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Adam J
Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 11
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 Posted: Sun Jan 25, 2004 11:58 pm Post subject: |
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Wow! Thanks for the prompt feedback everyone. I'd like to clarify a couple of points from my original post that I now realize are confusing.
First:
International School Services
http://www.iss.edu/edustaff/jobs.html
This company is my first choice for getting a job in Japan. JET is the more realistic employer, however, because ISS will only be hiring a handful of people to work in Japan next year, whereas JET hired 1,367 new employees just from the US last year. I think ISS is great if you are open minded and don't care where what country you end up working in, but as a means for becoming employed in Japan I just don't know how realistic it is for me. ISS have three big recruitment fairs each year. I wouldn't know if I had a job until the day of the fair. One of my colleagues worked for this company for three years (although he was placed in the Canary Islands) and had nothing but good things to say.
The good things about ISS are that you are a "real" teacher designing and teaching your own lessons and running your own class "American-style". ISS requires candidates to have two years teaching experience to even apply (which usually means a teaching credential and two years experience). This is good from my point of view, as I think it would increase the professionalism of fellow teachers and possible employers. I think the pay would be comparable to what I currently make, whereas JET would be less.
The downside to ISS is more competition for positions, and the possibility of paying my way to the New York City recruitment fair (from California) with no guarantee of employment. ISS does allow candidates to choose where they want to live, but the choice is by continent, not country (or city).
Here are the schools that employed ISS people last year:
Japan, Fukuoka City, Fukuoka International School
Japan, Kobe, Canadian Academy
Japan, Nagoya, Nagoya International School
Japan, Osaka, Osaka International School
Japan, Sapporo, Hokkaido International School
Japan, Tokyo, American School in Japan
Japan, Tokyo, International School of the Sacred Heart
Japan, Tokyo, Nishimachi International School
JET is a great program. It is more appealing if you are 22 or 23 than if you are 28 like I am and used to teaching at a public high school. From a professional/growth point of view, it would be a step or two backward from my current job. I can deal with that, as long as I have a reasonable chance of finding additional work either teaching private lessons or doing something else that interests me. |
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Lynn
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 696
Location: in between
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| Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2004 12:00 am Post subject: |
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| I worked at the Honolulu International Airport for a Japanese company and I absolutely LOVED it! Yes, it was tough, but it was also exciting. Everyday we had so many stories to tell. And it was extremely fast paced, yet since it was Hawaii, it never got so hectic that it was unenjoyable. Everyone who comes to Hawaii comes for vacation so they are usually in good spirits. |
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Adam J
Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 11
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| Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2004 12:06 am Post subject: |
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fat_chris said:
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| Or you can just chuck it all and buy that house and start making babies! |
Negative! |
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Adam J
Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 11
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| Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2004 12:14 am Post subject: |
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april said
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Something I'm curious about...why do so many Japanese girls want to work in international airports? When I worked at Nova I had heaps of college girls tell me that they were learning English so that they could work as a Grand Hostess (I think that was the term) at Narita airport. I'm not being a smart-arse, I just don't get it. Was there a popular movie in Japan a few years ago that depicted this type of job as glamorous? Is there a celebrity who used to have this job? What's the attraction? |
April, my girlfriend says you are correct, the term is Grand Hostess.
She also says:
"American people don't understand what a Grand Hostess is. In America it is very easy, but in Japan it is difficult because there are fewer airports. Being a Grand Hostess is a status-thing for girls, like being a flight attendant, because you get to wear a cute uniform."
Also, Yuko in the past has said that airports are good places because there are happy people there. |
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Dr.J
Joined: 09 May 2003
Posts: 304
Location: usually Japan
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| Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2004 4:26 am Post subject: |
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| Let's not get too positive about working in Japan. You sound like an intelligent hardworking kind of guy so I'm just saying you might be a little surprised by the levels of incompetence and bureacracy you will find in Japan, especially in the English teaching industry. |
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cafebleu
Joined: 10 Feb 2003
Posts: 404
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| Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2004 8:26 am Post subject: |
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Adam , good luck with the job hunting. I live in Kyushu and I recommend Fukuoka`s easier going lifestyle, affordable rents, great food, not too many-not too few people size, and decent people.
