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king kakipi
Joined: 16 Feb 2004
Posts: 353
Location: Australia
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 Posted: Sat Oct 02, 2004 1:19 pm Post subject: |
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I hate persimmons very much......  |
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madeira
Joined: 13 Jun 2004
Posts: 182
Location: Oppama
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| Posted: Sat Oct 02, 2004 1:22 pm Post subject: |
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Willy, I believe them folks say `I ain`t got nothin` or mebbe `I don` got nuthin`.
Now there`s no accountin` fer the educashun of folks, they do with what they got and good on `em.
English is a changeable/changing language, and communicating is the sole purpose. So, variations in grammar, spelling, usage are OK. In Japan, however, our job as teachers is to train highly skilled and educated people to communicate with the same in English-speaking countries.
My students are diplomats, business people and Master`s students. Strange usage is basically unacceptable.
I extremely apologize for maybe offending people very muchly. |
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canuck
Joined: 11 May 2003
Posts: 1921
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Sat Oct 02, 2004 1:27 pm Post subject: |
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| king kakipi wrote: |
| I hate persimmons very much...... |
I hate persimmons too. There is just something about the taste that I really, really dislike (very much). |
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Nagoyaguy
Joined: 15 May 2003
Posts: 425
Location: Aichi, Japan
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| Posted: Sat Oct 02, 2004 2:08 pm Post subject: |
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IMHO, the problem is the "very much" intensifier. While grammatically correct, it sounds almost a little too formal for most discourse.
I really love strawberries. Sounds ok with "really" intensifying the love.
I really love my mother. OK
I like strawberries a lot. OK
I very much love strawberries. ?????
I like strawberries very much. Grammatically OK, but old fashioned sounding.
Plus, those "hospital" examples are weird, unless the "to" and "too" are supposed to be "took". Using the specific article "the" is really hard in English. Many times it depends on the situation, relationship between the speakers, and so on. |
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Eleckid
Joined: 03 Jun 2004
Posts: 102
Location: Aichi, Japan
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| Posted: Sat Oct 02, 2004 2:09 pm Post subject: |
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awww I'm from Ontario too, & I love picking strawberries in April~ (I couldn't go last yr cuz I'm here...)
I picked peaches in ON this summer! It was actually my first time & the peaches were juicy & sweet!!!!
I like persimmons tho...only the crunchy kind & not the super soft kind from mainland China. Tho both are slimey but I don't mind crunchy ones, slimey & squishy is a little gross, but they're much sweeter. hm....
btw I think ppl in ON do say "I love ___ very much." I don't know if I say it tho, I don't really pay close attention to what I say word-for-word (I'll go crazy if I'm that self-conscious!). But paying close attention does sound a bit strange. I'm not sure if it's grammatically correct or not. Oh well, maybe it's an acceptable grammar, so I guess it's ok to use it. I don't allow my students to do the double negatives, cuz I don't do it. |
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canuck
Joined: 11 May 2003
Posts: 1921
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Sat Oct 02, 2004 2:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Nagoyaguy wrote: |
Plus, those "hospital" examples are weird, unless the "to" and "too" are supposed to be "took". Using the specific article "the" is really hard in English. Many times it depends on the situation, relationship between the speakers, and so on. |
The hospital example isn't weird. In Canada, most people will say "go to the hospital" whereas in England, most people will say "go to hospital". Just like in both countries, it's "go to school". It's amazing about the subtle differences between American and British English, and then you throw the Canadian hybrid in there. So many, tyre/tire, aeroplane/airplane, truck/lorry etc. |
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Nagoyaguy
Joined: 15 May 2003
Posts: 425
Location: Aichi, Japan
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| Posted: Sat Oct 02, 2004 2:37 pm Post subject: |
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Uh, Canuck, here is what you wrote;
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I broke my leg and my friend to me to hospital.
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I broke my leg and my friend too me to the hospital.
Which is correct?
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I dont see anything there about "go to hospital" or "go to the hospital", but I get your point. |
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canuck
Joined: 11 May 2003
Posts: 1921
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Sat Oct 02, 2004 3:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Nagoyaguy wrote: |
Uh, Canuck, here is what you wrote;
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I broke my leg and my friend to me to hospital.
and
I broke my leg and my friend too me to the hospital.
Which is correct?
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I dont see anything there about "go to hospital" or "go to the hospital", but I get your point. |
Oops. You're right. Sorry, late. I must be on ludes. Should be:
go to hospital vs. go to the hospital.
The second one is what I say, but I didn't know that the first one is also correct, finding out from British friends and looking in grammar books. It was a stretch in making a point anyways. |
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Willy_In_Japan
Joined: 20 Jul 2004
Posts: 329
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| Posted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 8:33 am Post subject: |
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Both 'took me to the hospital' and 'took me to hospital' are correct. The 'the' is optional.
I understand the difference between "British" and "American" english, and neither give me trouble. Besides, the differences between American and British usage of English isn't the issue, intensifiers are.
I thank people for their responses. I am going to tell my JTE that the reason it is wrong is because you can't (or shouldn't) intensify something that is the most intense.
Therefore, "I like strawberries very much" is ok, where otherwise it should be "I love strawberries.". |
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canuck
Joined: 11 May 2003
Posts: 1921
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 8:49 am Post subject: |
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oopps.
Last edited by canuck on Sun Oct 03, 2004 9:32 am; edited 1 time in total |
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canuck
Joined: 11 May 2003
Posts: 1921
Location: Japan
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guest of Japan
Joined: 28 Feb 2003
Posts: 1601
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 9:12 am Post subject: |
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I thank people for their responses. I am going to tell my JTE that the reason it is wrong is because you can't (or shouldn't) intensify something that is the most intense.
Therefore, "I like strawberries very much" is ok, where otherwise it should be "I love strawberries.". |
There's a very big hole in your argument. I love strawberries so much. This sentence breaks your rule. The original sentence is not grammatically incorrect. I agree that it doesn't sound natural, but that doesn't mean that it couldn't be used by a native speaker. |
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Willy_In_Japan
Joined: 20 Jul 2004
Posts: 329
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| Posted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 10:07 am Post subject: |
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Canuk, and your point is?
I agree, it is said many times without intesifiers, because intensity on 'love' is wrong.
I get the feeling you are not really talking about the same thing as me.
Guest of Japan
There's a very big hole in your argument. I love strawberries so much. This sentence breaks your rule. The original sentence is not grammatically incorrect. I agree that it doesn't sound natural, but that doesn't mean that it couldn't be used by a native speaker.
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"I love strawberries so much......." as a listener Im waiting for the rest of the sentence........."I love strawberries so much that I eat them every day."
So, just hearing "I love strawberries so much" would make me think that the speaker got cut off and I would be waiting for the rest of the sentence.
I've been thinking about this for a few days now, and my conclusion stands. I'll wait for you guys to catch up  Seriously, it took me a while to put my finger on it myself.
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Sheep-Goats
Joined: 16 Apr 2004
Posts: 527
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| Posted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 10:28 am Post subject: |
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It's natural, you just can't figure out how to run the sentence in your mind to make it such. The sentence is fine.
Additionally, there are times when we emphasize how much we love things -- and there are obvious degrees of love (things < pets < people). |
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canuck
Joined: 11 May 2003
Posts: 1921
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 10:28 am Post subject: |
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| I don't think the intensity of love is wrong, because there are different degrees of love. It's canuck by the way. You should know, you are one. |
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