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Pitarou
Joined: 16 Nov 2009
Posts: 1116
Location: Narita, Japan
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 Posted: Thu Dec 03, 2009 10:44 pm Post subject: |
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There is excellent information about the health insurance situation at:
http://www.generalunion.org/branch?b=25
Every law-abiding resident must have National Health Insurance of some kind. Insurance bought from Shane does not count.
If that were not sufficient inducement to ditch the Shane insurance at the earliest opportunity, I should point out that:
1. If you are planning to stay in Japan for less then one year, koheko will cost only �3,500--�4,000 per month.
2. The cost will shoot up in the second year but, as of April 2010, you won't be allowed to renew your visa without National Health Insurance.
In short, ditch the Shane insurance at the earliest opportunity. |
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slodziak
Joined: 17 Oct 2005
Posts: 143
Location: Tokyo
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| Posted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 1:28 am Post subject: |
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| Pitarou wrote: |
2. The cost will shoot up in the second year but, as of April 2010, you won't be allowed to renew your visa without National Health Insurance.
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This situation has changed a little, Pitarou, although the General Union webpage doesn't acknowledge it. The guideline stipulating that visa renewal will be linked to proof of National Health Insurance coverage has been removed. See this: http://www.eltnews.com/news/archives/2009/11/immigration_gui.html
Even before the removal was announced it was beginning to seem unlikely that immigration were going to be as rigorous in their application of the guideline as the General Union claim; it was going to be considered along with one of 4 different criteria. There was certainly room for someone with Interglobal Insurance to fulfill the other 3 criteria (I'm sorry I can't recall what they were but probably included salary and city tax payments) and be qualified for visa renewal.
This doesn't mean a change in the law, you are basically right about the "law abiding part" but it does mean the grey area will continue to be grey. |
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ShioriEigoKyoushi
Joined: 21 Aug 2009
Posts: 364
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 12:41 pm Post subject: |
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Text deleted
Last edited by ShioriEigoKyoushi on Fri Mar 19, 2010 2:05 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Pitarou
Joined: 16 Nov 2009
Posts: 1116
Location: Narita, Japan
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| Posted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 12:57 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks. I wasn't aware that the MoJ had changed it's mind.
Do you know whether this has been officially confirmed? I checked the Ministry of Justice website, and Guideline No. 8 is still there (http://www.moj.go.jp/NYUKAN/nyukan70.html) -- or is that just an out-of-date press announcement? My Japanese isn't good enough to know for sure. |
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slodziak
Joined: 17 Oct 2005
Posts: 143
Location: Tokyo
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| Posted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 1:43 pm Post subject: |
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| Pitarou wrote: |
| Do you know whether this has been officially confirmed? I checked the Ministry of Justice website, and Guideline No. 8 is still there (http://www.moj.go.jp/NYUKAN/nyukan70.html) -- or is that just an out-of-date press announcement? My Japanese isn't good enough to know for sure. |
The website is dated March this year, the announcement by Kobe City Assembly was made in November. But, you are right, as of yet there doesn't appear to be anything official from the Ministry of Justice themselves. |
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womblingfree
Joined: 04 Mar 2006
Posts: 826
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| Posted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 3:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Pitarou wrote: |
| as of April 2010, you won't be allowed to renew your visa without National Health Insurance. |
That's interesting. How will eikaiwa that have dodged this for decades manage to get out of it this time? |
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mushroomyakuza
Joined: 17 Sep 2009
Posts: 140
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| Posted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 5:43 pm Post subject: |
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| Pitarou wrote: |
Every law-abiding resident must have National Health Insurance of some kind. Insurance bought from Shane does not count. |
Is this confirmed? That the insurance with Shane would not count as a legal requirement of health insurance? And that health insurance is required?
