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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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 Posted: Thu Sep 28, 2017 1:47 pm Post subject: |
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| siologen wrote: |
| AFAIK, it is a government rule that women in banks, colleges, and offices, have to leave their face uncovered. There may be some wiggle room, but I do remember someone telling me it was a decree from the Sultan and the council. |
Sultan? 
KSA is segregated by sex. There are women-only public spaces in the major cities. Plus, women usually take the abaya and hijab off in all-female environments like college campuses. But there's no law that they cover or uncover their faces in public places, although some of the more conservative areas of the country expect adult females to wear a niqab.
On the subject of women driving, niqab or no niqab, this will be a big boost to the country in terms of its capacity building initiative and the Saudi economy.
Last edited by nomad soul on Thu Sep 28, 2017 6:02 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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siologen
Joined: 25 Oct 2016
Posts: 336
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| Posted: Thu Sep 28, 2017 1:59 pm Post subject: re: sultan? |
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Hi NS,
Yeap, the Sultan, as in the Sultanate of Oman. That was an example of one GCC member country Oman . Sorry for any confusion caused on my part, I have edited my OP accordingly. I hope that clarifies things for you.
Cheers on,
S |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Thu Sep 28, 2017 2:35 pm Post subject: |
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| You really can't compare ultra-conservative Saudi Arabia to Oman or the other countries in the Khaleej. |
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siologen
Joined: 25 Oct 2016
Posts: 336
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| Posted: Thu Sep 28, 2017 2:47 pm Post subject: re: true |
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| Quote: |
| You really can't compare ultra-conservative Saudi Arabia to Oman or the other countries in the Khaleej. |
True, a valid point. As I remember from Oh-Man, there was still segregation of men and women, to an extent. Female and Male Entrance and Exit points from the college/s, even in the classroom girls sat at the back and in a corner and boys on the other side in the middle and at front. And of course there are all the cases in Dubai of tourists being arrested for kissing and being drunk and so on. I think a lot of it is to do with the area being conservative, laws may change giving women permission to do this and that, society accepting and embracing them will take much longer. |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Thu Sep 28, 2017 7:16 pm Post subject: |
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| siologen wrote: |
| Quote: |
| You really can't compare ultra-conservative Saudi Arabia to Oman or the other countries in the Khaleej. |
True, a valid point. As I remember from Oh-Man, there was still segregation of men and women, to an extent. Female and Male Entrance and Exit points from the college/s, even in the classroom girls sat at the back and in a corner and boys on the other side in the middle and at front. And of course there are all the cases in Dubai of tourists being arrested for kissing... |
Definitely read up on KSA's culture and laws if you expect to work there. Among the GCC (and the world), Saudi Arabia is the only country that bans women from driving and maintains a strict gender segregation law. For example, there are no colleges with designated entrances for males and females; campuses are physically and logistically separate from each other to prevent the sexes from mixing. (KAUST is the exception.) Operations like IT, maintenance, security, HR, etc., on the women's campuses are staffed solely by females just as the male campuses employ only men for those roles. Separate but not always equal.
Know before you go. |
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siologen
Joined: 25 Oct 2016
Posts: 336
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| Posted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 6:24 am Post subject: re: NS |
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Dear NS,
I did buy books on the history of the K.S.A in the borders bookstore in Muscat (Oman), discuss the country (KSA) with ex teachers who had taught there, watched docu's online, and generally read all the articles/news online I could absorb about said place. I reiterate, I have in the past, and continue now to keep myself informed. I have also worked in Oman for one year, and visited the UAE and other parts of the middle east and south east asia. So, no I would not be going over there as a naive newbie.
I will however take what you wrote under advisement (meant respectfully!!)
Regards on.
S |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Sat Sep 30, 2017 10:58 pm Post subject: |
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From the Saudi Gazette, "Saudi marriage contracts may have new clause permitting women to own and drive cars," Oct. 1, 2017:
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RIYADH – Marriage contracts in Saudi Arabia are expected to see an additional clause included after women in the Kingdom were granted the right to drive.
The section including conditions set by Saudi wives usually included three clauses. Among the most popular conditions are the provision of her own independent house, completing one’s education and not preventing her from working if she chose to. With the Royal decree granting driving licenses for women in Saudi Arabia, a new condition of driving and owning a car is expected to be included as the fourth prominent provision in marriage contracts starting this week. |
Marriage contracts aside, more importantly, the law allowing women the right to drive also extends to expat women. |
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veiledsentiments
Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 17644
Location: USA
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| Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 1:35 am Post subject: |
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I wonder if it will allow the easy transfer system of the rest of the Gulf... where if you have a UK or US license (and likely others), you automatically get a local license... usually with just an eye test.
