Job Discussion Forums

[scoobydo]

"Those that pay RMB 150 - one for example regularly advertises on the website of That's Guangzhou - is an Aussie lady and her Chinese husband, and they have a high turnover of teachers. Just ask one of those departed why they left! (I nearly forgot - she doesn't advertise her name, but I will give you her first name: Yvonne)."

New Horizon (no relationship to the book) is the name of the school if I am not mistaken. Yes Yvonne does have a bit of an abrasive personality. You can be sure it is her if you meet her as her voice has a high nasal whine to it.

I have heard stories of her literally screaming at a teacher, at the school gate in front of the students, because he was late (he had phoned ahead and explained he was delayed in traffic). The one sided screaming match included Yvonne telling the unfortunate teacher how lucky he was to have a job.

There is a high turnover of teachers and most departures appear to end on very bad terms. She also has an unfortunate habit of gossiping about her teachers to all and sundry. She is best avoided mainly because she has an incredibly high opinion of herself while the vast majority of the teaching materials she sometimes supplies appear to have no English content whatsoever and largely consist of time wasting activities. Some students complain to other teachers that they dislike her class because they don't learn any English. Sadly she judges her teachers by a far higher standard than she can objectively produce herself, in spite of her smugly telling all her new teachers that she is a real teacher, and is constantly pushing for the maximum effort.

Her Chinese husband appears to be more reasonable however she appears to be the one wearing the trousers.

Incidentally she and her husband will drop part-timers at a moments notice if a full time (cheaper) teacher can substitute for your class. She still appears however to genuinely believe and clearly gives the impression that she is doing you a favor and you should be suitably humble and thankful.

All and all New Horizon and Yvonne are best avoided.

[prawn]

having worked at zhongshan, and elsewhere in the region i am speaking from experience. i was never paid less than 8000rmb a month, with all the usuals provided (accom, furnishings, appliances, visa, computer etc). while i was there there were not infrequent offers to work in gz at 8-10, and shenzhen for the same rates. the foreign teaching staff at each place i worked at included people who could not write a coherent sentence, and would have had no hope of being able to objectively evaluate their own language with a view to developing their pedagogical methods, even if were possible that such a thought could have occured to them. of course there were other very capable people also...i fell somewhere between the two extremes at that time.

its obvious to me that you, young man, are at least as capable if not far more so than some of the people i worked with in the aforementioned places , and i reiterate, if youre working for less than 8 and accom in that region, youre only there for holidays or for penance.

there is a continuous whining from certain quarters about low salaries in china and how foreign workers should accept similarly low rates of pay. well that full professor who only gets 70,000 a year also gets free food, free state housing, free overseas holidays, a big black car and driver and as many free beer and baijiu soaked lunches as he she can put up with. only the genuinely committed need do any work - and then only to please themselves. not only that, but university education in my country is expensive, as was my upbringing and all the other expenses that were accrued to bring me to a point where i could function as a competent educator. only an idiot would go to another country after that and give their services away away for next to nothing, whether already competent in the classroom or still developing. never mind that, china is not so cheap. it costs money to enjoy a comfortable life here, and if youre going to be working a lot, you need to look after yourself on a number of levels. some of these gunslingers dont know what theyre talking about. get over here and dont settle for pennies like the proles do.

when you get here, get around, walk in, say hello and socialise. resumees and the like arent valued here in the way that they are elsewhere. it's during the apparently casual social interaction that the hard decisions are made, and the tricky negotiations are conducted. do not bring your preconceptions of how things should be done to this place - at least dont try to enforce them here. plenty of others have done and are doing so and you can see the result in many of the submissions that you read on this site. ie it gets you nowhere. ps. i love china. (and i like this site to)

[prawn]

having worked at zhongshan, and elsewhere in the region i am speaking from experience. i was never paid less than 8000rmb a month, with all the usuals provided (accom, furnishings, appliances, visa, computer etc). while i was there there were not infrequent offers to work in gz at 8-10, and shenzhen for the same rates. the foreign teaching staff at each place i worked at included people who could not write a coherent sentence, and would have had no hope of being able to objectively evaluate their own language with a view to developing their pedagogical methods, even if were possible that such a thought could have occured to them. of course there were other very capable people also...i fell somewhere between the two extremes at that time.

