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How "pragmatic" is your teaching?
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spiral78



Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 11534
Location: On a Short Leash

PostPosted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 7:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks, but I'm a proficient walker already, having practiced the art for some years.

I've also got an effective level of knowledge of pragmatics, as they fall under the broader umbrella of ICC and as they affect my specific range of students, though I wouldn't claim to be an expert by any means - the field is simply far too vast and complex.

Perhaps the clearest input I can offer here is to simply answer the questions you put originally.

I was wondering how many of you address these differences (if you do ) in your teaching. Do you address them directly or indirectly?

We do. Overtly - it's a part of the curriculum across faculties.

First, I'm wondering how she teaches this subject as I can envision some real "cultural" landmines when teaching pragmatics.

Not sure what 'landmines' you envision, but the overall approach used in my situation is absolutely non-judgemental - there are a trillion ways to communicate - English speakers tend to do something in 'this' range and it can be useful for you, student, to know 'that' as it helps you to unlock the meanings of others and to communicate more clearly in international contexts yourself.

Secondly, I'm wondering how useful the training is as my impression of a lot of Japanese English teachers is that they often seem to ignore pragmatics in dealing with their native speaker colleagues (but who knows, maybe my sample data is skewed ).

I know very little about Japanese teaching contexts at all, but teaching myself in an international university, where 99% of students are non-native English speakers, but are all studying in English - here, there's a real need to understand and communicate on as many levels as possible.

I would guess that you are likely right - it could be very difficult to get across the importance of effective communication across cultures in a situation when students rarely need to actually do this - studying in home country and native language is an entirely different context.
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steki47



Joined: 20 Apr 2008
Posts: 1029
Location: BFE Inaka

PostPosted: Sun Nov 14, 2010 2:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Never Ceased To Be Amazed wrote:

The scenes of utter panic will last me a lifetime!

and I "worked" for NOVA!


Me too. Did four years at Nova.

I inadvertantally caused panic when I asked,
"How are you today?"
Shocked Shocked Shocked

Never mind natural greetings. "What's up?" or "How's it going?"-Fuggetaboutit!
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gaijinalways



Joined: 29 Nov 2005
Posts: 2279

PostPosted: Sun Nov 14, 2010 7:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

spiral78 posted
Quote:
Thanks, but I'm a proficient walker already, having practiced the art for some years.


I'm sure some of your students are proficient language users too. MOD EDIT ?


Quote:
Not sure what 'landmines' you envision, but the overall approach used in my situation is absolutely non-judgemental - there are a trillion ways to communicate - English speakers tend to do something in 'this' range and it can be useful for you, student, to know 'that' as it helps you to unlock the meanings of others and to communicate more clearly in international contexts yourself.


I'm wondering what that "range" is. I do think there are limits on types of communication in certain contexts, but I would agree the range is varied but somewhat limited in some cases. hence, I would think you might need to loan the students some of your judgement.

gaijinalways posted
Quote:
Secondly, I'm wondering how useful the training is as my impression of a lot of Japanese English teachers is that they often seem to ignore pragmatics in dealing with their native speaker colleagues (but who knows, maybe my sample data is skewed ).


spiral78 posted
Quote:
I would guess that you are likely right - it could be very difficult to get across the importance of effective communication across cultures in a situation when students rarely need to actually do this - studying in home country and native language is an entirely different context.


I agree, but remember these are the local teachers we're talking about, not the students. I am just wondering how far the lessons have sunk in.
I guess though, you can always ask the question; when we are in Rome, should we do as the Romans do?

In other words, should we follow Japanese customs in Japan even when we're using English?
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spiral78



Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 11534
Location: On a Short Leash

PostPosted: Sun Nov 14, 2010 8:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So, basically, this thread's for the Japan forum.
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steki47



Joined: 20 Apr 2008
Posts: 1029
Location: BFE Inaka

PostPosted: Tue Nov 16, 2010 1:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

spiral78 wrote:
So, basically, this thread's for the Japan forum.


No, but it has turned into a bit of a gripers' corner. Who happen to be teaching in Japan.

Feel free to join us and whinge about students in your neck of the woods.
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spiral78



Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 11534
Location: On a Short Leash

PostPosted: Tue Nov 16, 2010 4:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm a bit in between students at the moment, but over the past 12 years I've been blessed with students who are both interested in and have an actual need for anything that will help them communicate successfully in international contexts. I doubt I'd have anything useful to add to a whinge about trying to teach pragmatics to students who kinda don't really need it at the moment Shocked

MOD EDIT
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killthebuddha



Joined: 06 Jul 2010
Posts: 144
Location: Assigned to the Imperial Gourd

PostPosted: Wed Nov 17, 2010 3:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dackinator wrote:

eg. In France I would do things like pretend i dont know about the french revolution, say english wine is the best in the world, confuse French with Spanish, etc


For Your Amusement,

"'Bottle Shock' is a 2008 American comedy-drama film based on the 1976 wine competition termed the 'Judgment of Paris.' Sommelier and wine shop owner Steven Spurrier (Alan Rickman), a British expatriate living in Paris, concocts a plan to hold a blind taste-test intended to introduce Parisians to the quality wines coming from elsewhere in the world (and save his business in the process). He travels to the not-yet-famous Napa Valley in search of contestants for his Judgment of Paris taste test, where a chance meeting introduces him to floundering vintner Jim Barrett (Bill Pullman) of Chateau Montelena. Barrett wants no part in the competition, believing it is all a set-up designed by the French to humiliate New World wine producers. However, Barrett's son, Bo (Chris Pine), secretly passes Spurrier a couple of bottles of the Chateau's chardonnay for the competition."

Although it's Umerkin wine and not English, Rickman does represent the English here: "You think I'm an ass, but really it's just that I'm English and.....you're not."

--ktb
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gaijinalways



Joined: 29 Nov 2005
Posts: 2279

PostPosted: Sun Nov 21, 2010 3:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

gaijinalways posted
Quote:
In other words, should we follow Japanese customs in Japan even when we're using English?


spiral78 posted
Quote:
So, basically, this thread's for the Japan forum.


No, just poor phrasing of the follow-up question on my part. In other words, if you were teaching local language English teachers in your "neck of the woods", should they be following local customs in their usage of English, they shouldn't or perhaps some hybrid combination?

steki47 posted
Quote:
No, but it has turned into a bit of a gripers' corner. Who happen to be teaching in Japan.

Feel free to join us and whinge about students in your neck of the woods.


Sorry you feel that way, I had a legitimate question about how this kind of pragamatics training would be done, as I do think a lot of the Japanese English teachers need it (also some of them continue to think that if they're teaching English grammar, they're not teaching language, but that is another story). Cool

MOD EDIT
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Mr. Kalgukshi
Mod Team
Mod Team


Joined: 18 Jan 2003
Posts: 6613
Location: Need to know basis only.

PostPosted: Mon Nov 22, 2010 2:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Several offensive, off-topic and/or inappropriate postings have been deleted or edited.

Bottom Line: Stick to the topic and avoid the personal asides if your membership here is important to you.
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