If this is true I don't see how they could argue with that really. |
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ShioriEigoKyoushi
Joined: 21 Aug 2009
Posts: 364
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 11:15 pm Post subject: |
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Text deleted
Last edited by ShioriEigoKyoushi on Fri Mar 19, 2010 2:04 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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| Posted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 11:27 pm Post subject: |
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http://www.eltnews.com/news/archives/2009/11/immigration_gui.html
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The Immigration guideline requiring foreign nationals to be registered with government health insurance in order to have their visas renewed is to be withdrawn and sent back to the drawing board. A few weeks ago the Kobe City Assembly sent an official communique to the national government. This, as well as an overwhelming backlash from the foreign community, certain lawmakers, as well as organizations like the Free Choice Foundation led to the outcome.
Free Choice has been leading the campaign to get the guideline withdrawn. Kaj Schwermer, Co- Chairman of the Foundation and Coordinator of ETJ in Osaka, reported to the ETJ discussion list that 'Although not quite the end of the road, as the guideline will most likely be re-written at some point, this is a significant step forward for all of us concerned about human rights and freedom of choice here in Japan and I would like to thank all of those who had the courage to stand up and make their voices heard. I�d also like to thank all the people who came forward with suggestions on how to improve our message and gave constructive criticism. The response to our little campaign has been overwhelming. For all the naysayers out there who believed we were tilting at windmills from the outset, I have three words for you: YES WE CAN!' Free Choice is now considering tackling other problems and issues facing foreigners living in Japan. |
For more info, go here http://www.freechoice.jp/immigration-guideline-8.asp
So, eikaiwas and dispatch agencies will continue to be able to dodge their obligation to offer shakai hoken. |
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Pitarou
Joined: 16 Nov 2009
Posts: 1116
Location: Narita, Japan
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| Posted: Sat Dec 05, 2009 12:20 am Post subject: |
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| That's interesting. How will eikaiwa that have dodged this for decades manage to get out of it this time? |
With ease. As long as an eikaiwa can claim that their staff work less than 30 hours / week, they don't need to offer shokai hoken. Staff who want to go legit will have to buy their own kokumin kenko hoken instead. In case you're wondering, except for in the first year kokumin kenko hoken is a much poorer deal.
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Is this confirmed? That the insurance with Shane would not count as a legal requirement of health insurance? And that health insurance is required?
If this is true I don't see how they could argue with that really. |
This has long been a legal requirement. No question about it. See, for instance, the website of the Social Insurance Agency. However, there have been no real sanctions for breaking the law, so many schools have chosen to ignore the issue.
It looks like change is coming. The Immigration Bureau has announced that, from April 2010, health insurance enrolment will be a condition of visa renewal. This has caused an outcry because, if enacted, the policy will force a lot of experienced English teachers to either pay many years of insurance backpayments or leave the country.
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| The Immigration guideline requiring foreign nationals to be registered with government health insurance in order to have their visas renewed is to be withdrawn and sent back to the drawing board. |
The report Glenski links to is based on a single source: a campaigner's account of his telephone conversation with a politician. (If anyone knows of any official announcements, please tell us!) It's not unequivocal, either. There is nothing to suggest that the Bureau have abandoned the idea.
I don't think this will go away. Sooner or later, the Bureau will start demanding evidence of social insurance, although there will probably be a partial amnesty on backpayments when it is first introduced. |
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Pitarou
Joined: 16 Nov 2009
Posts: 1116
Location: Narita, Japan
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| Posted: Mon Dec 07, 2009 10:56 am Post subject: |
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Going back to the Original Poster's concerns about being too confrontational, there are ways to say it without raising too many hackles. How does this sound?
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You need me to have health insurance. If I cannot demonstrate that I have organised my own, you automatically enrol me in your scheme.
I have decided to do as the locals do, and join the Japanese National Insurance Scheme (kokumin kenko hoken) as soon as I become resident in Japan. Before I become resident, I will be covered by travel insurance.
If I show you my travel insurance documents, state my intention to enrol on National Insurance, and show you my National Insurance card as soon as I have it, will that meet your requirements? |
It's best not to mention the legal aspects. You might find that's a bit of a touchy subject at the moment. |
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