The current job situation is the downside. There are so many jobs advertised for cities in Honshu and so few for Fukuoka. I do alright as I have lived here for a while, have always found enough work and have a partner who is also working. If you can land a job with the International School then go for it! If not, look at ohayosensei (the ezine of English teaching jobs) and various Japan job boards to see just how many full time jobs there are in Honshu cities. |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2004 8:54 am Post subject: |
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| Adam J wrote: |
Wow! This company is my first choice for getting a job in Japan. JET is the more realistic employer, however, because ISS will only be hiring a handful of people to work in Japan next year, whereas JET hired 1,367 new employees just from the US last year. I think ISS is great if you are open minded and don't care where what country you end up working in, but as a means for becoming employed in Japan I just don't know how realistic it is for me. ISS have three big recruitment fairs each year. I wouldn't know if I had a job until the day of the fair. One of my colleagues worked for this company for three years (although he was placed in the Canary Islands) and had nothing but good things to say.
The good things about ISS are that you are a "real" teacher designing and teaching your own lessons and running your own class "American-style". ISS requires candidates to have two years teaching experience to even apply (which usually means a teaching credential and two years experience). This is good from my point of view, as I think it would increase the professionalism of fellow teachers and possible employers. I think the pay would be comparable to what I currently make, whereas JET would be less.
. |
Adam, if i could clarify a couple of points:
the schools you mention above are international schools i.e. you will be teaching non-Japanese children, in English, regular subjects sucha s histrory drama, social studies. Most kids in an IS are native speakers of English, have native speaker parents or are in international families. Normally you need a teachers qualification from back home, classroom teaching experience etc to be considered. Obviously that sounds like what you have been doing.
JET on the other hand is teaching in a Japanese high school team teaching with a Japanese teacher, where you are teaching English 'conversation' or oral communication to non-English speaking kids. Big difference from an international school where you are teaching little Johnny and Mary, Science etc IN English. Comparing JET and an international school is like comparing apples and oranges, IMO. |
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Adam J
Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 11
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| Posted: Tue Jan 27, 2004 4:24 am Post subject: |
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PAULH -
I understand the differences between JET and an international school. You wrote an astute, concise comparison so I won't expand too much. I think running my own classroom will always be more complicated, and more rewarding (and should pay more). The X-factor with JET is class size and the number of different classes per week. That can either make JET "easy" or a complicated mess. I'm used to a class with 30 to 35 kids. If JET put me in schools with smaller classes, that would be great, but from what I understand JET puts employees in Japanese high school classes with as many as 35 or 40 students. I prefer bigger but fewer classes (which is one reason JET beats the NOVA system, in my opinion).
Personally, I wouldn't have a problem with teaching American children in Japan, but I know some people view this as an obstacle to their "Japanese experience."
cafebleu -
I download the current issue of ohayosensei every other week or so. I read all the new jobs and highlight anything I think is important. Off the top of my head, I can only think of one job advertised for Fukuoka in the past month.
Your description of Fukuoka sounds like a place I would enjoy living in much more than Tokyo or Osaka. I don't suppose there is a good taco truck in your neighborhood...(my roommate just moved to the Phillipines and he misses tacos the most out of anything).
Last edited by Adam J on Tue Jan 27, 2004 4:44 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Adam J
Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 11
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| Posted: Tue Jan 27, 2004 4:33 am Post subject: |
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Glenski -
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| Just what else did you think you'd be doing to retain your visa in that second year? If you work a regular teaching job plus privates, you'll have more than 50 hours a week with more commuting than 10 hours. And, you will have to be all of those occupations anyway, plus receptionist, accountant, tax advisor, etc. (for yourself). |
What I meant was, if I get hired by JET and have a less-than good experience after my first year, I will try to get a job at an Eikaiwa. The Eikaiwa jobs seem much more difficult to get for people in the US wanting to move to Japan. They seem like a good back-up possibility should JET seem too unprofessional, boring, easy, or annoy me with commutes to too many schools each week.
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Quote:
Any tips for how to transition from the American August to June school schedule to the Japanese schedule, and still make some money?
I really don't understand this question. If you get hired as a JET ALT, you will come in August, yes, which is the middle of the public high school year. What sort of transition problems did you expect? |
What I meant was this: how do people make the shift from a job that begins in August (US teaching job or JET) to a job that begins in April (Eikaiwa job). Do you go unemployed for eight months? Break your teaching contract with the US school or JET? I'm missing something...