Have to wait and see I guess... first we have to get the law to actually take effect.
VS |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 12:06 pm Post subject: |
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A couple of my Saudi teaching colleagues drove in the US while attending university. They may still have their state licenses.
BTW, this is interesting... Arab News reports that PNU plans to establish a women's driving school:
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| JEDDAH: Princess Nourah Bin Abdulrahman University announced on Saturday that they are ready to establish a driving school for women in cooperation with the relevant authorities. The university made the announcement on their twitter account, adding that their decision comes in line with the Royal directive to allow women to drive equally with their male peers in the Kingdom. |
I wonder who they'll hire as driving instructors? 
I also read that KSU will be creating several thousand parking spaces for female faculty and students. |
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BajaLaJaula
Joined: 25 Jan 2007
Posts: 267
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| Posted: Mon Oct 02, 2017 2:26 pm Post subject: 8 month waiting period |
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I presume the 8 month delay is to allow for families to adjust to the new norm in KSA. I am still expecting this ruling to be changed or modified.
When the ruling family (Al-Saud mafia) decided to change the weekend from Thur, Fri to Fri, Sat, they were able to implement with no warning at all. We just found out a few days prior that the new weekend would take effect, starting the next weekend.
I sincerely hope that come June 2018, Saudi women will in fact be given the right to drive...but I can't help but think that they (Saudis) will screw this one up...just like the other reforms that they pretend to put in place.
Go for the money (Oops! There ain't no more money), and stay for the cultural experience (much sarcasm intended). |
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hash
Joined: 17 Dec 2014
Posts: 456
Location: Wadi Jinn
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| Posted: Tue Oct 03, 2017 2:01 am Post subject: |
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I am astonished that no one has as yet mentioned the dark side of this development.....a development, I must add, that I'm totally against. Here's my view.....
KSA (the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia) has one of the worst traffic records on earth- year after year. The dismal figures would likely be increased two-fold if reported accidents were reliable, but everyone knows KSA "statistics" are as reliable as your typical high school report card.
Even if a law is passed allowing women to drive in KSA - a highly doubtful proposition in any case - it would soon be rescinded once hospital beds start filling up with mutilated female traffic accident victims and body bags start carrying the name-tag of SULTANA instead of SULTAN, LULU instead of MUHANNAD...and once the rape statistics correspondingly start their upward climb. You wait and see. KSA is simply not ready -in any important sense - to sanction women driving. A lot more "social development" has to take place before women can drive in safety and security. Refusing to acknowledge this is simply putting your head in the sand.
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Tue Oct 03, 2017 6:25 am Post subject: |
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| hash wrote: |
I am astonished that no one has as yet mentioned the dark side of this development.....a development, I must add, that I'm totally against. Here's my view.....
KSA (the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia) has one of the worst traffic records on earth- year after year. The dismal figures would likely be increased two-fold if reported accidents were reliable, but everyone knows KSA "statistics" are as reliable as your typical high school report card.
Even if a law is passed allowing women to drive in KSA - a highly doubtful proposition in any case - it would soon be rescinded once hospital beds start filling up with mutilated female traffic accident victims and body bags start carrying the name-tag of SULTANA instead of SULTAN, LULU instead of MUHANNAD...and once the rape statistics correspondingly start their upward climb... |
Hey, hash, the 1950s called and they want those archaic beliefs back!
Hmm... The country with some of the highest car accident rates is the one nation in the world in which only men drive. Go figure. And by the way, women have been among the victims of traffic accidents in KSA for years... as passengers with men behind the wheel.
Your creepy speculation about increased sexual assaults isn't worth commenting about. 
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siologen
Joined: 25 Oct 2016
Posts: 336
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Grendal
Joined: 13 Aug 2009
Posts: 861
Location: Lurking in the depths of the Faisaliah Tower underground parking.
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| Posted: Tue Oct 03, 2017 10:52 am Post subject: |
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I was renewing my vehicle permit and registration and thought how it would be for women drivers. There would have to be a women's section when you go to get your car safety checked.
Would this also require women mechanics that do the safety check?
Also the bank where I bought my car from (4 year payment plan) has a special office that handles leased vehicles. This bank would have to provide a women's section to go to for picking up your new registration after the safety check is done. (It was full of stinky smelling men)
enjoy
Grendal |
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veiledsentiments
Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 17644
Location: USA
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| Posted: Tue Oct 03, 2017 1:29 pm Post subject: |
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Presumably the 6 month delay of implementation is to work these sorts of things out...
VS |
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