| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Ger
Joined: 25 Feb 2004
Posts: 334
|
 Posted: Fri Jul 07, 2006 1:39 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
Yamahuh
Wait until you have finished teaching the summer programme and you want the school leaders to pay you your final salary, what tricks, penny pinching might they try on you then when all your bargaining chips are gone? |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
yamahuh
Joined: 23 Apr 2004
Posts: 1033
Location: Karaoke Hell
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 07, 2006 2:00 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Ger wrote: |
Yamahuh
Wait until you have finished teaching the summer programme and you want the school leaders to pay you your final salary, what tricks, penny pinching might they try on you then when all your bargaining chips are gone? |
Waaaaaay ahead of you!
One of the things I've already negotiated is that the plane fare reimbursement and our pay for July is paid on the 15th of this month; classes don't finish until the 20th.
I'm getting wise to this China caper - however that being said I'll wait and see before I pat myself on the back too much  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
7969
Joined: 26 Mar 2003
Posts: 5782
Location: Coastal Guangdong
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 3:38 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
| She probably fully expected us to shrug our shoulders and sigh "Oh well, that's OK'. When I called her on it and demanded a meeting with the headmaster, effectively calling her bluff, she was backed into a corner and the only way out was to pay up and shut up. |
that is exactly what happened to me. being told that i had to work for july to get the months salary (even tho my classes ended at the end of june). i called their bluff, said i was prepared to work, knowing that there was no work to be done in july. the school backed off and paid up.
on a related note, my (former) colleague has been to the local authorities on a few occasions regarding our former school. he told me that he found out from the local foreign affairs office/psb/whoever they are, that these colleges receive government money to fund the hiring of their foreign teachers, to the tune of some RMB100,000 per year per teacher. if this is the case, then the more the school can cheat a foreign teacher out of the better for some school employee(s) to line their pockets.
anyone know if this public funding of public schools is true or not?
7969 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
struelle
Joined: 16 May 2003
Posts: 2372
Location: Shanghai
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 3:50 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
| She probably fully expected us to shrug our shoulders and sigh "Oh well, that's OK' |
You're right, and that's why I'm glad you didn't! When this kind of cheating and penny-pinching goes on, I often get taken by surprise, and I think that may be a big part of it. There are too many ways to get cheated and it's fruitless to make a list take pre-emptive actions - as they keep coming up with new ones! The only way is to be onto your game and call people on their actions like you did.
I'm in the same boat as you, actually, but you won't believe it that a *Western* employer is trying to cheat me of my travel allowance. I have a higher salary now with the job and school I'm at, and the stakes are a lot higher than when I taught EFL in the past. We're talking a $750 allowance actually, which was agreed upon as I'm not taking a flight home this summer, so the school is actually saving money by offering me this.
But it's not the amount that matters, it's the principle of fairness and not cheating people out of their money they are entitled to for working. That applies anywhere from migrant laborers in construction sites to high-class business executives.
So I wish I didn't have to, but it's time to fight for this money. And I will succeed, like I've done with Chinese employers in the past.
I suspect that employers in China, not necessarily Chinese per se, really don't like the idea of teachers doing freewheeling travel during their time off. They especially don't like it if the school funds such travel, even if the funds are totally, 100% legitimately arranged in a contract. Why is this? Jealousy? Generation gap? Hard to say, but you rarely, if ever, see these types taking the same travel opportunities so that gives you an idea.
All I can say is that a contract is a contract and you need to fight for what's in it. Otherwise, what's the point of having one in the first place?
Teachers work their butts off during the year and deserve a travel break. Nuff said.
Steve |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
wailingtraps
Joined: 23 Apr 2003
Posts: 69
Location: Back in the UK oh dear
|
| Posted: Sun Jul 09, 2006 4:49 am Post subject: |
|
|
govt funding of 100k a yr could be the norm in some places all I can say is that here in deepest,darkest Xinjiang most schools dont have FT's. My school has a licence to charge students extra for my services while most schools dont. I have met various other lofty types from other schools and they all say they cant afford an FT unless they get this licence. I know my school makes a fat pile of cash out of me(detailed in another thread..)
My school has been very good in terms of following the contract but still came up 4k short when it came to settling up at the end of year one. Ive been promised this cash when I come back but I was less than impressed. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
tofuman
Joined: 02 Jul 2004
Posts: 937
|
| Posted: Sun Jul 09, 2006 4:54 am Post subject: |
|
|
Said yamahuh: "To my mind, a deal is a deal."
Perhaps so, but to the mind of some Chinese [particularly those involved in hiring FTs], a "deal" is an opportunity to rip you off.
Cultural difference? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
adamsmith
Joined: 27 Jan 2006
Posts: 259
Location: wuhan
|
| Posted: Sun Jul 09, 2006 6:15 am Post subject: |
|
|
[quote] wailing traps
My school has been very good in terms of following the contract but still came up 4k short when it came to settling up at the end of year one. Ive been promised this cash when I come back but I was less than impressed.
[/quote]
How did they come up 4k short? I know from my last school and from other uni's that they pay you your summer holiday pay when you come back to the school in the fall. This is what they do for the chinese teachers as well when they are on holidays. It seems to be the one way they ensure that the teachers come back if they want their holiday pay.
I guess it relates to the trust issues they have with each other just as much as the distrust of us FT's. I am not saying it is right but I have discovered that the schools usually come through with this holiday pay. Also I do agree with it in certain ways as the teacher is only entitled to holidays if they come back for the second year. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
yamahuh
Joined: 23 Apr 2004
Posts: 1033
Location: Karaoke Hell
|
| Posted: Sun Jul 09, 2006 6:51 am Post subject: |
|
|
| tofuman wrote: |
Said yamahuh: "To my mind, a deal is a deal."