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| Not always doom and gloom here, folks. These are the numbers I used. |
Your estimates seemed right on to me. That's what I expect. I can handle it. If it turns out to be less - great! Last year I worked 60 hours per week, plus the 10 hour commute, and I finished six semester units of college work. |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Tue Jan 27, 2004 4:44 am Post subject: |
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| Adam J wrote: |
PAULH -
I understand the differences between JET and an international school. You wrote an astute, concise comparison so I won't expand too much. I think running my own classroom will always be more complicated, and more rewarding. The X-factor with JET is the size and number of different classes per week. That can either make JET "easy" or a complicated mess. ). |
Adam
I dont teach on JET and I couldnt tell you with any certainty, but with my limited knowledge the X-factor will not be class-size but what plans the Japanese teacher and the board of education has for you. Foreign teacher roles in a class range from being a human tape recorder to choosing your own teaching materials and teaching your own classes. If you have no ELT experience (as opposed to teaching experience in an ordinary classroom) it can be quite difficult as well. Having classroom experience in the US will give you an edge, but you may not appreciate playing second fiddle to the Japanese teacher, who may or may not appreciate you being there. Success of the JET class rises and falls on the JE teachers support of what you are doing. You may not get all the independence and freedom that you would find in an international school, where you are the 'boss' of the classroom.
Contrary to what people believe, JEt is not an English teaching program but an exchange program where Japanese students can learn to mix and interact with foreigners. JET can be easy or complicated depending on the co-operation and foresight of the minions who post you to a particular school and how you get on with your Japanese English teacher.
For what its worth, my daughter attends an international school in Kyoto, and though I am familiar with the Osaka International school and Canadian academy they are very different in form and function than Japanese schools. My daughter attends both and they are like chalk and cheese. Classes are bigger in Japanese schools, and kids at OIS and Canadian academy will go onto US high schools and university.
If you want the 'Japan experience" Katoh Gakuen in Shizuoka runs a full immersion program in a Japanese elementary and high school. I have heard mixed reports about its effectiveness though.
, |
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Adam J
Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 11
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| Posted: Tue Jan 27, 2004 4:54 am Post subject: |
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PAULH -
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| You may not get all the independence and freedom that you would find in an international school, where you are the 'boss' of the classroom. |
That's exactly why my first choice would be a job with ISS, or another reputable international school employer. I've heard ISS is the largest, but I don't know if that is true.
| Quote: |
| Contrary to what people believe, JEt is not an English teaching program but an exchange program where Japanese students can learn to mix and interact with foreigners. |
I find this shocking. Are you serious? Why do they pay US $32,000 per year for the equivalent of a foreigner petting-zoo?
| Quote: |
| I am familiar with the Osaka International school and Canadian academy they are very different in form and function than Japanese schools. |
If you have any links or additional experience to forward my way, it would be greatly appreciated! |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Tue Jan 27, 2004 5:08 am Post subject: |
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[quoteJ What I meant was, if I get hired by JET and have a less-than good experience after my first year, I will try to get a job at an Eikaiwa. The Eikaiwa jobs seem much more difficult to get for people in the US wanting to move to Japan. They seem like a good back-up possibility should JET seem too unprofessional, boring, easy, or annoy me with commutes to too many schools each week.[/quote]
Whats your definition and criteria of unprofessional? JET, which is run by the Ministry of education, hires about 5000 JETs from 36 countries and has been sending foreigners to Japan since 1987.
Boring Easy? you are not being paid to be entertained. You are being paid to provide a human face to english and to assist a Japanese teacher of English. Most JET teachers will be sent to three or more schools during the course of a term, with some teachers only seeing students once every couple of weeks. I regularly have commutes of an hour or more each way.
If long commutes or boring jobs bother you- don't apply. Its called a JOB. Deal with it.
| Quote: |
What I meant was this: how do people make the shift from a job that begins in August (US teaching job or JET) to a job that begins in April (Eikaiwa job). Do you go unemployed for eight months? Break your teaching contract with the US school or JET? I'm missing something...
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For what its worth, the average teacher at one of the big eikaiwa schools works about 8 months and the turnover at NOVA is 50% in two years.
JET contract is 3 one year contracts and about 50% of JET teachers renew their one year contracts. Why are you deciding to quit JET before you have even started there? Isnt that putting the cart before the horse?
OK, you want to quit JET- no one is stopping you and you will be required to give up to 2 months notice so they can find a replacement (or they may simply not replace you until the next intake). Personally I think going from JET to eikaiwa is a major step backwards as the pay is less and the teaching hours are much greater.
Ditto the International schools. Im sure teachers come and go all the time. In the meantime what do the students at your international school do for a teacher? Do they figure into the equation? what happens if OIS or American International school can not find a replacement for you? Not your problem of course, but it would be nice if you could think of your students, the timing of the school terms at an international school and the needs of your school before taking a hike.
