Job Discussion Forums

[7969]

[west2east]

The general consensus I hear is that teachers seem to think it is 'ok' to teach outside their contract. There are signs that the various government departments that manage working foreigners in China are slowly but surely tightening the screw. No matter how 'mickey mouse' the industry might be perceived, the standards are being raised. It's increasingly difficult for teachers to switch jobs without the release letter (thankfully). Employers (and I speak as one) are finding it increasingly difficult to find teachers as 'the dregs' that are being shipped back home create a void in their absence.

Many ESL teachers seem to label the industry as not maintaining much credibility, but surely that is only exemplified if the same said teachers deem it somehow 'OK' to earn an income outside the terms of their contract or Foreign Expert Certificate.

Where I work, if the school finds out a teacher is earning an income outside their contract in China, it is acted upon and has, in the past, resulted in dismissal. The message at the school is clear, if you don't like the terms and conditions as set out in the contract, then don't sign.

For those schools that apparently don't hold much value in their contracts,

[7969]

[Guerciotti]

[west2east]

7969

Here are responses where I understand what you are talking about as your tone is in parts patronising. If you're going to split hairs and use emotive examples such as "don't confuse.../selling drugs..." when it's obvious what I am talking about, then it ends here. Otherwise I will discuss the situation with you.

Nationally all government schools will have to submit applications that allow them to use foreign teachers. These applications eventually make their way to Beijing. This process takes around two years. This is going to leave some teaching positions very vulnerable. Yes there will be those school owners that know the right people and 'persuade' them to speed the process up. Others do not have that possibility.

True or not, I am not sure how much either of us can speak about how thorough schools are in checking credentials. But when demand for FTs (in my experience) outstrips supply so much, this will inevitably lower the standard. It's the FTs market and the school have to live with that.

It may be socially acceptable to break the terms of ESL contracts where earning income is prohibited, but that does not make it right legally on any level.

My personal opinion is that if anything on a contract is not enforced, then is should not be there. As it stands, it is on our teachers contracts and therefore enforced accordingly with our G&D procedures.

That completes my response to you 7969. Please pm me if you have anything you'd like to add.

[Zero]

I guess you are pretty careful about not taking the label off your mattress, too?

The original poster was not asking what his contract says. He can, indeed, read that for himself. He was asking whether, in real life, the provision is enforced. Clearly there are differences from country to country. Korea is notably strict, China notably lax. Admonitions to read the contract are very obviously non-productive.

[Delltron]

My contract has a clause stating the job allows outside employment.

[The Great Wall of Whiner]

I have an unspoken agreement with my boss that any extra work I do does not conflict with work nor compete directly with my school. So acting as a 'pretend friend' to some business guy, singing at night in a lounge, doing private classes, or preparing people for trips overseas is ok for me. Unsure what your contract says, but as others have already alluded to it, I'd just ask your school.

[therock]

[eslteach]

[Zero]

At Dave's, the person with one or two posts is very often a new incarnation of someone who was banned yesterday after a few thousand posts. So it isn't a very good indicator of how much one knows.

[Teatime of Soul]

[The Great Wall of Whiner]

Off-topic: There was a guy with 9,000+ posts once. Anda I think his name was.

On-Topic: I don't snub anyone; I look at the message, not the messenger. Safer that way, and it keeps the discussion civil. People may have been here 10 years and only just learned of this website, and they might have lots of wisdom to offer us.

True, they may be FOTB's (fresh off the boats) and unfamiliar with things in China (some have been here 10+ years and still live a sheltered life) but far and far, I tend to look at this community as civil.

For the most part.

As for jobs, do what you feel is right. But ask for advice. Absorb the advice, and do what is best for YOU, not for others.

[icwood]

I know from experience that you can't legally take second jobs in Japan or Korea, but plenty of people do and don't get caught. Being discrete is the secret, as with so much else in that part of the world.

[gmarthews]

OK, well thanks for all the responses.

For the record, I can indeed read my contract and in fact had done so before I started this thread, I was more concerned with the rules imposed by immigration than those imposed by my employers. I have spoken to my boss and he has no issue with me doing it.

Having just moved here from Korea I am well aware that second jobs can be extremely serious transgressions of visa regulations. It seems here that there is no such problem.

And for the poster that said something about my question being one of the problems of the ESL industry and ESL teachers, I'm actually a maths teacher.

For all the people who gave me un-biased advice and told me about their experiences, thanks heaps.