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JZer
Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3898
Location: Pittsburgh
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 Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 2:29 pm Post subject: |
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| Also can someone tell me if privates are illegal in Taiwan? Can you get deported for doing privates? |
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junkmail
Joined: 19 Dec 2004
Posts: 377
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| Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 2:37 pm Post subject: |
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| Junkmail, I am also interested in knowing about how one would make $3000 in Korea. It seems that most jobs pay about $2000 US a month and from everything I have read, it seems that it is risky to do privates. I know that if I wanted to make $3000 in Taiwan I would be also working illegally but it seems like this is the Taiwanese way and that it is not such a big deal. |
It's not such a big deal in Korea, just people here seem to whine more. That said people do get busted and sometimes deported, especially if they don't have an ARC and I believe Taiwan deports people too. It would be interesting to know the figures for both countries. Bottom line: Illegal privates are illegal and anyone doing them does so at their own risk.
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| Finally I do not want everyone to think that I am just after the money. I plan on teaching for a long time. I would just like to make an investment in order to produce a second income and then I will move to a poorer country that I find more interesting. |
Good for you but I've got no disrepect for you if you are doing it for the money, I'm certainly not a charity. In the end we all like to get paid. I agree with the other posters though, go there and feel your way around.
Whatever you decide; good luck to you! |
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TaoyuanSteve
Joined: 05 Feb 2003
Posts: 1028
Location: Taoyuan
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| Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 2:38 pm Post subject: |
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| Privates may be theoretically illegal. Any work done away from your work sponsor is. However, in practice they are not. How are police going to know whether you are teaching an individual or simply hanging out with a friend? Enforcement would be impossible. Taiwan is very different from Korea in this respect. I've heard police in Korea ask kids if they have a tutor. If they say yes, they nail the foreigner. Doesn't happen here. Teach privates without worry. BTW, kindies are illegal. Being caught teaching in one can land you in trouble. |
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JZer
Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3898
Location: Pittsburgh
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| Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 3:15 pm Post subject: |
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Everyone, thanks for the advice. I understand that you need to look around first and see how things are but sometime people have specific goals and want to try and figure out the best way to accomplish those goals.
I was thinking that I would choose Taiwan over Korea because doing illegal work does not seem to be such an issue. Secondly I would rather learn Mandarin in my free time than Korean. |
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junkmail
Joined: 19 Dec 2004
Posts: 377
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| Posted: Thu Jan 20, 2005 3:45 am Post subject: |
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| JZer wrote: |
| I was thinking that I would choose Taiwan over Korea because doing illegal work does not seem to be such an issue. Secondly I would rather learn Mandarin in my free time than Korean. |
Good point about Mandarin, actually it's one of the reasons I'm moving.
I don't find 'illegal' work that much of an issue in Korea but I might have just got immune to the paranoia (probably another good reason to move) and it might be less of an issue in Taiwan.
Anyway, it sounds like your mind is set and that's a good starting point. |
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JZer
Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3898
Location: Pittsburgh
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| Posted: Thu Jan 20, 2005 7:50 am Post subject: |
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| Good point about Mandarin, actually it's one of the reasons I'm moving. |
Yeah, I agree with you about wanting to learn Mandarin over Korean. I can already speak German. I would probably receive an Advanced Mid if I were tested by ACTFL. My point is that I do not want to learn any languages that are spoken by so few people. In the future I will only consider learning Spanish or Mandarin. |
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JZer
Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3898
Location: Pittsburgh
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| Posted: Thu Jan 20, 2005 7:53 am Post subject: |
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| Also, can someone recommend a good place to learn Mandarin? I want to learn Mandarin while I am in Taiwan!!! |
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TaoyuanSteve
Joined: 05 Feb 2003
Posts: 1028
Location: Taoyuan
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| Posted: Thu Jan 20, 2005 1:51 pm Post subject: |
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I think it's going to come down to a choice of priorities when you get here. You cannot work a metric ton of hours and expect to study. If you choose to work anything approaching 40 teaching hours a week, forget about Chinese lessons. You'll have neither the time in your day nor the energy for them. I see it all the time. People get here with the best of intentions. Then they get a morning job at a kindy and have no time or energy left for Mandarin study. 20-25 hours a week is a good target to shoot for if you want to study. If you work only cram school (afternoons and evenings), you'll have the time to attend Chinese classes in the mornings.
As for where is good, it's going to depend on where you end up. Taipei has a number of language centers that will teach foreigners, as well as universities. Taipei is probably the best city on the island in which to study Chinese. It has the highest number of schools for foreigners. One such language institute is Taipei Language Institute (TLI). Another (where I studied for a while) is Chinese Language Development Institute (CLD). Then there is Chinese Language Institute (CLI). Still another is Chinese Daily News (國語日報). Contact information for these places is available in the English papers (they probably have web sites too). |
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JZer
Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3898
Location: Pittsburgh
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| Posted: Thu Jan 20, 2005 2:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Well I will find some time. Maybe I will spend a few hours studying instead of drinking so much. Plus what else would I do on Saturdays or whatever day I do not work. Anyways I am hoping to start taking Chinese in February at my University while I finish my Master's degree in German Literature. |
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junkmail
Joined: 19 Dec 2004
Posts: 377
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| Posted: Thu Jan 20, 2005 2:57 pm Post subject: |
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| TaoyuanSteve wrote: |
| Taipei is probably the best city on the island in which to study Chinese. It has the highest number of schools for foreigners. One such language institute is Taipei Language Institute (TLI). Another (where I studied for a while) is Chinese Language Development Institute (CLD). Then there is Chinese Language Institute (CLI). Still another is Chinese Daily News (國語日報). Contact information for these places is available in the English papers (they probably have web sites too). |
Thanks, that's good for me too. Is it possible to obtain a student visa whilst in Taiwan or is also neccessary to do a visa run for that?
