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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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 Posted: Sun Jul 11, 2004 2:57 pm Post subject: |
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| joncharles wrote: |
Paul,
I do have some bad news... as you may know I have been trying to find a new job in Japan for a few months now. I am on the net everyday checking out the ESL sites for new job postings. Over the past two months I have seen two ads for English teachers that specifically stated that no degree needed and another that stated that they will hire you on a Tourist visa. The two schools advertising no degreee needed were in Hokkaido (three month contract for summer) and Shikoku. The one saying they will accept a tourist visa I can't recall. Ah.. I found it.. I have a suspicion that these are probably not reputable schools.
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ENGLISH TEACHER.
Part-time, 12 hours/week. Teach English conversation in exchange for private room. Position located in Urawa, 30 minutes from Shinjuku (the Tokyo central). "Short or long term, tourist visa OK!" Contact Mr. Shimada. Ray English Club. 048-887-4232. Fax 048-882-2334.
mailto:[email protected]
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Maybe Glenski has heard of the school in Hokkaido ... If I can remember the ad correctly they were looking for teachers for the summer (three months) and specifically stated that no degrees were needed. |
John,
sorry to burst your bubble. but what they are advertising is illegal, plain and simple, and in case you have been living in a cave the last few months, if you are caught working on a tourist visa you can be arrested, locked up and then kicked out of the country, without right of return for ten years.
Just becuase one school offers jobs with tourist visas that doesnt mean it is legit or above board.
glenski has told of people being strung along on a tourist visa for seven months and then getting kicked out of the country, minus their last few months salary. Some even do not get time to pack.
Like Gordon says, come on in the waters fine. if you are caught you will see what a 6 foot tatami prison cell looks like, where you are forced to sit or kneel for hours on end, and have miso soup and rice balls breakfast lunch and dinner. |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Sun Jul 11, 2004 3:02 pm Post subject: |
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PS
If you are on a spouse visa you dont need a degree and they will hire you on a tourist visa if you can qualify for a work visa. It may mean a quick trip to Korea to change your visa over. Americans can not get working holiday visas so they come on a tourist visa and get a job here and change it over. Its done all the time. But you need to be able to qualify for a work visa before they will hire you long term, or have a long term permanent visa in place. Hiring someone to work for 3 or 6 months on a tourist visa is still illegal, plain and simple. |
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joncharles
Joined: 09 Apr 2004
Posts: 132
Location: Beijing
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| Posted: Sun Jul 11, 2004 3:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Don't worry Paul... I know it is illegal. I was just pointing out that these schools are advertising... Someone like Anton could get duped and find themselves in a bit of trouble. |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Sun Jul 11, 2004 3:16 pm Post subject: |
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Jon,
I have seen people ask whether fake Internet online degrees will pass muster with immigration to get a work visa.
People without degrees nor proper visas will do absolutely ANYTHING they can to work or get a job here, regardless of whether or not they are qualified and no matter how devious, underhand or illegal their actions can be. No one likes to feel left out at feeding time and they wonder why everyone else is allowed all the fun. |
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monkey_z
Joined: 22 Jun 2004
Posts: 26
Location: Aichi
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| Posted: Sun Jul 11, 2004 3:40 pm Post subject: |
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Paulh,
That pisses me off that people do that. I worked hard for my degree (BA Japanese studies). These catz are stealing jobs from people. |
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lajzar
Joined: 09 Feb 2003
Posts: 647
Location: Saitama-ken, Japan
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| Posted: Sun Jul 11, 2004 9:17 pm Post subject: |
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hmm... fake degrees... fake jobs...
Anyone think these two groups were made for each other? |
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anton
Joined: 07 Jul 2004
Posts: 46
Location: Taianan, Taiwan
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| Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2004 6:21 am Post subject: |
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That pisses me off that people do that. I worked hard for my degree (BA Japanese studies). These catz are stealing jobs from people. (monkey_z)
Thanks for all the information regarding visas! My cousin is married to a japanese girl, does that make me valid for a spouse visa?! I can imagine you guys laughing at that probably ridiculous question! Apropo fake degrees, i'm not sure it was mentioned in the original discussion subject.... it would be wrong to try and sneak your way into the system with a fake one, not because some people have spent 3 or 4 years of their early 20's working hard, generally having a pretty good time, but because its just blatant dishonesty! I'm not sure stealing is really the right word...perhaps it is the way you feel, but try seeing it from someone elses point of view (hasten to point out not mine), comes from a poor upbringing, sent to some crappy state school, never fulfilled their potential through no fault of their own, now grown up, no chance of getting a degree but wants to teach in a country like japan where a degree is (almost) essential....i can imagine many similar scenarios...
I hear China doasn't require a degree...anyone care to help me on this one?! |
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migo
Joined: 04 Jul 2004
Posts: 201
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| Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2004 6:29 am Post subject: |
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| Thanks for all the information regarding visas! My cousin is married to a japanese girl, does that make me valid for a spouse visa?! |
Are you a hillbilly? |
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Gordon
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 5309
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2004 6:32 am Post subject: |
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| anton wrote: |
I'm not sure stealing is really the right word...perhaps it is the way you feel, but try seeing it from someone elses point of view (hasten to point out not mine), comes from a poor upbringing, sent to some crappy state school, never fulfilled their potential through no fault of their own, now grown up, no chance of getting a degree but wants to teach in a country like japan where a degree is (almost) essential....i can imagine many similar scenarios...
