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nimadecaomei
Joined: 22 Sep 2016
Posts: 605
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 Posted: Tue May 22, 2018 11:47 pm Post subject: |
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Last year, I finished my contract and got the release/rec letters, but I had to cancel my RP and switch to a spousal RP. I was no longer working, but still in China. The new school needed the release/rec, plus the criminal check and authenticated degree to get the invitation letter for me to get a new Z visa. I was going from Sichuan to Jiangsu, about as far away as possible. I believe this is one of the things they tightened up on last year.
You don't need it from all employers, just the most recent one. Maybe it would work if you had a new passport, but I would not count on it. |
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cormac
Joined: 04 Nov 2008
Posts: 768
Location: Xi'an (XTU)
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| Posted: Wed May 23, 2018 9:27 am Post subject: |
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| nimadecaomei wrote: |
Last year, I finished my contract and got the release/rec letters, but I had to cancel my RP and switch to a spousal RP. I was no longer working, but still in China. The new school needed the release/rec, plus the criminal check and authenticated degree to get the invitation letter for me to get a new Z visa. I was going from Sichuan to Jiangsu, about as far away as possible. I believe this is one of the things they tightened up on last year.
You don't need it from all employers, just the most recent one. Maybe it would work if you had a new passport, but I would not count on it. |
Inside China... The release letter is required. Outside China, you can still get a new visa for a different school.
Apples and oranges. |
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geosmiley
Joined: 25 Jan 2016
Posts: 62
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| Posted: Wed May 23, 2018 9:52 am Post subject: Apples and Oranges |
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| You don't get your Z visa until AFTER you arrive in China. If the Foreign Office notices something wrong such as a previous visa in your passport that doesn't appear on your resume I am certain they would be very curious and may ask you for a release letter or even call the precious employer in China. If it doesn't go well you would be sent home at your own expense. It's a risk not worth taking in my opinion. |
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nimadecaomei
Joined: 22 Sep 2016
Posts: 605
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| Posted: Wed May 23, 2018 10:01 am Post subject: Re: Apples and Oranges |
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| geosmiley wrote: |
| You don't get your Z visa until AFTER you arrive in China. If the Foreign Office notices something wrong such as a previous visa in your passport that doesn't appear on your resume I am certain they would be very curious and may ask you for a release letter or even call the precious employer in China. If it doesn't go well you would be sent home at your own expense. It's a risk not worth taking in my opinion. |
I think you are just confusing words here. A visa is to enter a country, you get your Z Visa to enter China for work. After that it is converted to a residence permit for work. |
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geosmiley
Joined: 25 Jan 2016
Posts: 62
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| Posted: Wed May 23, 2018 10:40 am Post subject: Confused |
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| I stated that you don't get your Z visa until after you arrive in China. That is an accurate statement. I didn't confuse anything. There is a sticker in my passport. It says Chinese Visa at the top. In the category slot underneath it says Z. It was put there after I arrived. Maybe you are confused. |
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nimadecaomei
Joined: 22 Sep 2016
Posts: 605
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| Posted: Wed May 23, 2018 11:42 am Post subject: |
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Would be interesting to hear your whole story. From what people say here and the experience of everyone I have known for the last 10 years in this country it is no longer possible to convert any type of visa to a Z visa in country anymore. Also, after you have to convert the Z to a residence permit and the visa is no longer valid.
Can you explain a little more about your experience? |
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geosmiley
Joined: 25 Jan 2016
Posts: 62
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| Posted: Wed May 23, 2018 12:23 pm Post subject: Backstory |
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I have had two uni jobs in China since 2012. I was at home both times when I got the required paperwork. I used a visa service. I got an initial sticker in my passport and then after I got here it was converted to a Z visa. I've been in Hangzhou for the last three years, nothing has changed that I'm aware of, but then I don't have anything to do with it. It's all done for me.
I'm still interested in how common dumping a job is and if there were negative ramifications. |
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astrotrain
Joined: 18 Apr 2013
Posts: 96
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| Posted: Wed May 23, 2018 2:09 pm Post subject: |
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| ^^^ your case was the exception, both times I got the Z BEFORE leaving to China in my home country. I assume you live far from Chinese embassy so you had an agent do the work. |
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astrotrain
Joined: 18 Apr 2013
Posts: 96
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| Posted: Wed May 23, 2018 2:25 pm Post subject: Re: Anything is Possible |
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| cormac wrote: |
Personally, i'd just say that you were unable to get a recommendation letter from the school. I wouldn't go into any details. There are plenty of schools out there with lazy or ignorant fao's unwilling to type up a rec letter. It's hardly a secret the behavior of many fao's. I've had the same issues getting rec letters from my other universities even though the contract finished perfectly fine.
So, I'd raise that there is no rec letter, but point to your other attributes/benefits as a teacher. You could refer to your lesson plans and share some of them to show how commited you are as a teacher.
I don't see any reason for you to be blocked from jobs. If anything, I'd remove the last university from my resume, and just apply as a fresh teacher.
Some seem to think Chinese people are all interconnected and can access all manner of records about foreigners. Sure, on a local level that can be true, but nationally? Nope. Just apply to places outside of the last universitys province.
Lastly, if all else fails just go with EF. They'll sort it all out for you and won't care in the slightest. You'll have plenty of hours though but overall they're a decent company to work for. |
I don't intend to reference this school on my resume, just use the better school I worked in the past that gave me the 3 letters including the recommendation letter. It cost me a bloody fortunate to leave impromptu but even if there was no family crisis I would have talked to the school to only work a year rather than 2, the school and city was very dysfunctional, again the previous econ teacher showed hollywood movies for an entire year in teaching Micro, Jesus . . .
