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UVM feedback please?
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MotherF



Joined: 07 Jun 2010
Posts: 1450
Location: 17�48'N 97�46'W

PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 6:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You countered, High teacher rotation usually speaks for itself with but the teachers that I worked with had been with UVM for well over 18 months.

What am I supposed to read into it?

by using BUT and the expression "well over" you give the impression that you think staying 18 months is not high teacher rotation.

I work at a school with 15 English teachers. 5 of us have been here over 7 years. And only 2 have been here less than 12 months. So maybe my view point is skewed but I don't think saying well so-in-so has been here more than a year, is proof that they don't have a high teacher turn over rate.
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Gregory.



Joined: 27 Aug 2011
Posts: 39
Location: Mexico City / Tlaquepaque

PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 11:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MotherF I congratulate your institution for its recruitment retention rates.

However, you have to accept that this position is very much the exception, not the norm.

I think the key point here is your use of the word
Quote:
high


I don't think the UVM turnover rate is high. Let's agree to let readers of this thread decide.
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Isla Guapa



Joined: 19 Apr 2010
Posts: 1520
Location: Mexico City o sea La Gran Manzana Mexicana

PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 11:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Since Gregory doesn't work for UVM, I wonder why he seems so interested in their teacher retention rates.
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Dragonlady



Joined: 10 May 2004
Posts: 720
Location: Chillinfernow, Canada

PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 1:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Arrow

Last edited by Dragonlady on Fri Oct 07, 2011 4:20 am; edited 1 time in total
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Enchilada Potosina



Joined: 03 Aug 2010
Posts: 344
Location: Mexico

PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 2:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MotherF wrote:
Gregory. wrote:
Quote:
High teacher rotation usually speaks for itself


This is a valid point, but the teachers that I worked with had been with UVM for well over 18 months.

If I had to put a percentage on the numbers, I'd say 85% had more than 1 years experience with the institution. I also visited a number of locations.


Since when is 18 months a long time?

I was only there for a year but I imagine 18 months in the UVM feels like a lifetime. Not sure I'd be boasting about retaining teachers for at least 2 semesters though. Grotty language schools retain teachers longer.

With the UVM you have to consider that most teachers are Mexican. The high teacher rotation there is not just a load of whinging foreigners who can't hack the kids.

Follow the signs to the revolving door marked 'maestros'.
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Gregory.



Joined: 27 Aug 2011
Posts: 39
Location: Mexico City / Tlaquepaque

PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 2:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Isla - you're right... I don't work for the UVM. If you read my original post, it actually comments upon the institutions attempts to improve their language teaching through competence based teaching and assessment with portfolios, which is, in my opinion a really interesting approach to language teaching.

Lets not worry about exams so much, lets collect evidence of a students language ability. I really think this is something worth discussing.

Another poster brought up the issue of teacher retention. I just pointed out that I don't think the teacher turnover is as high as some would like to make it out to be. In fact, I met a teacher in Chihuhua who had worked for the university for 12 years. It's not all doom and gloom. Perspective.

Swings and roundabouts. Thats all.

DragonLady- I appreciate your attention to details. I didn't realise that you had noticed my absence. But I'm pleased to be back. Positive as always.

Quote:
With the UVM you have to consider that most teachers are Mexican. The high teacher rotation there is not just a load of whinging foreigners who can't hack the kids.


Finally, I don't really understand the quote above. It doesn't really make any point and it isn't very constructive. High teacher rotation or not, moaning students or not... my point is that UVM has a refreshingly different and interesting approach to language assessment.

I've learned quite a lot of very positive things from my time working with the institution.
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Dragonlady



Joined: 10 May 2004
Posts: 720
Location: Chillinfernow, Canada

PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 11:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Arrow

Last edited by Dragonlady on Fri Oct 07, 2011 4:35 am; edited 1 time in total
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Enchilada Potosina



Joined: 03 Aug 2010
Posts: 344
Location: Mexico

PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2011 1:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gregory. wrote:
Quote:
With the UVM you have to consider that most teachers are Mexican. The high teacher rotation there is not just a load of whinging foreigners who can't hack the kids.


Finally, I don't really understand the quote above. It doesn't really make any point and it isn't very constructive.

How do you know it doesn't make any point and isn't constructive if you didn't understand it?
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Gregory.



Joined: 27 Aug 2011
Posts: 39
Location: Mexico City / Tlaquepaque

PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2011 11:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Let's get this thread back on topic.

A thought occurred to me yesterday. It's important to remember that simply because a school doesn't have high turnover doesn't translate into a good teaching team.

Very often a school will have old teachers working for several years in the position because of 'golden handcuffs'- in other words they couldn't move to another school and receive the same benefits. So, good or bad, motivated or not, they stay in the same position.

This surely can't be good for students.

The idea that a school with low teacher turnover leads to a quality teaching team is rubbish. Pure rubbish.

The fact that teacehrs are not native speakers makes them less likely to complain or hack the problems is equally flawed.
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Gregory.



Joined: 27 Aug 2011
Posts: 39
Location: Mexico City / Tlaquepaque

PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2011 11:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
How do you know it doesn't make any point and isn't constructive if you didn't understand it?


Goodness me. Stop being trivial Enchilada Potisina.

If you care to read my original post I clearly state that I don't really understand the comment. Meaning I understand, I don't completely understand your point however, which is confused.

We have to consider UVM teachers are mostly Mexican? Well, newsflash, dude, in all schools here in Mexico English teachers are mostly Mexican.

So why should we have to consider this as more important at the UVM as opposed to anywhere else?

Why would the fact that this institution is NORMAL in its recruitment practices (in that they have mostly Mexican language teachers) influence the turnover rate- which again, I challenge you. I don't think it's high. I think it's average.

As I have just posted.... Having 5 old coots working for the same institution doesn't guarantee good teachers- it tells me more about the institution.

A final thought. UVM teachers are given contracts and these are renewed. Teachers performance is considered when the contract is renewed. This actually could cause turnover as the teachers who don't provide evidence of student learning are not invited to return. Could be why certain teachers are only in the school for 1 year.

Better to rotate teachers that to keep bad teachers, eh?

This is obviously different to not understanding.

But, could you explain your comment a little more?
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