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sweeney66
Joined: 26 Mar 2008 Posts: 147 Location: "home"
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Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 5:30 am Post subject: |
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| Checked it out in the book store and gave it a miss. |
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cscx
Joined: 21 Sep 2006 Posts: 41
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Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 7:02 am Post subject: |
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I started reading it...I do like it and it's written with a more positive outlook than most things I've read. That being said, I think it is intended for foreigners looking to learn about Mexico City, and people who have lived there for awhile may not find it to be very useful.
But, then again, I'm not terribly far into it.  |
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MO39

Joined: 28 Jan 2004 Posts: 1970 Location: El ombligo de la Rep�blica Mexicana
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Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 3:40 pm Post subject: Re: review |
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| Phil_K wrote: |
| notamiss wrote: |
I agree; joven as an address is "young man," and is a casually respectful way to address someone. If anything, it could be slightly flattering to address a man of uncertain years as though he were young. |
Despite everyone telling me that it's flattering, it's one form of address that I'll never get used to! , |
Would you rather be addressed as "viejo", and not as a term of endearment?  |
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cscx
Joined: 21 Sep 2006 Posts: 41
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Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 7:10 pm Post subject: |
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So I couldn't wait until the plane ride and have read more...
One thing that strikes me as odd is his chapter about sexuality. He really plays up machismo, saying that men want women just like their mothers, but find that sexually unsatisfying and constantly cheat on their partners. He says that this is pretty much accepted practice.
Pretty broad statement. Also didn't really talk about what age range he was looking at. I have several male Mexican friends and they seem no different to me than my male American friends in terms of relationships. But, then again, we are all 20-something year olds.
Have you guys noticed significant generational differences within this venue? Do younger Mexicans tend to be more like their American/Canadian/British/etc counterparts, or do I just know a select few? |
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MO39

Joined: 28 Jan 2004 Posts: 1970 Location: El ombligo de la Rep�blica Mexicana
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Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 7:25 pm Post subject: |
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| From observation, chatting with Mexican female (and male) friends, and personal experience (even from my vantage point as a "mature" woman), I would have to say that machismo is still alive and well in Mexico, with exceptions, of course. Another problem for non-Mexican women here is that I think that Mexican men see us as "easy" targets for their not unconsiderable charms and behave accordingly with us. |
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dixie

Joined: 23 Apr 2006 Posts: 644 Location: D.F
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Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 7:34 pm Post subject: |
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| MO39 wrote: |
| From observation, chatting with Mexican female (and male) friends, and personal experience (even from my vantage point as a "mature" woman), I would have to say that machismo is still alive and well in Mexico, with exceptions, of course. Another problem for non-Mexican women here is that I think that Mexican men see us as "easy" targets for their not unconsiderable charms and behave accordingly with us. |
"Easy" meaning what? I know how many a Mexican man has taken the word to mean when applying it to me, or other foreign females! |
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MO39

Joined: 28 Jan 2004 Posts: 1970 Location: El ombligo de la Rep�blica Mexicana
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Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 7:49 pm Post subject: |
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| dixie wrote: |
| MO39 wrote: |
| From observation, chatting with Mexican female (and male) friends, and personal experience (even from my vantage point as a "mature" woman), I would have to say that machismo is still alive and well in Mexico, with exceptions, of course. Another problem for non-Mexican women here is that I think that Mexican men see us as "easy" targets for their not unconsiderable charms and behave accordingly with us. |
"Easy" meaning what? I know how many a Mexican man has taken the word to mean when applying it to me, or other foreign females! |
Ah, dixie, you know what I meant. That we'll jump into bed with them at the drop of a hat, or perhaps an especially endearing "piropo"! |
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Prof.Gringo

Joined: 07 Nov 2006 Posts: 2236 Location: Dang Cong San Viet Nam Quang Vinh Muon Nam!
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Posted: Thu Jul 03, 2008 4:07 pm Post subject: |
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Has anybody found this book for sale in DF yet?
I would like to have a copy...
About the macho thing... When I was taking my TEFL course in Chiapas I went out one night in Tuxtla Gutierrez with the other teachers and students who all happened to be white females. The reactions of the Mexican men in the street shocked me...
They had no shame at all. The stares, obscene gestures, piropos etc were closer to something I would have expected from hardcore prison inmates, not supposed Mexican "gentlemen". Even the men that were with their wives and girlfriends acted as if they didn't exist and went bonkers at the sight of some gringas. A really disgusting show of machismo from crude men. The women that were with me told me they were grateful to have a man with them because the show and behavior of the men in the street was usually much worse...  |
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MO39