You can hand in notice, but you will need to line up a new employer and sponsor in advance, and have someone willing to sponsor your visa 8 months into a one year contract. Easier said than done.
I would not recommend being unemployed for eight months because
1. Living in Japan is expensive, and unless you have a rich grandmother you will find living here on no income a struggle.
2. You will not be able to collect any unemployment insurance unless you have been paying into the fund through your employer, and payments are linked to how much you have paid in, and your income. You cant just sign up for the dole and collect a check like you can in the US. |
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Adam J
Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 11
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| Posted: Tue Jan 27, 2004 5:56 am Post subject: |
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PAULH -
I think my desire to come up with too many contingency plans is creating some miscommunication. I'll be more direct.
My criteria for unprofessionalism is a job that pays me for looking like an American instead of my teaching and/or language skills. I found the quote below, from you, most shocking and will be re-visiting the JET website in the near future to familiarize myself with JETs mission in more detail:
| Quote: |
| Contrary to what people believe, JEt is not an English teaching program but an exchange program where Japanese students can learn to mix and interact with foreigners |
I want to teach. I don't want to be a human tape-recorder. That's why the international schools sound better, or more "professional" to me. It's the difference of a career (teaching) and a job. The position I have now has never been boring. Some days I want to smash things up, but boring it's not.  In the last few years I think I've made the transition between having a job and "dealing" with it, to having a career I like and can see myself doing for many years.
| Quote: |
| the turnover at NOVA is 50% in two years |
That's about the same turnover rate for a public school teacher in California. It didn't scare me away from becoming a public school teacher. 50% of marriages fail. So what? I'm not planning on moving to Japan permanently, though, so perhaps I will teach in Japan for two years and become another statistical casualty.
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| Why are you deciding to quit JET before you have even started there? Isnt that putting the cart before the horse? |
Yes, I am. I'm just trying to come up with a more specific plan than "I want to live in Japan and teach." I want to:
1. Make up my mind about where to apply for a job
2. Have a back-up plan in case I don't get the job
3. Have a pretty good idea what my options are if I don't like my job after doing it for one year.
I DO appreciate your comments. I'm not planning on bailing out of a contract, or abusing the system. I was just wondering how people make the switch, or if I was overlooking something about the school calendar. The limitations of typing into an electronic forum rather than having a conversation is creating some misconceptions, along with my overzealous contingency plans.
| Quote: |
| In the meantime what do the students at your international school do for a teacher? Do they figure into the equation? |
Again, there's some miscommunication occuring. I assure you my students are important to me. I know all of my 160 students first and last names. I call their parents on a regular basis. I care about my students. I work 50-60 hours per week when I'm contracted at 38. Tonight I spent 1 hour writing a letter to a parent why I thought her daughter, who is African American, should read To Kill A Mockingbird and not dismiss it as a "racist book".
Thanks again for your comments. They have helped me think about my options more clearly.[/quote] |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Tue Jan 27, 2004 6:18 am Post subject: |
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| Adam J wrote: |
My criteria for unprofessionalism is a job that pays me for looking like an American instead of my teaching and/or language skills. I found the quote below, from you, most shocking and will be re-visiting the JET website in the near future to familiarize myself with JETs mission in more detail:
. |
[/quote]
Well I would give the JET program a miss then.
Foreigners are hired for that reason- they are not Japanese, they speak English. Call it the dancing bear, dancing seal what ever you want.
In the Japanese high school the be all and end all of English education is preparing Japanese students for the entrance exam. that means the Japanese teacher teaching English grammar in Japanese. JET is in many schools but for many it is a side dish, where the students get to spend an hour with a gaijin once a week. you can teach them, but dont expect great results if you only see them once every three weeks. I teach at a university, have them for 26 weeks of the year and dont see much improvement in that time.
Not only that with limited or no Japanese you are restricted in what you can do with the kids anyway. On the JET program you will be respected becuase of your job status, the fact you are a 'sensei.
For more info on the JET program I recommend you read the book 'Importing Diversity: the JET program" by a guy called David O'Connell. it will tell you everything you need to know about JET but were afraid to ask (including the factoid that there have been about 3-4 suicides on the JET program by foreign teachers). available on Amazon.com
| Adam J wrote: |
| I want to teach. I don't want to be a human tape-recorder. That's why the international schools sound better, or more "professional" to me. It's the difference of a career (teaching) and a job. . |
[/quote]
Being professional I agree is acting and sounding like a teacher, standing at the front, acting authoritative. teacher centered and all that. thats what the Japanese teacher does. Professional is all about developing your teaching skills, acquiring qualifications, knowing your subject, attending teacher conferences.
