Job Discussion Forums

wangtesol · Joined: 24 May 2005 Posts: 280

Jim, claiming to know what unions want yet not ever having been a member of a union in Japan is ridiculous. Do you want to be known assome sort of advice guru who knows even better than the organizations themselves? This is very common on web forums and listservs: these sort of yodas who take a little bit of public knowledge (like from a website) and then make sweeping assertions based on no insider knowledge.

That's great that you are promoting the March in March, but this is a time for unions to try and network, and you are personally using the opportunity to create your own network. Don't you think this is a conflct?

You have absolutely no credibility when it comes to talking on union matters. If people want to check his anti-union comments in the past, check out his comments on the Berlitz collective agreement. It should be in a thread named "post you labour disputes here."

I wrote:

angrysoba · Joined: 20 Jan 2006 Posts: 446 Location: Kansai, Japan

wang is a ridiculous elitist who doesn't fight for anything but his own ego.

Boycott the march

wangtesol · Joined: 24 May 2005 Posts: 280

Yes please, if you are a rat, do not go to the March in March.

Angrysoba, here is a joke in French on noodles...

Qu'est qu'on dit une bain avec un professeur et un policier?

Soupe de poulet et nouille.

angrysoba · Joined: 20 Jan 2006 Posts: 446 Location: Kansai, Japan

nice one wang

i asked you a legitimate question earlier on and you decided to make some snide response. After that I didn't think you were worth taking seriously.

chirp · Joined: 03 Dec 2005 Posts: 148

Wang,

You should work on your French... wrong verb, "bain" is masculine and "nouille" should be in the plural.

And please stop calling people "rats" - it's tiresome.

angrysoba · Joined: 20 Jan 2006 Posts: 446 Location: Kansai, Japan

[email protected] · Joined: 22 Apr 2004 Posts: 67

As long as the main focus of teachers' unions is to help incompetent teachers keep their jobs, they'll get no support from me.

Despite all the hot air from a few people on this site, the fact is that the number of teachers who have joined the various unions in Japan amount to about one percent. Isn't freedom of choice a wonderful thing?

I hope it rains on Sunday.

JimDunlop2 · Joined: 31 Jan 2003 Posts: 2286 Location: Japan

Doglover · Joined: 14 Dec 2004 Posts: 305 Location: Kansai

Jim

just a little postscript here.

I was not renewed at my part time university job this year and am looking for another one. i actually resigned and then asked for my job back. They then refused. To add insult to injury they sent me a very flowery letter thanking me for my positive contribution last year but sorry, F--k off. This is because i participated in a legal union strike at my work place. Im no incompetent, as I hold down a full time job and over 15 years university teaching experience. This is my second full time position.

Same said university is nw appearing in a court near you to answer charges of illegal labor practices, unfair dismissals and generally unprofessional behavior. this is one of the top five private universities in Kansai.

As for me, one more year and I will be out of a job. The union can not save my job nor those who are being fired (and they are not incompetent they have five years of unblemished work record at the school which simply treats gaijin as expendable. Whatever you think of unions, they have also saved the jobs of a lot of people and also made working conditions better for teachers. You should have been here in 1989 before teachers even had a union and schools did what they like and teachers were powerless. Now at least schools like NOVA and AEON act according to the law, even if that law is personally inconvenient to you. You can not cherry pick which state laws you choose to obey, just because you are a short term foreigner.

[email protected] · Joined: 22 Apr 2004 Posts: 67

I apologize . . . . for my statement that I hope it rains tomorrow. I didn't really mean that.

But I did mean everything else. Sorry, but I have just personally seen too many examples first hand of teachers' unions fighting hand over fist to save the job of a teacher who was clearly incompetent. A detailed example is given in my post on the 3 year rule in Japan. The teachers' unions ALWAYS try to save the teacher's job; the students and the employer ALWAYS get no consideration.

Of course there are some high minded and principled people involved in unions. There are also some high minded and principled people involved in the Republican Party in the States.

Silly labor laws guaranteeing job security irregardless of competence are the reason western Europe is falling behind N. American in productivity. Portuagal is the prime example, where it is impossible to fire anyone for any reason after they have been employed for longer than three months. Portugal has 60% of the per capita income of other western European countries, which are all falling behind the U. S. And in the U. S., the largest company in the world (General Motors) will soon be in Chapter 11 because of the "Me First," attitude of their labor unions.

There are a lot of things wrong with the plight of foreign workers in Japan- wages, dispatch companies, the inability of almost any of us to work at a Japanese company for more than three years. (Interestingly enough, Interac is one of the few that do keep some people on more than three years- yes, "bad old Interac" has several happy teachers who have been there a decade or more).

As I have said before, I would like to see the end of dispatch hiring of ALTs in Japan. But that will not happen until the labor laws are changed to allow directly contracted teachers who are deemed by management to be incompetent to be replaced. Again it is the teachers' unions who are fighting this.

We need some government action in these areas. The teachers' unions are just another selfish interest group that care only about their own pockets and not education in general.

Again, the proof is in the membership numbers. It's a free chioce . . and 99% of teachers have chosen not to join.

wangtesol · Joined: 24 May 2005 Posts: 280

Gimp you have made it clear in the past you are an anti-union voice. Who cares what you say?

[email protected] · Joined: 22 Apr 2004 Posts: 67

"Nobody cares what you have to say."

"And you are just a pro-union mouthpiece, probably even paid to do this kind of thing."

That's the kind of intelligent debate we expect out of you, Wangtesol.

No, I'm not paid to do this kind of thing. I do it because I believe unions generally have become part of the problem, not the solution. I do it because a handful of union fanatics dominate this web-site and give people who come here looking for reasonable advice the wrong impression of Japan. I even know a guy who changed companies before he came here because of the lies told by people like you about dispatch companies.

Yes, some of us happen to believe that the trend towrds more private education in the world is a good thing. I've worked in government run schools where the teachers were unfireable. The quality of education was disgraceful.

Enjoy your march today, Wangtesol. With a couple of hundred people there, you might delude yourself into thinking that you have some support.

One percent indeed.

stillnosheep · Joined: 01 Mar 2004 Posts: 2068 Location: eslcafe

Gimp. You would prefer a world without unions. as would many employers and managers who would prefer their employees to be in a weaker position when running roughshod over their rights. Are you by any chance school owner or manager concerned that an increase in EFL unionisation might prevent you from continuing with your illegal employment practices?

After long arguments about the illegality of his/her latest brainwave whether it be unilateral rewriting of a contract, non-renewal, refusal of legal holiday entitlements/end of contract bonus/whatever there is little to beat the satisfaction of seeing the bosses face change when you appear to concede their point with a "Well, while I am sure that what you say is incorrect, still I appear to be unable to get you to see this. Luckily that's what I pay my union dues for so I'll just give my union a ring and let you discuss it with them from now on!".

One of the reasons that so many Japanese workers join unions is that they know how much power unions have when it comes to encouraging employers to stick to their legal and contractual obligations. Many EFLers realise neither this nor how often problems occur, until it is too late.

Join now. Reap the benefits later, if neccessary.

[email protected] · Joined: 22 Apr 2004 Posts: 67

I don't believe employers should be allowed to run roughshod over workers.

I just think that it is the role of GOVERNMENT to set the rules and protect workers rights, not unions.

If you don't like the rules or the way they are being enforced, change the government.

When unions start caring about job quality and competence instead of protecting only their pocketbooks and their members- regardless of their ability to teach- then I might support them. As it is, they are only another self- interest group.