I hear China doasn't require a degree...anyone care to help me on this one?! |
Life is not fair. I had to work and pay for university myself, as did millions of others and I don't complain or begrudge others that had the resources from Daddy. That's life. I learned some good lessons from that, like working hard and appreciating money.
For your second point, try asking in the China Forum. They would know better. |
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Synne
Joined: 06 Apr 2004
Posts: 269
Location: Tohoku
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| Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2004 6:42 am Post subject: |
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| I hear China doasn't require a degree...anyone care to help me on this one?! |
Keep in mind this is just from what I hear. Best to check out the China forum as Gordon said for more info.
No degree required. You even have a good chance of being hired straight out of high school. The problem I hear (one of many) is that you will be working 40 hours plus a week, for a nice maybe $400-$500 a month. That may not be a lot of money outside of China, but in China you can live fairly well off that.
Also I hear you have to fight for everything you get over there, even from your employers.
Gordon is right though, check out the China forum for more info. |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2004 7:43 am Post subject: |
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| anton wrote: |
My cousin is married to a japanese girl, does that make me valid for a spouse visa?!
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Not unless you are married to her as well and shes a practicing bigamist. |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2004 7:46 am Post subject: |
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| Synne wrote: |
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| I hear China doasn't require a degree...anyone care to help me on this one?! |
Gordon is right though, check out the China forum for more info. |
------------------------------------------------------------------------Here are the requirements for applicants for a FE certificate in China:
Quote:
2 The qualifications of invited foreign experts:
a who meets the requirement of the regulations
b whose educational degree should be bachelor or above
c whose technologic title should be engineer or above
d who should have work experiences for 5 years or above in certain specialty and be competent for the task.
e who is specialized in certain technology or specialty and special skill which is necessary in China;
f who has management experiences for five years or above in oversea;
g who had ever worked as a manager of certain department in a large or middle-size foreign fund enterprise or a high-tech enterprise or above
http://www.ebeijing.gov.cn/Jobs/ForeignExperts/EconomicTechnological/t20030927_39645.htm
If you had read my first post carefully, however, you would already know that, in spite of this technicality, in spite of everything you are supposed to be and do as a FE in China, it is possible to find schools here that will hire you anyway. |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2004 7:57 am Post subject: |
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| anton wrote: |
T try seeing it from someone elses point of view (hasten to point out not mine), comes from a poor upbringing, sent to some crappy state school, never fulfilled their potential through no fault of their own, now grown up, no chance of getting a degree but wants to teach in a country like japan where a degree is (almost) essential....i can imagine many similar scenarios...
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How about trying to see it from your students point of view -they are paying out huge amounts of money, even bank loans, in order to take lessons, they are told the teachers they get are university graduates and then they find that all you have to your name is a high school education.
Students don't care about your problems (they usually dont care about your qualifications either) but I would feel cheated if my teacher (who is supposedly educated) had little formal education and he's trying to teach me something. |
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Iwantmyrightsnow
Joined: 12 Feb 2004
Posts: 202
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| Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2004 9:26 am Post subject: |
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| PAULH wrote: |
| anton wrote: |
T try seeing it from someone elses point of view (hasten to point out not mine), comes from a poor upbringing, sent to some crappy state school, never fulfilled their potential through no fault of their own, now grown up, no chance of getting a degree but wants to teach in a country like japan where a degree is (almost) essential....i can imagine many similar scenarios...
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How about trying to see it from your students point of view -they are paying out huge amounts of money, even bank loans, in order to take lessons, they are told the teachers they get are university graduates and then they find that all you have to your name is a high school education.
Students don't care about your problems (they usually dont care about your qualifications either) but I would feel cheated if my teacher (who is supposedly educated) had little formal education and he's trying to teach me something. |
There are plenty of people out there without a formal degree that make good "teachers". Let's face facts - the majority of teaching jobs here are not real, they are little more than glorified language exchanges.
Students should feel more cheated that they are assigned "teachers" with almost no training, or any esl/efl qualifications. |
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lajzar
Joined: 09 Feb 2003
Posts: 647
Location: Saitama-ken, Japan
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| Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2004 11:50 am Post subject: |
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There are plenty of people out there without a formal degree that make good "teachers". Let's face facts - the majority of teaching jobs here are not real, they are little more than glorified language exchanges.
Students should feel more cheated that they are assigned "teachers" with almost no training, or any esl/efl qualifications. |
I am sure there are people who would be good teachers but are without qualifications. Unfortunately, there is no way of telling these apart from the idiots.
Lets suppose 30% of unqualified people have the necessary gift. And lets suppose only 70% of "qualified" people have the necessary gift for teaching.
If I were an employer, it would still be an easy decision to make. And the reality is that those two percentages are farther apart than that. |
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