its obvious to me that you, young man, are at least as capable if not far more so than some of the people i worked with in the aforementioned places , and i reiterate, if youre working for less than 8 and accom in that region, youre only there for holidays or for penance.

there is a continuous whining from certain quarters about low salaries in china and how foreign workers should accept similarly low rates of pay. well that full professor who only gets 70,000 a year also gets free food, free state housing, free overseas holidays, a big black car and driver and as many free beer and baijiu soaked lunches as he she can put up with. only the genuinely committed need do any work - and then only to please themselves. not only that, but university education in my country is expensive, as was my upbringing and all the other expenses that were accrued to bring me to a point where i could function as a competent educator. only an idiot would go to another country after that and give their services away away for next to nothing, whether already competent in the classroom or still developing. never mind that, china is not so cheap. it costs money to enjoy a comfortable life here, and if youre going to be working a lot, you need to look after yourself on a number of levels. some of these gunslingers dont know what theyre talking about. get over here and dont settle for pennies like the proles do.

when you get here, get around, walk in, say hello and socialise. resumees and the like arent valued here in the way that they are elsewhere. it's during the apparently casual social interaction that the hard decisions are made, and the tricky negotiations are conducted. do not bring your preconceptions of how things should be done to this place - at least dont try to enforce them here. plenty of others have done and are doing so and you can see the result in many of the submissions that you read on this site. ie it gets you nowhere. ps. i love china. (and i like this site too)

[Roger]

prawn,
I read your post, and I believe I read many of your opinionated pieces on the Job Info board where you exhortated people to up their hourly rates, I read these pieces with a lump of salt.
I can easily rake in above 10'000 - but I know the price I AM PAYING to rake in that much, and I wonder if it's worth doing it. I particularly know how one has to keep one's part-time jobs going, or what happens if one fails to look after them.
And, how many posts have we seen from you so far? Yes, your total wisdom of your time in China can be squeezed into a fantastic ten contributions to Dave's....

[scoobydo]

"you should be looking at 8000/mth in gz, accom visa and all the usuals supplied; any less and you're there for charity's sake alone no matter what certain ploughers of ancient furrows would have you believe. if youre there and people know youre looking for work, you'll as likely get a job by word of mouth as you would by finding it in any job listing

Prawn"

I suspect you mean word of mouth in the bar. It don't disagree with your implication that Guangzhou is expensive but I suspect that most of these great jobs in the bar have little substance. That's my experience anyway.

Bars, everywhere, have their big talkers who can help you out. How tangible these jobs really are is the open question. A very small proportion of teachers are making over 8,000 yuan in Guangzhou from a full time job. Why then are the bars full of people who know about these jobs but don't take them themselves? In my experience these great jobs have either been sanpped up very quickly or more typicaly don't exist at all.

I have lived here for 3 years and no one has ever offered me a job for 8,000 yuan plus. I've listened to my fair share of "blows" in the bar however. A more normal offer is 6,000 yuan for 25+ hours a week, as often as not running all over the city to classes here and there.

Incidently if anyone knows of a job in Guangzhou for 8,000 yuan+ without having to kill yourself please let me know. The sad fact is that 8,000 yuan isn't a lot of money in Guangzhou certainly not in respect of the amount of work a full time employer expects from you to pay you this sort of sum. Still you will be so busy and exhausted you won't have the time or energy to spend much money anyway.

[prawn]