Even without this issue I see slim pickings this year for Econ positions. I will update this thread whatever the developments. Thanks to all for the feedback. |
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nimadecaomei
Joined: 22 Sep 2016
Posts: 605
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| Posted: Wed May 23, 2018 9:15 pm Post subject: Re: Backstory |
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| geosmiley wrote: |
| I have had two uni jobs in China since 2012. I was at home both times when I got the required paperwork. I used a visa service. I got an initial sticker in my passport and then after I got here it was converted to a Z visa. I've been in Hangzhou for the last three years, nothing has changed that I'm aware of, but then I don't have anything to do with it. It's all done for me. |
So, you have a Residence Permit now? Which visa type did they get you before leaving for China? |
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geosmiley
Joined: 25 Jan 2016
Posts: 62
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| Posted: Thu May 24, 2018 3:37 am Post subject: Different Approach |
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Hi Auto:
I think I would put it on my resume and try the following approach. I would cite a family emergency, and then just say that when you contacted the school about a return they told you they didn't need you. I wouldn't get into a big discussion about everything that was wrong. In fact, I wouldn't even mention it. It was all a big surprise and regretable but there was nothing you could do. Of course, they may contact the old school and a different story would emerge but I would just stick to the one you gave the prospective employer. Hopefully, you could point to previous completed contracts to support your claim that you would have finished if they had allowed it. In this way, nothing would be hanging over your head and you can just do a good job and proceed with lessons learned. |
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teenoso
Joined: 18 Sep 2013
Posts: 365
Location: south china
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| Posted: Thu May 24, 2018 4:04 am Post subject: |
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I'm a bit confused by the difference between a letter of release and a letter of recommendation.
After leaving my last employer in 2016 ( a month early, and without notice) I went home for a year, and now I'm in China on a spousal visa, not working, (not many opps. for foreign teachers in my wife's home city).
The Uni I applied to here, and was accepted by, initially wanted 'a letter of recommendation from a previous employer', which I managed to get from a Uni in China I was at 8 years ago. But then, as the paperwork was being gathered, they wanted a letter of recommendation from the last employer, who refused.
It was not the release letter they wanted because I had left that post 18 months ago.
I guess different employers want different things.
Anyway, thanks for the encouraging comments here about applying for lots of jobs, even if it might mean moving city. |
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cormac
Joined: 04 Nov 2008
Posts: 768
Location: Xi'an (XTU)
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| Posted: Thu May 24, 2018 5:45 am Post subject: |
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| teenoso wrote: |
I'm a bit confused by the difference between a letter of release and a letter of recommendation.
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The recommendation letter is just required by some universities for the job applications. It has no legal bearing.
The release letter is given by the school at the end of your contract to show that the contract has been fulfilled (as long as you remember to ask for it). It is required by the PSB for the the transfer of a visa, or renewal of a visa with a different school.
Both letters have a history of being a pain to get, and are generally quite important. |
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astrotrain
Joined: 18 Apr 2013
Posts: 96
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| Posted: Fri May 25, 2018 1:41 pm Post subject: Re: Different Approach |
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| geosmiley wrote: |
Hi Auto:
I think I would put it on my resume and try the following approach. I would cite a family emergency, and then just say that when you contacted the school about a return they told you they didn't need you. I wouldn't get into a big discussion about everything that was wrong. In fact, I wouldn't even mention it. It was all a big surprise and regretable but there was nothing you could do. Of course, they may contact the old school and a different story would emerge but I would just stick to the one you gave the prospective employer. Hopefully, you could point to previous completed contracts to support your claim that you would have finished if they had allowed it. In this way, nothing would be hanging over your head and you can just do a good job and proceed with lessons learned. |
Yeah, I might try that and an update my resume accordingly less any future surprises for non disclosure.
The one thing that is perturbing is the non uniform regulation across this country, these new Visa rules the past 2 years i.e. criminal and degree authentication and ONLY hiring Native speakers are all over the place. I know for a fact many schools hire non natives, this last one did. If I had to leave due to family emergency I might not get another visa again (no papers) but they are sure happy to shirk off the native speaker requirement as they deem fit. |
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astrotrain
Joined: 18 Apr 2013
Posts: 96
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| Posted: Fri May 25, 2018 1:49 pm Post subject: |
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| teenoso wrote: |
I'm a bit confused by the difference between a letter of release and a letter of recommendation.
After leaving my last employer in 2016 ( a month early, and without notice) I went home for a year, and now I'm in China on a spousal visa, not working, (not many opps. for foreign teachers in my wife's home city).
The Uni I applied to here, and was accepted by, initially wanted 'a letter of recommendation from a previous employer', which I managed to get from a Uni in China I was at 8 years ago. But then, as the paperwork was being gathered, they wanted a letter of recommendation from the last employer, who refused.
It was not the release letter they wanted because I had left that post 18 months ago.
I guess different employers want different things.
Anyway, thanks for the encouraging comments here about applying for lots of jobs, even if it might mean moving city. |
I might end up on your route, via the spousal visa if me and my gal get hitched. I would most likely be in Guangzhou but I believe once you are on spousal visa you are denied any work permits, i.e. you cannot legally work for any employer in the country unless you own your own business etc.
I heard many Youtubers proclaim such. Can you clarify why you tried to apply for the local Uni job in your wife's hometown? didn't the school reject the application becus of your marriage status? |
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