Job Discussion Forums

[bryanzth]

Hi all,

This is actually my first post here, and I'm just settling in to the group. I am from the States, Chicago actually, and I will later post my profile a little more completely.

My experience has been relatively positive, but I have been blessed to have a nice bunch of friends, family and colleagues in Lima. There is nothing like having a network, lemme tell you.

I have to make comparisons all the time. I make them with my experiences in Chicago, Vancouver-BC, Europe and some downstate smaller cities in Illinois. I live in Miraflores whenever I am in Lima. While my family can drive us anywhere in Lima, I will still ride a bike in favor of driving or of taking the buses.

1. I wish that Lima had a centralized listing of buses. Even if they weren't centrally owned, I need a system map. You have to kinda know what bus goes where first, but then you have to have ridden the bus to see where it goes. Maybe I need to just experiment, hahaha. I will miss the "L" (metro, subterr�neo, tube) of Chicago.

2. I know that the economy is different and that while the US has very different economies in the city centers than in the suburbs, but in Lima, there is vastly different set of extremes. I appreciate some of the lower prices, but I wonder how some people can "make it" with the low prices. But then I wind up in a Latino neighborhood in Chicago, and I see those same low prices. Hint, US suburbanites, if you want a good, cheap haircut in Chicago, go into La Villita ($5.00 vs. $14.00 at SuperCuts in the burbs). I have to remember to be part of the Lima economy rather than trying to impose my gringo economic impressions on Lima. I think my last haircut in Miraflores in the market street was S/.8.00.

3. I am scared to death of the stomach bugs. Each time I have visited, I have gotten ill sometimes once, sometimes several times. The last time was the worst. Just a single leaf of lettuce in McD or Bembo's can be my downfall and it will take cipro and/or immodium to stop the problem (and cipro scares me too, each time I take that stuff, I fear that I will create a superbug). But when I stay longer, I hope that I will develop the resistance that a month visit doesn't give me. My family will get sick, too, from one thing or anther, and so it is a part of being there. I have to remember, comida cocida s�lo! no comida cruda nunca!

4. I have good net connections when I am in Lima, so I generally don't have to worry about connectivity. The 220V still spooks me, but I am no longer scared of the pop of connecting to a wall plug.

5. I have only been in Lima during the Summer or Late Summer, but not in Winter or Late Winter. This next time I will be there in September. A friend of mine has said that just now in July they had a warm day of 20'C, so what the heck, that is like January in Chicago's Winter, where we have -17'C. I can bear 13'C even with a few warm chompas.

6. Now the last thing is the language. I presume this is an English list, so I won't code-shift into castellano. However the worst problem is listening and speaking, but if I can finally persuade friends to stop practicing their English with me, I can "go native." If I could get past my book Spanish and learn the jargon and street speak, I would feel better.

7. I am almost 1.82 mts tall, and so I stand out in my blue eyes and brown hair. I will never pass. I hope that I am not a magnet for pickpockets and robbers, but I know the "rules." My family in Lima has suffered armed robbery, and I have been in neighborhoods in Chicago where you don't go alone (man or woman) at night. I would say that block for block, Lima might map onto Chicago proper. Miraflores = Lincoln Park. La Victoria = Englewood. Barranco = Rogers Park. San Isidro = North Shore. I suppose that I will freak out after my first event, but I don't think that I will freak out during it.

Bottom line for me is that all over the world, people are people. There are asses and princes no matter where you go. But I find that the folks I have dealt with in Lima have been polite, fair and, well, interesting. I will use the golden rule. I don't intend to go looking for trouble, though.

Love the place.

--Bry

[RyanS]

just because im bored

1. Yes its a problem, but you can see on the sides of buses major stops. But Bus drivers will stop to pick you up and drop you off where you want.

2. And if you paid 8 soles for a haircut you got ripped off but so is everything in Miraflores. I got a good haircut for 4 soles.

3. You will be sick from end of first two weeks until about the end second month. I recommend eat everything, be sick, go on a strict diet until you feel better. And Bembos is gross expensive food. As a gringo, you can afford to go to the doctor.

4. I've been shocked many time by the electricity. It wont harm you unless you have a pace maker.

5. Trust me, its going to be hard to handle the winter. In Chicago, at -17C you have have hot showers and warm buildings. In Peru you don't. Despite there being no snow, it will be just as hard to handle a peruvian winter. Try taking a cold shower, when your house is 2C. But then again Miraflores people have all those nice water heaters and stuff.

6. Just learn a lot of words. If you spanish is bad, dont worry about tenses, just say everything in present tense and add en futuro or en pasado until you learn the tenses. If you don't know how to pronounce things though, you better learn and quick. The Vowels are very important.

7. You only plan on living with rich white Peruvians? All those districts you mention are for gringos and white elites. Well less so La Victoria, but still a richer neighbourhood.

Keep your purse, wallet close to you, with bags dont just go on the shoulder make sure to go around the head, buy one with a strong lace. Wallets in pockets visible to you.

Just make sure not to do things you wouldn't do in Chicago. A lot of gringos, go and do stuff when they wouldn't do in their hometown because they figure they can get away with it in Peru. Such as flashing money around, getting drunk without an exit plan, meeting and befriending strange people, carrying lots of money around and so on. And if you got family in Lima, use them. If you don't know the value of things, the language, or the area, its best to travel with friends and families

I lived in a poorer district for 6 months, never got robbed or had any problems. In tourist areas I was ripped off for taxis but that was a mini vacation to Trujillo, and didn't know the distances between areas.

Anyways

[naturegirl321]

HI Bryan and welcome to the boards.

I actually think that the bus system is organised chaos and once you get used to it, it works pretty well.

About low prices, hit Gamarra for bargins.