Joined: 28 Jan 2004 Posts: 1970 Location: El ombligo de la Rep�blica Mexicana
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Posted: Thu Jul 03, 2008 4:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Prof.Gringo wrote: |
About the macho thing... When I was taking my TEFL course in Chiapas I went out one night in Tuxtla Gutierrez with the other teachers and students who all happened to be white females. The reactions of the Mexican men in the street shocked me...
They had no shame at all. The stares, obscene gestures, piropos etc were closer to something I would have expected from hardcore prison inmates, not supposed Mexican "gentlemen". Even the men that were with their wives and girlfriends acted as if they didn't exist and went bonkers at the sight of some gringas. A really disgusting show of machismo from crude men. The women that were with me told me they were grateful to have a man with them because the show and behavior of the men in the street was usually much worse...  |
I wonder what part of town you were in since you describe the men as "crude". That kind of behavior sounds a bit over the top even for Mexico. I also wonder if this display of the macho male at its worse is more common in some parts of the country than in others. Nothing like that happens where I live in the D.F., but maybe that's because they're used to seeing the occasional non-Mexican woman walking around, women who are often their neighbors! |
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Guy Courchesne

Joined: 10 Mar 2003 Posts: 9650 Location: Mexico City
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Posted: Thu Jul 03, 2008 7:23 pm Post subject: |
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| Construction workers seem to be group that fits the profile here, though that's true of Canada too. |
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MO39

Joined: 28 Jan 2004 Posts: 1970 Location: El ombligo de la Rep�blica Mexicana
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Posted: Thu Jul 03, 2008 7:29 pm Post subject: |
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| Guy Courchesne wrote: |
| Construction workers seem to be group that fits the profile here, though that's true of Canada too. |
Maybe Tuxtla has an over abundance of construction workers in its population. In the US construction workers also fit this profile, though it only happens to women who walk by their worksite in daytime, not at night when they're out with their wives and girlfriends! |
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Prof.Gringo

Joined: 07 Nov 2006 Posts: 2236 Location: Dang Cong San Viet Nam Quang Vinh Muon Nam!
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Posted: Thu Jul 03, 2008 9:49 pm Post subject: |
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| MO39 wrote: |
| Guy Courchesne wrote: |
| Construction workers seem to be group that fits the profile here, though that's true of Canada too. |
Maybe Tuxtla has an over abundance of construction workers in its population. In the US construction workers also fit this profile, though it only happens to women who walk by their worksite in daytime, not at night when they're out with their wives and girlfriends! |
That's what I saw in Tuxtla, not a very friendly place, unless you happen to be a white woman...
Those guys were from all different backgrounds. I've seen it all over Mexico, just not as bad usually.
I have also received the "hate" stare when out with my wife. Mexican men will try to make eye contact and give me the meanest, most macho hate filled look... I usually respond by giving my wife a nice deep kiss just to p!ss them off some more. I guess Latin women are reserved for macho's while gringas are fair game for the great Latin liars...err..lovers |
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Guy Courchesne

Joined: 10 Mar 2003 Posts: 9650 Location: Mexico City
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Posted: Thu Jul 03, 2008 11:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Hmm...I never experienced that while married to my Mexican wife. In fact, the norm would be random people chatting us both up and commenting how amazing it is that a Canadian lives here with his local wife. Maybe there's a difference there between Tuxtla and DF. |
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Prof.Gringo

Joined: 07 Nov 2006 Posts: 2236 Location: Dang Cong San Viet Nam Quang Vinh Muon Nam!
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Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 2:22 am Post subject: |
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| Guy Courchesne wrote: |
| Hmm...I never experienced that while married to my Mexican wife. In fact, the norm would be random people chatting us both up and commenting how amazing it is that a Canadian lives here with his local wife. Maybe there's a difference there between Tuxtla and DF. |
No, because I never spent much time in Tuxtla, only my first month in Mexico was spent in Chiapas. All of my time has been in Tijuana, Mexico City, and a month in Quretaro.... A short span in SLP.
I notice the bad looks don't really happen in my fresa middle-upper class neighborhood... mostly in the poor, naco areas... |
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MELEE

Joined: 22 Jan 2003 Posts: 2583 Location: The Mexican Hinterland
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Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 3:07 pm Post subject: |
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Last night I asked my husband if he thought guys on the street envied him when they saw us together. He said yes certainly. Then I asked him if he thought gringas were easy and he said, "now, no way, before yes."  |
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