Job Discussion Forums

[jimi1999uk]

[FrenchLieutenant'sWoman]

I just checked and they're phasing out the courses that go with the qualification in Applied Linguistics, so if you want to do that one (making an assumption) you have to register for E303 and E854 by September and complete them before Dec 2011.

Tough but doable if you're quick.

[scot47]

I know someone who has an MA in Teflology but no BA. He has sometimes had problems persuading employers that this is legit.

[nickpellatt]

[Sudz]

Thanks for all the replies!

I'm still in the decision process. Good to hear of some success stories with the MA-only route. I understand that SOME employers would not overlook the 'missing' BA, though I'd like to know how common this would be (a tough question I know!)

Surprised to hear of success stories within North-America!

Would really appreciate if there are any others who can add to this thread...

[powerrose]

My 2 cents - Some employers may not even notice the missing BA. I've seen it advised on HR blogs that you can drop "older" qualifications, so you could just let people assume. By the way, I don't see why I, a teacher with 3 years experience and the most worthless (to me personally) unrelated BA from a good school should be considered in any way superior to someone with more experience than me without a degree.

If I were you, I would get the Masters now because you have a good chance of finding a well paid job with it. Yes, you'll probably have a number of encounters where your lack of BA will lose a potential job, but I really think it will just be more difficult, but not impossible.

Once you've got the job, just get the silliest distance BA you can. Get it in basket-weaving or art history or something pleasurable to you personally.

As far as I see, you could invest in the Masters and get a great job and may never have to worry about a BA, or you could get the Masters, realize you need the BA after all (but can still find some decent jobs) and in the end you'll still have a Masters and a BA and years of experience.

[tttompatz]

Biggest worry is not the employer accepting or not.

Biggest problem is the visa process. More and more you will find countries are requiring the undergrad degree for the visa application as a matter of policy or law and they don't care about post grad work.

No BA = no visa in many places.

Alternatively, many places still don't care./

.

.

[Sudz]

Thanks for your input guys!

I'm thinking along the same lines as powerrose here, though I realize that tttompatz has a point.

You gave me some examples earlier tttompatz of countries which would 'definitely' require a 3/4 year BA for the visa. I'm sure you could be right about some of them, but I'd like to investigate each one individually if I could.

Not trying to question you, but a place like Japan - assuming you don't have 3 years of experience - on PAPER requires a 4 year BA. However, I've know people who've gotten past this with a 2 year AA - or even a 3 year General Arts Diploma (basically a high-school equivalency).

Take Viet Nam as well (a place I'm quite familiar with). On PAPER, they require a 4 year BA. However, I've known those with college diplomas (not a BA) and those with 3 year BAs - not to mention other ways of getting around this).

Also, I've heard stories of people working in the Middle East, and (surprisingly) North America as well with just this...

So I'm not trying to shoot you down at all, but I'm interested in finding out these places which would DEFINITELY not accept an MA for the visa process.

Btw I've also heard that Taiwan will allow a 2 year AA and a TESOL for the work permit. Perhaps they wouldn't allow an MA (would be a tad odd though....) Also I'd be very surprised if Thailand wouldn't accept this (you might be right though!)

[Sudz]

Sorry but I thought I'd bump this thread rather than starting a new one. I'm now in the 'critical' planning stages (whether or not to go through with this).

I've heard some good points from many of the posters. Just to recap a little:

Pros of doing MA TESOL:
-takes less time than BA
-can finish the on-campus program while continuing my current job (can fly in for the classes, as they're only a few days each, and only occur once every three months or so).
-more opportunities for teaching adults
-less money to complete (compared to the online degree I've been chipping away at)
- after earning the MA TESOL, I could apply for a work permit where I'm currently at, and could probably upgrade my job in the process. I am planning on eventually leaving however.

Cons of doing MA TESOL:
-visa issues in some countries (this is the main one)
-lacking the BA will limit my opportunities with employers in some cases (like the SNET scheme in Hong Kong)
-wouldn't be eligible for work in most International Schools (as far as I know)
-perhaps having the annoyance of having to explain to some employers (who ask) why I don't have a BA.

I think what I'm hoping to get is some first-hand knowledge of the subject from those in the know (second-hand would be desired as well). Of course, those currently in my potential FUTURE situation (not many) would be an ideal source, but they're tough to find. In any case, feedback of any kind would be appreciated.

Perhaps it should be noted that I'd like to (potentially) work in more than one country over the years (perhaps even several) throughout my time doing this.

[GambateBingBangBOOM]

Sorry, but I think the reality is that to have a long-term career in TESOL (TEFL or TESL) you're really going to need BOTH. That's just the way life is. And the reason why that's the way life is is because that's what the majority of the rest of the people going for jobs will have, and to get residency in a foreign country, you basically need that undergrad.

Since you seem to be sure that teaching English is the way you want to go, then you should probably finish chipping away at an undergrad in a related area (education [where applicable- a lot of the time education is a post-grad area], foreign language, intercultural communications, English, communications [PR, advertising, journalism, creative writing etc]). That way it can be of direct use in language teaching areas (including material development [by which I mean at the [text]book publishing level- editorial etc jobs]

[Sudz]

Thanks for the reply.

One question though. Assuming I'm ABLE to get residency/working status wherever (which is definitely doable in some countries), do you really think that - more often than not - an employer would hire the applicant with an unrelated BA over someone with an MA TESOL? Perhaps you're right, though I'd be surprised. I would think that even schools which 'require' a BA would happy to hire someone with a related MA. I'd be surprised if many employers would even care about the BA after knowing that the applicant has a more related degree ('many' being the key word, I know there are some). I'm not saying BA degrees don't have any value of course, but really most ESL teachers I know out here have almost completely unrelated degrees.

Working visa/residency aside, does anyone else think that an unrelated BA would be favored over an MA TESOL - or even if the BA were in English?

[Sudz]

I'm not dismissing earning a BA in the future if I found it to be necessary.

Here are the countries I've heard require a BA for the working visa:

Korea
Thailand

I'd be curious what other countries I could add to this? Vietnam is not on that list contrary to what some people believe.

[naturegirl321]

[Sudz]

Thanks Nature Girl.

Well assuming I'm accepted, I'm still leaning towards going for the MA first. I'm sure some employers might have a problem, but I'm quite sure I could find something respectable. Heck, I'm quite happy with the school I'm at now, and I managed to get in with just my TESOL cert and some experience

However, I would definitely consider studying something by distance education in the future - perhaps an English degree or something else that I may enjoy.

[BocaNY]

Sudz just a thought.... have you looked into schools that have a combo BA/MA program? They usually take 5yrs to complete and you get both degrees at once.