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spiral78
Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 11534
Location: On a Short Leash
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 Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 3:41 pm Post subject: |
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| There are still many academies out there who take people without papers and they have no qualms about it. As long as they have a pulse and are a native speaker, they are in, hehe. |
To be honest, if adults choose knowingly to work illegally, that's their business.
It's just when they are misled into thinking that
1. they can get papers when they can't
and/or
2. there are little/no risks to working illegally
that I think 'we' here have some responsibility to tell them what the reality is.
If their expectations and understanding are realistic, they can make their own choices, of course! |
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pr455
Joined: 08 May 2011
Posts: 135
Location: MADRID, SPAIN
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| Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 7:17 pm Post subject: |
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| spiral78 wrote: |
| Quote: |
| There are still many academies out there who take people without papers and they have no qualms about it. As long as they have a pulse and are a native speaker, they are in, hehe. |
To be honest, if adults choose knowingly to work illegally, that's their business.
It's just when they are misled into thinking that
1. they can get papers when they can't
and/or
2. there are little/no risks to working illegally
that I think 'we' here have some responsibility to tell them what the reality is.
If their expectations and understanding are realistic, they can make their own choices, of course! |
Spiral,
I agree 100%. I am not concerned with people making their own choices. That isn't a factor for me in this equation. I get tired of hearing people blaming illegals for everything when, if academies did not hire illegals, then they wouldn't come and work for academies here. it's just that simple.
There will always be academies making it seem as if the weather is fine in Spain for working without work papers, come on over. Yeas ago, Canterbury had what they called their "work and study umbrella." This basically meant that you studied their TEFL and then you could work for them after finishing the TEFL. No visa was involved with this process at all.
We are not picking on Canterbury exclusively. There are many other academies out there that make promises to people and then after the person approaches them, the heads of the academies then say that it's a long process to get papers and the same BS.
The person who wrote the blog mentioned on this thread was fired from GES because he didn't know how to teach. He would go to class and just have students fill in the blanks. Maybe he gained some teaching experience after he was fired. Who knows? Some of the points he makes have been going on for years, so that's why his post was nothing special or new to me.
Shawn |
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Grimace420
Joined: 24 Sep 2011
Posts: 88
Location: Madriz
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| Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 8:05 pm Post subject: |
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The issue I have with the reviews on their advertisment page is that it gives the impression that most of the non-EUers just decided one day on a whim that they'd move to Spain and that was all there was to it. If they at least mentioned ONCE that only those with the right to work in Spain could continue with the company I would have no problem with what they are doing. However, it doesn't say "What better place than Spain to do my TEFL training before going on to Asia with a job offer" or "thankfully I'm able to work in Europe as I have a European passport." I actually Googled their names and one of the Americans is legitimately married to an Englishman (no mention of that in the review, however), so it's fine in that case, but the rest give the idea that one day they just happened to feel like an adventure and moved across the pond to perpetually sunny and warm Spain where English teaching is an easy and rewarding career with no barriers to entry.
It annoys me that a "legitimate" English company would either (even tacitly) promote illegal teaching or keep quiet about the situation just to make money on their certificate sales. It just further solidifies my view of most academies as cowboy companies who are complete money grubbers trying to cash in on something by any means possible, which is why I will try my best never to work for them and make money for disgusting Spanish "businessmen" who don't give two shits about their product or the quality of their service and just want their workers to make them money. |
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pr455
Joined: 08 May 2011
Posts: 135
Location: MADRID, SPAIN
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| Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 8:41 pm Post subject: |
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Grimace,
This is why I have stopped working for academies in general. I only work for a guy who has a business in Barcelona and I teach a class for him in Madrid in a business, but he makes sure that all of his teachers are here legally and won't touch anyone who is not. He pays on time and answers all emails right away.
Now that I am getting more into teacher training and working with publishing companies and giving conferences, well, I have a lot of work going on at the moment. I also work in a Catholic school as an English Language Assistant, so for me, the work is there outside of academies.
