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mondrian
Joined: 20 Mar 2005
Posts: 658
Location: "was that beautiful coastal city in the NE of China"
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 Posted: Sat Jun 03, 2006 3:12 am Post subject: |
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| Yu wrote: |
| What are your motivations for wanting things to change. Backwards has worked for the past 5000 years here, why because you feel a little uncomfortable should anything have to change. |
Chinese education for Chinese citizens. You cannot expect to change the whole infrastructure of their behaviour towards one another from within. As FTs we catch the tail end of it by getting SOME of the same treatment.
I think that the next generation of Chinese professionals with their greater knowledge of Western practices will herald a change, albeit a slow one.
One just has to see the average shopper here at the checkout handing over money to the cashier. It is usually thrown down on the counter, without a smile and the change scrutinised as if counterfeit jiao are being passed back. To change that attitude in the citizenry is going to take a long time. |
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Malsol
Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 1976
Location: Lanzhou
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| Posted: Sat Jun 03, 2006 3:16 am Post subject: |
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Every admin at my current uni has studied abroad.
There is still no change, no progress, no modernization.
We teach modren business management they practice 5,000 year old traditions.
China is always changing but China never changes. |
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Lady Penelope
Joined: 11 Feb 2006
Posts: 34
Location: Rolling around the world
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| Posted: Sat Jun 03, 2006 12:13 pm Post subject: Frustations, moi? |
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Frustations? What frustrations?
I like:
Being given extra days holidays (compulsory) then finding I won't be paid
Being given holidays I have requested in advance then finding at the last minute that they have been cancelled without telling me
Having new students foisted on me without warning half way through a course
Being told I must be at a certain class by a certain time, arriving to find that the times have changed without warning
I could go on, and on, and on.............
Fortunately this job is not a long term career change - well given the way I've been treated in the last 12 months, I've been put off permenantly. And before you start making comments about whinging youngsters, I'm in my 50's with loads of work experience behind me. But I've never been so glad to be leaving a job in my life! |
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Gorak
Joined: 29 May 2006
Posts: 69
Location: SW of Khabarovsk
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| Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2006 12:27 am Post subject: Re: Frustations, moi? |
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| Lady Penelope wrote: |
Frustations? What frustrations?
I like:
Being given extra days holidays (compulsory) then finding I won't be paid
Being given holidays I have requested in advance then finding at the last minute that they have been cancelled without telling me
Having new students foisted on me without warning half way through a course
Being told I must be at a certain class by a certain time, arriving to find that the times have changed without warning
I could go on, and on, and on............. |
I think frustrations like these, for most FTs, are soon forgotten about (or laughed about) when we return to our home countries. |
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Lady Penelope
Joined: 11 Feb 2006
Posts: 34
Location: Rolling around the world
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| Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2006 1:32 pm Post subject: frustations |
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Gorak
I NEVER forget anyone who owes me money - nor do I ever laugh about it. The action of foisting an unpaid holiday, for instance, is illegal in the UK (& I speak as an ex-employer!). The actions of and attitudes of Chinese employers is, as far as I am concerned, very poor. I intend opening my own school in the UK in the next 2 years (not me teaching I must admit) and I have found the experience of working in China a useful guide as to:
a. How much trashy treatrment teachers have to deal with
b. The awful attitudes that schools seem to have here towards their employees (sometimes with the conivence of a western DoS who is too busy looking after their own interests to care)
Laughing it off allows too many employers off the hook and is an attitude that no teacher should encourage! |
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latefordinner
Joined: 19 Aug 2003
Posts: 973
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| Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2006 3:33 pm Post subject: |
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LadyP, go for it. I believe you've learned some valuable lessons and you're not afraid to benefit from them.
Gorak, one mark of a professional is the flexibility to smile and adapt to adverse circumstances. Another is knowing precisely where to draw the line and what not to put up with. Have another look at what some of the professionals are saying.
Malsol, one of the best putdowns I've ever made came at a chess club back in Canada. A local pundit was leading the group post-mortem of a game when I came in the room. He loudly proclaimed, "Don't tell me, I know. I've read the book on the French Defense" Someone who's now teaching in China couldn't help but ask the room, "Yes, you've read it, but did you understand it?" Please feel free to use as circumstances permit. Please do, I insist. This needs to be asked many times. |
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Gorak
Joined: 29 May 2006
Posts: 69
Location: SW of Khabarovsk
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| Posted: Tue Jun 06, 2006 9:58 am Post subject: |
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| latefordinner wrote: |
Gorak, one mark of a professional is the flexibility to smile and adapt to adverse circumstances. Another is knowing precisely where to draw the line and what not to put up with. Have another look at what some of the professionals are saying. |
I am happy that you use the word "some" as in some professionals doing midnight runners because of being asked to work an unpaid (makeup) holiday. Example, somebodyinflorida and countless others.
What do I say? After negotiating, fighting, pleading, etc. to try to get what one wants/deserves in China and failing; instead of doing a runner, maybe it is just better (in the long-run) to grin and bear it. Upon return to our home countries, I find that alot of my negotiations, fights, pleadings, etc. are forgotten or laughed about and I remember other more positive things about my China experiences (in teaching). |
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Gorak
Joined: 29 May 2006
Posts: 69
Location: SW of Khabarovsk
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| Posted: Tue Jun 06, 2006 10:10 am Post subject: Re: frustations |
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| Lady Penelope wrote: |
Gorak
I have found the experience of working in China a useful guide as to:
a. How much trashy treatrment teachers have to deal with
b. The awful attitudes that schools seem to have here towards their employees (sometimes with the conivence of a western DoS who is too busy looking after their own interests to care)
Laughing it off allows too many employers off the hook and is an attitude that no teacher should encourage! |
I agree with one-half - do not let the self-serving western DoSs of the hook as they should be on the same page as us. In my experiences, all of them (well, have worked under 3) could not hold a DoS position in their home countries and are gainfully employed in China.
As for the other 1/2, being the Chinese Administration, they are not on the same page as they are using another book. So, why not simply try to understand their book to gain insight into the Chinese culture? After such understanding, maybe we can be in the position to laugh off many differences? |
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vikdk
Joined: 25 Jun 2003
Posts: 1676
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| Posted: Tue Jun 06, 2006 11:11 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| What do I say? After negotiating, fighting, pleading, etc. to try to get what one wants/deserves in China and failing; instead of doing a runner, maybe it is just better (in the long-run) to grin and bear it. Upon return to our home countries, I find that alot of my negotiations, fights, pleadings, etc. are forgotten or laughed about and I remember other more positive things about my China experiences (in teaching). |
and for the FT who takes over, and us who are still here - will we get a laugh to - when will you passing your little jokes along to us - or is it more along the lines of passing the buck  |
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Hendahu
Joined: 27 Apr 2006
Posts: 69
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| Posted: Tue Jun 06, 2006 11:28 am Post subject: |
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| Frustrations are largely cultural. I pity the poor Chinese teacher at my school. They are treated like property, and are happy ( most of the time) to oblige their bosses. But overall life here is good. I am changing jobs because of my frustrations, but I am staying in China. This is a great place to live(most of the time). |
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