Job Discussion Forums

[waxwing]

[Elkythedogsperson]

fluffyhamster, johnpartee and johnslat�

This was a serious post about a person�s serious concerns. It was honest and revealing.

Please stay on topic.

[santi84]

I teach Korean and Chinese immigrants in Canada. I don't know about hiring practices in Korea or China, but weight/obesity is not a taboo subject in those cultures like it is in North America. It is fair game for discussion.

In other words, they think the same thing as your North American counterparts - they just don't hesitate to say it I am fairly thin (around 5'5, 115lbs) and my weight was often brought up by students, mainly about how "ideal" it was (from the Korean ladies usually). They had no hesitation using the "fat" word when describing others, including other instructors!

If you would like to teach in Asia, I do not think your weight will be an issue when it comes to hiring, as long as you don't have thin skin when it comes to the comments.

[fluffyhamster]

Elky, the Zone is a very good approach to nutrition that should be even more widely read and known than it already is, and I wasn't therefore mentioning it as a means of getting at the OP, who has my sympathies (understanding?) regardless of whether he himself would be interested in it or not, but rather simply as a means of gauging the interest TEFL teachers take (or can literally afford to take) in good nutrition. I'm sorry if raising an apparently new but IMHO related topic appeared as unthinking hijacking, but I can assure you that my (and I believe at least Johnslat's) intentions are generally good rather than bad! 0:^)

As for the original topic, I guess that employers in general would prefer people to be healthier (i.e. slimmer) than not, but not having been too overweight (nor were any my colleagues in each job I've had) I ultimately couldn't really know what e.g. Chinese and Japanese employers in particular might actually think, and I am sure that the OP will encounter exceptions either way to what anyone might say/reassure him of here on the forum. One thing I can say though is that I have got the definite feeling that quite a few employers will certainly take youth over experience (i.e. I for one feel I'm getting old at least!).

[gaijinalways]

I've had students comment on when I lost weight (I was on the banana diet here in Japan). The Atkins has been somewhat disproved as useful diet approach. As to 'the zone', if you're 'in it', you don't need to diet (well at least that's what I tell my 'underweight always on a diet' students)!

Elkythedogsperson posted

[johnslat]

Dear Elkythedogperson,

"fluffyhamster, johnpartee and johnslat�

This was a serious post about a person�s serious concerns. It was honest and revealing."

Umm, that's exactly why I posted my ironic reply to johnpartee (whose post was, I hope, also meant ironically.) Sure, it's very easy to SAY "Eat less and exercise more," but as anyone who's ever had an addiction knows, walking the walk (so to speak - and walking IS great exercise) is so much harder than talking the talk.

Now, Elky, I'm a dog person, too: a three year old Lhasa Apso and a seven year old Corgi/Border Collie mix. So, since we share that, I'll refrain from any further comment.

Regards,
John (who has his own addiction)

[johntpartee]

Of course I was being ironic. I would never make light of anyone's jones. I'm a former fatty and an alcoholic who doesn't drink. I'm well aware that MAJOR behavior modification is needed for any addiction or compulsion. Fortunately, it can be done.

[johnslat]

Dear johnpartee,

OK, I guess we really have to start putting up "IRONY ALERT" notices for those challenged in that department.

Oh, by the way: IRONY ALERT

Regards,
John

[china-1994]

Well when I arrived in Beijing in 1994 I was a slim guy of about 140 pounds, now I am a hefty 220. I get a lot of polite "you're strong" a euphemism for being fat, while some others are more crass, and simply say fat.
In traditional societies being fat meant a higher class of living, so it was a good thing-just as white skin, or tanned skin came to be.
But in Asia the Caucasian that is fat, is generally not seen in that light,they're seen as poor, lazy, or unhealthy.
I believe entry-level ESL jobs require a very good image.that requires a higher level of attention to presentation of self.

[Qaaolchoura]

It seems that I gave people the impression that I think I'm too fat to teach English. So to reiterate: I'm quite certain that I can and will lose the weight I need to, at the rate I've lost weight when I'm not in a depression (when I gain weight), or too busy to actively lose it, I'm certain I can drop most of it in a year. In the meantime, it's one factor I'm using to decide where to teach. If you look at my post history, you'll notice that I've been asking about numerous factors that occur to me.

Any rate, it sounds like Europe is generally pretty similar to America (which is bad and good in some ways), while I'm getting very mixed messages on the Pacific Rim.

Having strangers point out to me that I'm fat is not a problem. Frankly, part of the reason I got so fat as a teenager was that people would insist that I wasn't fat, and join them in eating things I shouldn't be. Having students causing trouble or complaining to my employer on account of it is more problemative. Getting to China and having my employer say "Actually, you send the wrong message to prospective students, being fat, we're tearing up your contract," is a problem.

So you see why I ask in advance?