Most people who go on JEt are not trained teachers, have never set foot in a classroom and no intention of being teachers after JET. JET is not about "teaching" per se but about exposing Japanese kids to english and foreigners. BTW Japanese teachers are complaining that JEts are worse than useless as they have no teaching skills and JTEs have to handhold these ignorant gaijin for three years here at government largesse. Maybe you can make a difference.
| Adam J wrote: |
| Quote: |
| the turnover at NOVA is 50% in two years |
That's about the same turnover rate for a public school teacher in California. It didn't scare me away from becoming a public school teacher. 50% of marriages fail. So what? I'm not planning on moving to Japan permanently, though, so perhaps I will teach in Japan for two years and become another statistical casualty.
y. |
[/quote]
Big difference between quitting a ESL teaching job and getting a divorce my friend. If you were married you would know what i mean, especially when kids are involved, speaking from experience (not divorced yet though)
| Adam J wrote: |
I DO appreciate your comments. I'm not planning on bailing out of a contract, or abusing the system. I was just wondering how people make the switch, or if I was overlooking something about the school calendar. . |
[/quote]
Personally if it were me, I would finish the JEt contract to its year-end completion, say you wont renew another year and look for another job in July or August. Eikaiwas recruit for teachers year round, you are in Japan so you shouldnt have problems finding work. Some here will say quit while the iron is hot, and each is entitled to their opinions. We are talking about being professional teachers here, and that doesnt include leaving our students in the lurch or switching horses mid-stream. |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Tue Jan 27, 2004 8:21 am Post subject: |
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| PAULH wrote: |
| Adam J wrote: |
My criteria for unprofessionalism is a job that pays me for looking like an American instead of my teaching and/or language skills. I found the quote below, from you, most shocking and will be re-visiting the JET website in the near future to familiarize myself with JETs mission in more detail:
. |
|
.[/quote]
Oxford Dictionary definition of professional :
connected with a job that requires special training or skill, one that needs a high level of education; well trained and extremely skilled.
Fact: You will be working with a certified Japan-born teacher who has a teachers licence, lots of teaching experience, speaks the language of his students, and probably teaches English as well. Trouble is he doesnt know how to teach spoken or communicative English. High school teachers have professional standards just like we do. Just becuase the lesson or the program might seem mickey mouse to you, or the goals of the program do not match your goals, or you are no more than window dressing in the scheme of things, doesnt make it unprofessional.
'Unprofessional' is dating your 15 year old students and turning up to work drunk.
Fact you will be working in a high school, not in a commercial eikaiwa, working with trained teachers.
Fact you are paid to act behave think and f**l like a foreigner, an American. that is the whole goal of the exercise, not to become a carbon clone of the Japanese teacher. I dont know how you can teach in Japan and not be an American as well. You are defined by what you are- a gaijin foreigner brought in to teach a bit of English and play games with them. The real learning for them and their priority, for the time being, will be to pass the university entrance exam, which at the moment does not include spoken english. JETS are icing on the cake.
| PAULH wrote: |
| Adam J wrote: |
| ]I want to teach. I don't want to be a human tape-recorder. That's why the international schools sound better, or more "professional" to me. It's the difference of a career (teaching) and a job. . |
|
.[/quote]
You just mentioned 5 lines down that you dont plan to stay in Japan, not more than two years and you wont make a career here. thats why JTEs and long term teachers like me here consider JETS and short termers as paid tourists. Why should you be accorded respect and all the perks when you dont plan to stick around? It is a job, you put in your hours, you get paid. thats what people do, including me. I have a job too, and had the same one here for 4 years. I have another 3 year gig lined up after this one. talking about having a career and then heading back home after 2 years is incongruous double talk. JET is NOT a career as its capped at 3 years. it is not meant to be permanent.
[quote="PAULH"]
| Adam J wrote: |
]
| Quote: |
| So what? I'm not planning on moving to Japan permanently, though, so perhaps I will teach in Japan for two years and become another statistical casualty. |
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.
Thats what I love about this board- give someone enough rope and they hang themselves eventually. So why should teachers here take you seriously or give you a cushy teaching job? Pay your dues like everyone else. I did. |
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