Perhaps so, but to the mind of some Chinese [particularly those involved in hiring FTs], a "deal" is an opportunity to rip you off.
Cultural difference? |
Communication breakdown?
Difference of perspective?
Sod that! Gimme mah money!!
 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
wailingtraps
Joined: 23 Apr 2003
Posts: 69
Location: Back in the UK oh dear
|
| Posted: Sun Jul 09, 2006 11:31 am Post subject: |
|
|
| the 4k shortfall was part of my airfare...a oneway ticket from urumuqi to Guangzhou to catch my plane back to the UK and the travel allowance.....all of which i am entitled to before i go.........I can see their logic.....they owe me 4k Im more likely to come back........my logic however works rather differently.......wont they do the same again next year when its time for me to go for good..???? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Sweetie Girl
Joined: 19 Jun 2006
Posts: 4
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 13, 2006 1:33 am Post subject: No travel Money .... |
|
|
Here... for those of you who are not sure exactly what I meant......the travel moneys in question are as follows......
1. Round trip to the USA ....Summer.......2005
2. Spring Festival 2006
3. One way tickect to the USA ...June 2006...
My university has done a 180 on me ....I have worked here for two years and they always paid all that I asked ......and now!!!!
I believe since I am leaving ...they or someone sees a chance to screw me.......I would not have believed that they would do this to me.......
There is a lesson here for all ...if you are leaving .....get everything up front....No matter how great folks have been in the past ......
Sweetie Girl |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
7969
Joined: 26 Mar 2003
Posts: 5782
Location: Coastal Guangdong
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
yamahuh
Joined: 23 Apr 2004
Posts: 1033
Location: Karaoke Hell
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 11:56 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Tomorrow's the day for my 'windfall' ... fingers crossed! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
HunanForeignGuy
Joined: 05 Jan 2006
Posts: 989
Location: Shanghai, PRC
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 4:20 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| 7969 wrote: |
| Quote: |
| She probably fully expected us to shrug our shoulders and sigh "Oh well, that's OK'. When I called her on it and demanded a meeting with the headmaster, effectively calling her bluff, she was backed into a corner and the only way out was to pay up and shut up. |
that is exactly what happened to me. being told that i had to work for july to get the months salary (even tho my classes ended at the end of june). i called their bluff, said i was prepared to work, knowing that there was no work to be done in july. the school backed off and paid up.
on a related note, my (former) colleague has been to the local authorities on a few occasions regarding our former school. he told me that he found out from the local foreign affairs office/psb/whoever they are, that these colleges receive government money to fund the hiring of their foreign teachers, to the tune of some RMB100,000 per year per teacher. if this is the case, then the more the school can cheat a foreign teacher out of the better for some school employee(s) to line their pockets.
anyone know if this public funding of public schools is true or not?
7969 |
I can confirm that this Bejing public funding is quite true. The amount however can vary but it tends to average RMB 12,000 per teaching month per teacher (includes salary, housing, incidental expenses, etc.).
And the scenario you raise is perfectly plausible.
One of my previous schools was NOTORIOUS for finding reasons why they should not pay the teachers on time, why they should not perform any repairs in the teachers' apartments, why they should discount the teachers' pay, etc. And it was even worse -- they began charging the FTs for picking them up at the airport upon arrival, for every iincidental amount incurred in the visa process; in one case they were so bold as to even charge the FTs for their lunch during the visa process.
Now -- they howled and maintained that this was all in their perfect and legal right. And yet they lived in the biggest, most expensive apartments that you could imagine. came to work by chauffured car, and one even paid for the most expensive MBA in China on a monthly salary of RMB 1,500. One doesn't need to be blind to draw conclusions.
When they tried to pull these same stunts with the last pay of some of teachers, a min-brouhaha almost ensued. And do you know what? Mr. RMB 150,000 MBA ex-humble clerk "agreed" that "he would make all the difference from his own pocket" (the amount being withheld from pay). Now -- what does that tell you?
Another universities and high schools at which I have worked have been completely honest "to the last dime", however. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
yamahuh
Joined: 23 Apr 2004
Posts: 1033
Location: Karaoke Hell
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 6:08 am Post subject: |
|
|
Well today we're 25K richer (plane fare and one month's salary for teaching 15 days)!!
WooHoo!! 
Worked to perfection they paid up without so much as a whine, snivel or whimper. Of course I could have done without the audience of staff members leaning over the table watching me shoving wads of cash into my backpack; that kinda stuff always makes me feel guilty...
Oh well; the moral of the story is 'have a backbone and stand up for yourself, if you don't nobody else will"
If you're owed it, DEMAND it!!
 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
struelle
Joined: 16 May 2003
Posts: 2372
Location: Shanghai
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 8:40 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
Oh well; the moral of the story is 'have a backbone and stand up for yourself, if you don't nobody else will"
If you're owed it, DEMAND it!! |
Good advice, and definitely a must. I've said it before, but if a contract isn't honored by both parties then what's the point of having one? At least by sticking up for what you're entitled to, you make the contract process more worthy for the next guy.
On a much smaller scale, you can argue the same for why taxi drivers should use meters. If they don't, and expect you to bargain hard for a fair price, then why install a meter in the first place? For show?!
Likewise, a contract is not just for show, it's part of a legally binding agreement to be honored by both parties.
Steve |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