Clark.w.griswald wrote:
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Hourly paid jobs are generally accepted as being the best payers. Find a good school with lots of classes or a couple of schools with lots of classes combined, and pick up some privates in your off hours.
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Sounds like good advice. These sort of jobs are very hard to come by in Korea, are they very common in Taiwan or a matter of playing a waiting game?
Sorry to hijack your thread Jzer, but it is on topic. |
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TaoyuanSteve
Joined: 05 Feb 2003
Posts: 1028
Location: Taoyuan
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| Posted: Thu Jan 20, 2005 4:24 pm Post subject: |
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| JZer wrote: |
| Well I will find some time. Maybe I will spend a few hours studying instead of drinking so much. Plus what else would I do on Saturdays or whatever day I do not work. Anyways I am hoping to start taking Chinese in February at my University while I finish my Master's degree in German Literature. |
It's been my experience that people who work too many hours are not successful at studying the language. It's also been my experience that once a week studying doesn't work. Remember, I am here and you are not. I am basing what I say on experience. You are basing what you say on what you THINK you will be able to do. If you work as many hours as you say you want to (and you don't know what ramifications that will have), you will likely be unsuccessful in learning Mandarin. The best way to learn is to go to class everyday, or at least several times a week. The average person here who gets as many hours as you seek is doing mornings in kindies and evenings in cram schools. That schedule effectively eliminates any available time in your day to attend classes, to say nothing about energy levels. Saturday classes are also likely not sustainable as you are probably going to want to relax a little on your weekends and/or socialize. You think you will be able to pull it off. I say it's a tad ambitious and likely not realistic. You need to decide what is important: maximum hours at work for high salary or effective language study. You seldom can do both effectively. You may also want to listen a little more to what some have been trying to tell you here. 40 teaching hours a week is nuts for someone who has no interest at all in language study. It's impossible for someone who wants to learn the language. |
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JZer
Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3898
Location: Pittsburgh
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| Posted: Thu Jan 20, 2005 9:16 pm Post subject: |
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TaoyuanSteve
Wrote:
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| The best way to learn is to go to class everyday, or at least several times a week. |
I agree with this. Mandarin is a hard language to learn and I fully agree that the best scenario is several times a week.
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| It's been my experience that people who work too many hours are not successful at studying the language. It's also been my experience that once a week studying doesn't work. Remember, I am here and you are not. I am basing what I say on experience. You are basing what you say on what you THINK you will be able to do. |
Well Taoyuan Steve, I am sure that you know more about Taiwan than I do but you are going a little over board about what you know and what I know. Are you an expert on Mandarin? Have you learned any other languages? You really have no idea what I know and you do not have to be in Taiwan to know something about learning foreign languages. This is knowledge that is transferable (i.e. something one does not have to be in Taiwan to know). As for the job market and working in Taiwan, I will believe everything that you have to say because I cannot learn about it from outside the country.
Hey I might have the basics of Mandarin down by the time I arrive in Taiwan. I really do not know how long it takes but some people have told me that after you have the basics down you can learn most of the things you need to know through conversation. |
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junkmail
Joined: 19 Dec 2004
Posts: 377
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| Posted: Thu Jan 20, 2005 11:20 pm Post subject: |
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| JZer wrote: |
| I really do not know how long it takes but some people have told me that after you have the basics down you can learn most of the things you need to know through conversation. |
Of all the people I've met in Korea, even the people who have been here for years, only one has picked up the language intuitively. His girlfriend is Korean and he has a talent for language. Maybe you are talented like him but most people are not. I got the basics of Korean in the first couple of months with alot of hard work but I never progressed beyond this.
Also, teaching English is strangely enough, not ideal for learning the language as you become very proficient at getting your point across without using the native language of your target group.
Oh.. and then there's learning to read and write.
Anyway, as has been said before; go there and work out what's best for you. |
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TaoyuanSteve
Joined: 05 Feb 2003
Posts: 1028
Location: Taoyuan
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| Posted: Fri Jan 21, 2005 12:20 am Post subject: |
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Double post.
Last edited by TaoyuanSteve on Fri Jan 21, 2005 12:22 am; edited 1 time in total |
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TaoyuanSteve
Joined: 05 Feb 2003
Posts: 1028
Location: Taoyuan
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| Posted: Fri Jan 21, 2005 12:21 am Post subject: |
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NZer, you ask alot of personal questions; any reason why? Yes, I've learned other languages. Why is that relevent here, though? Am I an expert in Mandarin? No. But, compared to alot of expats, I am pretty good at the language. Ultimately, your questions are somewhat rhetorical in nature and have somewhat of an insulting tone to them (not appreciated BTW, considering I'm only trying to help).
I'm not claiming to be an expert on foreign language learning. I do know English teaching in Taiwan, though. I also have the benefit of having lived here several years and observed how both myself and others have progressed re: Mandarin. You are not even here yet, but you think you can work what others have already told you is a manic schedule (even for somone not studying on the side) and still manage to study the language efficiently. I am telling you that I have observed alot of people who have worked similar schedules and, in all cases, they have had neither the time nor the energy to learn. But you can go on believing that you are somehow better than everyone else before you.
As for your claims that you will be able to step off the plane here proficient in even the basics of the language after taking a couple courses ahead of your departure, all I can say is LOL! |
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