2013 4:52 am Post subject: |
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Chin up, it's not always easy being a teacher and these TEFL courses don't give you much in terms of classroom experience.
I'm a certified teacher in my home country and I can tell you, my first supervised teaching placement was tough, My overall classroom management was ineffective and I produced my fair share of lessons that were best forgotten. I was lucky to pass.
You do get better with experience. With continuous teaching, you identify better techniques to handle each individual student in your class and implement strategies to control them (both academic and behaviour management). Even a Celta course that is four weeks of teaching isn't enough practice. I'm not surprised more people really do struggle on their first teaching assignment in a foreign country. Sure, some people are natural at teaching, but for others, it takes continuous practice and a strong desire to learn.
I found some mentor teachers/schools are bias towards a certain teaching style that may not suit the individual teacher. As we all know, there are many teaching styles. All the best and don't let what one particular school thinks about your teaching style get you down. |
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Lancy Bloom
Joined: 23 Nov 2012 Posts: 126 Location: Hong Kong
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Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2013 9:56 am Post subject: |
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THis same thing is happening with good teachers in China. They get away with it. They just want cameo appearances from white folks for their posters in the school lobbies.
Work on a perdium basis and avoid this trap. Get airfair prepaid and avoid this trap. Never believe Chinese compliments and avoid this trap.
China must start to recognize foreign credentials. If they are in the accredidation business they must recognize and support foreign school degrees.
The idea that a student who has no English skills can determine who is a good teacher is inane. |
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muffintop
Joined: 07 Jan 2013 Posts: 803
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Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2013 12:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Lancy Bloom wrote: |
THis same thing is happening with good teachers in China. They get away with it. They just want cameo appearances from white folks for their posters in the school lobbies.
Work on a perdium basis and avoid this trap. Get airfair prepaid and avoid this trap. Never believe Chinese compliments and avoid this trap.
China must start to recognize foreign credentials. If they are in the accredidation business they must recognize and support foreign school degrees.
The idea that a student who has no English skills can determine who is a good teacher is inane. |
How would working on a per dium basis avoid any traps?
...and I am sure you are aware that the overwhelming majority of schools do not prepay airfare.
Last edited by muffintop on Thu Feb 14, 2013 1:26 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Javelin of Radiance

Joined: 01 Jul 2009 Posts: 1187 Location: The West
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Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2013 1:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Perdium, the long awaited 119th element. |
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Non Sequitur
Joined: 23 May 2010 Posts: 4724 Location: China
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Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2013 7:19 pm Post subject: |
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| Javelin of Radiance wrote: |
| Perdium, the long awaited 119th element. |
With Perdition closely linked to Perdium. |
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myownwoman
Joined: 26 Feb 2011 Posts: 25 Location: CA
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Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2013 8:07 pm Post subject: Re: So what happens now? |
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| wawaguagua wrote: |
...Another suitcase, another hall. Take your picture off another wall.
I'd convinced myself since college that an ESL career in Asia was the right move for me. Gain international work experience, save money, and explore another culture all at the same time? Where do I sign up? I took a 100-hour TEFL course with 60% of it in class. It wasn't CELTA and it didn't have an actual teaching demo component.
After saving up at a minimum wage retail job for a year after graduation, I got very eager and jumped at the best of five offers in China. I was hesitant about coming over on a tourist visa but I was very tired of waiting around for the next big thing.
My first week was shaky but I felt I was getting the hang of things. At the end of my probation period, I was unceremoniously fired due to complaints that I was boring and inexperienced. I was told that I worked hard and did everything right from a technical standpoint, but I'm not experienced enough and I lack a certain "spark" needed to be a teacher.
I was given advice to find a job that focuses on older students and then go back to kids after I was comfortable there. Unfortunately, my job search isn't turning up much else but private language schools and franchises working with kids.