[fluffyhamster]

Perhaps the best way to gauge a potential employer's reaction, without needing to risk having a contract torn up shortly after arrival etc( ), would be to submit a full-length photo alongside any headshot during the application process (even if they don't ask for either) - assuming "of course" that your headshot alone wouldn't be "revealing" enough, for these (your) ostensible "gauging" purposes.

About "being too fat to teach English", personally I wish it weren't an issue really at all, but do bear in mind that keeping up with young kids (an age group which EFL teachers are increasingly expected to teach) can be a bit tiring at times, and that Asia can be a pretty humid place even for the more in-shape!

I mean, I once had a Japanese employer suggest that I take a towel to class rather than even occasionally pat my face on my lower shirt sleeve - me, I'm not sure what would've looked worse, and didn't want to presume to turn the class into a veritable locker room! I did notice however that that guy's office lady seemed to think that he was a bit out of line to be so nit-picking (she looked at him a bit askance from behind whilst he was talking to me) - it was a pretty hot day, and I'd had to be in super-genki mode to help impress some observers who'd been attending that particular lesson along with the boss.

[gaijinalways]

I think also fluffy that is a situation that applies to some places where I work where they seem to like shutting off the AC later in the day regardless of the temperature in the classrooms. Not that I think the school is cheap ,
But they don't seem to consider that part of teaching does involve moving around more and checking on students progress and study habits (I'll take that 'magazine' for later study, thank you).

[Dinah606]

Much as I hate to admit it, I�m quite large, and prior to coming to China I was also worried that I would have difficulty finding a job, or that whatever I found wouldn�t be at all decent. Actually, when I started I was one of three female teachers at my school who would fall under the category of obese. In all honesty, I think it doesn�t project a good first impression, and I think its likely that the students and other staff had a slightly negative view of the three of us when we first arrived. However, this can be overcome. If you do your job very well, and in a way that keeps the students happy, interested, and learning, then that is what people will see. I think that I�m well regarded at my school -- at least, they were eager to keep me on for a third year. One of the other two girls was also incredibly well regarded, and was considered one of the top foreign teachers at her branch. The other girl was an average teacher, who showed up and did reasonably solid lessons, but didn�t do much beyond that. Other teachers who did the same amount of work as she did were, I think, automatically better liked in part because they were thinner and therefore more what the kids and parents were imagining when they decided to pay for a foreign teacher.

What another teacher said about making sure you have thick skin if you come over here is definitely true! The kids I teach, as well as co-workers, are not at all shy about pointing out anything about my (or anyone else�s!) physical appearance -- If they don�t like the shirt you�re wearing one day, they�ll tell you. If you get a zit, they�ll mention it. If your teeth aren�t perfectly white, that�s open for discussion too. My students, who are quite young and have a limited vocabulary, tell me I�m fat at least a dozen times a day. However, they also tell me the like/love me just as often. It�s just something you have to get used to, take in stride, and not worry too much about.

(At the risk of sounding like a commercial, I�ve lost nearly 30 pounds on the move-to-china diet. I�ve still got a long way to go, but as that can�t be accomplished in one night, I stand by the above advice.)

[Qaaolchoura]

Fluffy--thanks, that might be a good idea. Unless I really draw my head in like a turtle, I don't have a double chin. And I'm not horribly out of shape despite being fat. I'm better at a lot of physical activity than some of my chain-smoking friends. But yeah, I might want to find out about air conditioning. Even when I was skinny, I preferred below-freezing weather to anything above 75. Part of me would like to go to Mongolia, if I could find a job there. It's funny though, I read an article a couple months ago about people who were getting hypothermia, because Chinese offices keep things too cold. I suppose it depends on the school.

Dinah, I can believe the Chinese diet bit. I lost a surprising amount of weight when I went to Mexico both times I went there on vacation. And my ex-anorexic Chinese friend was complaining that she gained ten pounds since coming to the States, since it's impossible to get real Chinese food, or anything she'd consider healthy except for salad in the US.

And yes, I know all about Chinese bluntness. I went to China as a kid, and in Xian, a boy came up to my father (I was the thinnest one in the family, until my parents divorced and my mother lost a lot of weight), pulled open his coat and declared "You are big!" And people (mostly women) kept coming up to my red headed brother rubbing his hair, and giving my parents their camera to take a picture with him.

[cassava]

Qaaolchoura:

You are worrying unduly about a mild problem that is well within your ability to resolve. All that you need to do is to stop eating the crappy diet of refined sugars and simple carbs that is killing North Americans. You need to eat meat from grass-fed rather than grain-fed cows, plus lots of complex carbs such as vegetables, while supplementing your diet with some good omega-3 fats from fish oil or flax seed oil. If you walk briskly, don't jog, for forty minutes every day and follow the nutritional advice I have given, your weight problem will disappear.

Your situation could be much worse. For example, if you happened to be four feet tall, or if your face was covered with warts, or if your skin colour was pitch black, or if you were paraplegic, then you would experience the kind of hatred and hypocrisy that would make you fully realize the true nature of the world in which we live.