RyanS, I think it's great that you lived here live a "real Peruvian", however, realise that that lifestyle isn't for everyone. And you shouldn't feel bitter towards people who live differently than you, nor try to impose your standards on anyone else.

YOu're young, under 21, right? And recently married, how's the visa going for your wife as well?

I'm not much older, 24, we'll be 25 in August, but I've lived outside the US for 6 years, working for 5 and married for 1.5. As horrible as it sounds, money is a central part of life. YOu'll fight with your spouse if there's not enough money, coming up short at the end of the month is no fun. And since you married someone from a different country than you, you'll probably have to visit each other's family once in a while and plane tickets are super expensive, especially if you making the 500 USD or less a month.

And if you think that's bad, wait until you have kids. The same salaries now have to feed three mouths.

I live in MF, we were in Surquillo, then SB and now MF. Why? We'll it's in the middle of our jobs. I'm in LA Molina and my husband's in Lima. We looked for places around SB where we were living and they were about 50 USD more than what we're paying now.

As for MF being for gringos and white elites. There are plenty of Peruvians who live here as well, don't forgot than 20 years ago, Lima was still a smallish town. Those who bought property then lucked out.

I understand where you're coming from about money, I wish I didn't care that much about it, but then reality hits. My husband still hasn't meet my parents, the big reason? money.

[bryanzth]

Ryans

[RyanS]

I understand that some are used to a certain lifestyle. Certainly a lifestyle an income bracket lower than yours takes some getting used to. There are some luxuries I couldn't live without such as internet at times. Which I try to use daily, which i spend at least an hour a day reading news and topics of interest. Everyone has to gage what they can live with and can live without. I didn't think I cold live without hot showers, but I managed to force myself, but when fall hit, it was very hard for me to take a shower on a daily basis as such I was considering to buy an electric shower head but ended up not.

As for Asia... no racism? A last summer in January there was a big protest because rich whites who lived in the area were discriminating against blacks and people from the sierra and also poor people in general from enjoying the beach. So some anti racist groups rented buses to go to the beaches to protest by enjoying the beach themselves. When asked many refused to comment or said they want the "cholos" to go back to work. But the beach is public, all beaches in Peru are public land so anyone can go to the beach and enjoy them. Despite individuals and organizations trying to limit their access.

Punta Negra is kinda of touristy area where you can mind on New years, thousands of college aged kids abusing their bodies and getting destroyed to the point of needing to go to the hospital. But the beach isn't very good the water is strong.

To all those who live in Miraflores, I am sorry if I offend you, I just don't like the district, things were overpriced for me. I probably shouldn't be so open in attacking it as yes there are normal families on modest lifestyles and the majority don't live obscenely.

[bryanzth]

Hi Ryans,

Lifestyle: In 2002, I sold my house as the market for my skills where I lived was collapsing due to 9/11 and outsourcing. I sold it for the most anyone sold it there, yet a year later it was worth twice as much in the 1998 to 2007 real estate bubble. Just wait. I moved back with family in Chicago, and after about 45 days suffered the most serious medical illness--I almost died. After selling half of my stuff before I left the old house, I sold half of the remaining half. I gave things away sometimes. Now what I have is in my head, in books or computers, or clothes. At that time I became a believer in the simplification movement. (Ok, I do have an iPod mini.) With regards to Per�, I will take responsibility for what I have, not for what I don't have. I am done with that keeping up with the Joneses in the States. If someone wants to do that in the US, Canada or La Molina, that will be their responsibility.

Miraflores: Now, where I stay in Miraflores has hot water and all the techie expectations. I like Miraflores since it is so much like a place I had wanted to live but could never afford it: along Lake Michigan's lakefront. I have the Pacific Ocean in Miraflores! Now, the deal is that most of the houses in this zone are moderate, I would not call it upper class. However, the lakefront real estate is now completely unreachable. With regards to Miraflores, I will take responsibility for where I live, the company I visit with and the friends I make and keep in Miraflores. If someone doesn't like Miraflores, that will be his or her responsiblity.

Racism: In my set, I will be the tallest and whitest, typifying the gringo that I am. I have yet been given a nick, but it will come soon, haha, P�lido, Chato (Not), Gato, etc. But if anyone is "white" in Asia or in Punta Negra, it surely will be me, I don't like to get sun-tanned. However, I won't be able to say that my friends are rich whites at all... So with racism, I will take responsibility for the friends and acquaintances I have, but I will let them take responsibility for the racisms they have or don't have. I could even be the object of racism myself, but I won't have the time to worry about it. Remember, I almost died...

You want obscene living? Sse some of the McMansions, Faux Chateaus, and Polish Palaces being constructed in Chicago these days. They are replacing the modest cracker boxes made 50 to 60 years ago. Where a California-style ranch house was built for $21k in 1956, now in 2007 they are putting up estates from $880 to $1.2 million. Not to mention the *modest* priced condos and gentrified houses that are going up from Manhattan to Chicago to San Francisco for upwards of $3 million.

If you can get to this book/article, have at:

Daniel Brook (2007): The Trap: Selling Out to Stay Afloat in
Winner-Take-All America. Times Books. ISBN-13: 978-0805080650.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/daniel-brook/who-killed-the-teaching-p_b_54313.html
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/daniel-brook

Dan Brook explains a lot of what has been happening since the yuppies arrived (which I am not!)

"Still I think I'm doin' fine / Wouldn't it be a lovely headline / 'Life is Beautiful' on the New York Times"

Peace,

--Bryan

[puddin]

I love it but mostly because of the people I worked with. I had great fun in north Lima and will be returning in 10 days. The weather is crap, hopefully I'll get to see it in summer too.
Oh, and I love the bus system. No timetables necessary!