The whole thing has been very discouraging to me and I'm not sure what to do now. I don't want to give up, as I invested so much time, effort, and money into this, and it's been my dream for several years. I also don't want to relocate all of my stuff to another city just to have history repeat itself. Should I just cut my losses and go home? Alternatively, as I still have money saved up, I've thought about flying to Thailand and taking the all-inclusive CELTA course there... Would that be worth it? |
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wawaguagua
Joined: 10 Feb 2013 Posts: 190 Location: China
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Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 8:34 am Post subject: |
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| ^ You merely quoted my first post. If you have any advice to offer, I'd love to hear it - Any thoughts are appreciated, positive or negative. |
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Lancy Bloom
Joined: 23 Nov 2012 Posts: 126 Location: Hong Kong
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Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 11:15 am Post subject: |
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Don't use recruiters. Cut your own deal. Be paid on a daily basis or by each class taught. This is how teachers work everywhere in the world. The posters problems were caused by an employer who didn't want a teacher and wasn't willing to give clear instructions on how they wanted their students taught. So it is good for employers and employees to pay per class or by day. If they don't like you they just pay one time and good bye.
When I say this all the recruiters on this forum cringe because they are out there head hunter fee. They need naive first timers here. People like the person posting on this forum. And the recruiter says to the person who gets fired that they have another job for them and the same thing happens again. In the end after many of these one month jobs the teacher pays their own way home, exhausted and discusted with China.
It happened to me and I have seen many have the same thing happen. Nothing to do with being a good teacher or a bad teacher. There is no legal protection for foreign teachers anywhere. This one month trial period is a hoax. No certified teacher anywhere would accept this kind of contract |
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SeldomSeen
Joined: 07 Feb 2013 Posts: 40
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Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 12:59 pm Post subject: |
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I've seen several teachers who were definitely not boring but would often question what educational value they were providing. I've seen several whose lessons were boring but definitely instructive. It takes time to find that middle ground.
It sounds like your school wasn't a good one as any reputable establishment would have brought you in on a Z visa. Maybe you should take a look at the language mills if you can handle the thought of teaching kids (which isn't hard to get used to and in many ways is easier than older students). Yes, language mills have their problems which are well documented on this and other sites, but they should at least provide some training and, most of all, the chance to observe lots of other teachers and lessons in your first few weeks and to ask others for help to prepare more engaging lessons. It's a steep learning curve and the first month is hard, the third month noticeably easier and by the six month you can really start trying new things (and recycling some old ones that worked well as by this stage you've got a big "bag of tricks" to use in a lesson). I've just completed my first year at such a mill. Yes, it's been hard at times, but invaluable experience to enable me to move on.
A CELTA is definitely worth considering although it doesn't do a great deal to prepare you for teaching kids in China. One year of experience is one thing but that, together with the CELTA, enables you to look away from the language mills and apply for better things. |
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doogsville
Joined: 17 Nov 2011 Posts: 924 Location: China
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Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 10:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Lancy Bloom wrote: |
| Don't use recruiters. Cut your own deal. Be paid on a daily basis or by each class taught. This is how teachers work everywhere in the world... snip |
I've never heard of any teacher being paid by the day or by the class. I've been a teacher for more than twelve years, my sister is a teacher in the UK, as is my daughter and her husband. None of them are paid daily or by the class. Where, exactly, do teachers get paid by the hour or by the class? I would love to hear some actual examples of this happening in the real world. Even if it were possible, I would still rather be paid on a monthly or weekly basis just to make organising my finances easier. If I were paid daily or by the class I would either have to carry a lot of cash around all the time, or I would have to visit the bank at least once a day to deposit the money so I could pay my rent and utilities etc, since I can't pay them with cash. |
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Javelin of Radiance

Joined: 01 Jul 2009 Posts: 1187 Location: The West
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Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 11:41 pm Post subject: |
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| doogsville wrote: |
| Lancy Bloom wrote: |
| Don't use recruiters. Cut your own deal. Be paid on a daily basis or by each class taught. This is how teachers work everywhere in the world... snip |
I've never heard of any teacher being paid by the day or by the class. I've been a teacher for more than twelve years, my sister is a teacher in the UK, as is my daughter and her husband. None of them are paid daily or by the class. Where, exactly, do teachers get paid by the hour or by the class? |
For the answer to this questiion we have to venture out of
| doogsville wrote: |
| the real world. |
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