er...many of my opinionated pieces? no doubt. i do tend to fairly forcefully express an opinion about things that i am confident that i know something about. if you feel that your powers of rhetoric are not such that would allow you to retort in a strong and confident manner, well you resort to your finger pointing and name calling. that's fine and it's human nature. as long as youre comfortable with that. exhorting people to up their hourly rates? i m not sure, ive only been contributing for about a week. dont think i would have made 10 posts, though i do tend to dribble off at the fingertips at a fast rate in the few minutes i get spare. i'm pretty busy. maybe youve got the wrong prawn. i would definitely advise someone who is serious not to accept crap wages. i've never hung around any bars in gz, or anywhere else in china for that matter. i don't like the westerner drinking and griping scene, and ive never had to seek the security of "fellow" guai lous in the south or lao wais in the north. i get more the zhonguo tong these days anyway. think what you, i can't see how it would affect me, except allow me a little frivolity at the keyboard now and then. we were on 8 for 18 hrs and living on campus in the uni i mentioned and there are still people doing that, and there are other unis that still offer that. they occasionally advertise on daves. the other places i worked were 8 a month and a 2- 3 bedroom apartment. 8 isnt much anyway. just passable for a first foot in the door type thing, especially in the gz area. my total wisdom of time in china can be measured by my posts in here? ive been here a and i know some things. i never have any problem here. i was just telling the young bloke whats out there. of course the 8000 jobs get snapped up - he's going to come here and snap one up HA HA. you winge about that and try to make yourself feel better. you can have your dull life. im in another city now, and im getting a lot more than the pittances youre squabbling about. then again im genuinely qualified in a number of areas that makes me an attractive proposition these days. and i know what works. to the person who started this thread, you can email me if you like, i might be able to point you in the right direction. i think you might have tried, there was no message in the inbox.

[friendly]

First of all I agree with most of you, its better not to just show up. Do you research first and apply.

I would just like to add my two cents about aipusen. I have worked for 2 other schools in China. I began working for aipusen in September. I admit the first thing that attracted me was the salary, 8000-10000. I did a little research and did read a couple of bad things, With my experience I have met so many teachers with negative attitudes towards their jobs and employers. So after reading the stuff about Aipusen, I thought I would find out for myself. From the day I arrived, I knew that this was the place for me. I came here with an open mind, not expecting anything. If you come and expect, then you will be dissapointed. i think this applies for any ESL job. Aipusen has treated me great since the day I came. The company is well organized, pay is on time, no hidden deductions, nice apartments etc. Sure things do come up, but you cannot expect everything to go smoothly. The office and the foreign teacher managers have been a real help. I admit , aipusen is not for everyone. If you are willing to have fun and being active in class, then go for it! But, if you are the not up for that, then you will not like it here. Working for aipusen is a serious job like most other places back home, you are out of the house from 10-5. I really hope this clears up a little about why people think Aipusen is a bad place to work for. Its sad that only the bad things get posted on here, and nobody really tells otherwise. Some teachers have been here for 3-5 years.

Roger you said "Aipusen often transfers its FT's outside Guangzhou, and some do make more dough out there. How many are working for them in good ol' Canton?? "

How do you know this? I think now in we have around 32 FT teachers

[Rhino]

I was hoping someone from aipusen would step up to the plate. I was hired by them and asked to be placed in a smaller town (which I love). I drop in at the appartments in Guangzhou to visit once in a while and get good vibes from most of the teachers there. I think I would have been happy working there but I hate Guangzhou itself. Happy in Yingde right now! Cheers

[Roger]

Hello, friendly,

I said that because that's what a bunch of former Aipusen teachers wrote to me and some posted their experience on the Job Info board. I can't verify these claims, but it seemed to me credible enough. Why, I was even in telephone conversation with a few of those chaps - places like Qingyuan, Zhaoqing (perhaps), Shunde.
Generally speaking, Aipusen has a better reputation than most others do. Still, I feel one should be aware of the fact that working for another school in a different location is not exactly what your work visa allows.

[Roger]

Hello, friendly,

I said that because that's what a bunch of former Aipusen teachers wrote to me and some posted their experience on the Job Info board. I can't verify these claims, but it seemed to me credible enough. Why, I was even in telephone conversation with a few of those chaps - places like Qingyuan, Zhaoqing (perhaps), Shunde.
Generally speaking, Aipusen has a better reputation than most others do. Still, I feel one should be aware of the fact that working for another school in a different location is not exactly what your work visa allows.

[Rock Lee]

so would how is it like in Guangzhou anyways, is it like Hong Kong?? or less modernized....and also i was wanting to teach there...i have no experience teaching but am graduating from a University and getting the teaching certificate... i was born and raised in the U.S. but i speak cantonese too.... i heard that they don't like hiring American born asians.... is this true????

[Klamm]

No one fielded this one yet.

I think we can all agree that schools in China prefer a white face. Sad but true. My feeling is that as a country develops they begin to look more at real quals. The earlier on in a place is, the more they look for just the face. Degree means something to Uni's here but other than your face matters most. You might find schools to hire you, though. Check around.

K.