I agree with everything that you have said because many academies do make it seem that anyone can just come on over, get a TEFL with them and start working right away. Hey, I was here without papers for 3 and a half year years, so I know what it's like and I will never do that again, so I have experience in that field. GES promised to get e papers and then when I asked them, they said that it was too difficult and would take a long time. Needless to say, I left them and just went to another academy before heading back to the States.
Get this! It gets even better. Now that many Americans are here on a student visa and working as Language Assistants in bilingual, charter and private schools, academies won't touch them, saying that they can't work on a student visa, which is a lie. It blows my mind because academies now have a pool of people to choose from and they still complain that they can't find qualified teachers. Well, they have to raise the salary and stop trying to keep all of the money for themselves. That would be a start.
Shawn |
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jonniboy
Joined: 18 Jun 2006
Posts: 751
Location: Panama City, Panama
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| Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 9:45 pm Post subject: |
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| pr455 wrote: |
| I am here in a legal situation, and I still see academies offering 15� an hour and many still say that this is top pay. Let's face it! Academies are asking for years of experience and then say that they pay top Euro. I don't think so. |
15 euro... if that Shawn. I have 8 years experience, mass mailed tonnes of language centres here in Valencia and I have 15 euro net. Many places were offering 11 or 12 euros and I've even seen the odd language centre in Barca or Madrid offering that. How on earth people can live on that in Barca/Madrid where the costs are higher than here God only knows. |
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pr455
Joined: 08 May 2011
Posts: 135
Location: MADRID, SPAIN
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| Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 9:50 pm Post subject: |
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| jonniboy wrote: |
| pr455 wrote: |
| I am here in a legal situation, and I still see academies offering 15� an hour and many still say that this is top pay. Let's face it! Academies are asking for years of experience and then say that they pay top Euro. I don't think so. |
15 euro... if that Shawn. I have 8 years experience, mass mailed tonnes of language centres here in Valencia and I have 15 euro net. Many places were offering 11 or 12 euros and I've even seen the odd language centre in Barca or Madrid offering that. How on earth people can live on that in Barca/Madrid where the costs are higher than here God only knows. |
I know. I see very little academies offering more than 15�. I know of only a few that offer more than 20� an hour. I'll tell you how you can survive on that: take tons of classes, get lots of privates, work from sun up 'til sun down, share a flat, never go out and only eat at home. That's how it can be done. Who wants to do that for an entire academic year? I don't want to.
The money is actually getting away from academies and doing privates where they pay you at the beginning of the month and if they cancel classes, you can offer them another slot to make up the class. I know of quite a few people who only do privates and they are able to save money.
Shawn |
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Grimace420
Joined: 24 Sep 2011
Posts: 88
Location: Madriz
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| Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 7:13 am Post subject: |
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Found another side-splitter:
Se busca profesora nativa de ingl�s para dar una hora de clase a la semana a un padre y su hijo de ocho a�os, a ambos a la vez en la misma clase . El padre tiene nivel avanzado y el hijo intermedio. La clase ser�a en nuestro domicilio. Vivimos en el barrio de Arg�elles, entre Plaza de Espa�a y Arg�elles. Ofrezco pagar 8 euros la hora. |
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littlelauren86
Joined: 20 Sep 2011
Posts: 94
Location: Korea
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| Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 12:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Grimace420 wrote: |
Found another side-splitter:
Se busca profesora nativa de ingl�s para dar una hora de clase a la semana a un padre y su hijo de ocho a�os, a ambos a la vez en la misma clase . El padre tiene nivel avanzado y el hijo intermedio. La clase ser�a en nuestro domicilio. Vivimos en el barrio de Arg�elles, entre Plaza de Espa�a y Arg�elles. Ofrezco pagar 8 euros la hora. |
Wow, I hope they're kidding  |
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spiral78
Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 11534
Location: On a Short Leash
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| Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 1:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Surely one can make more per hour pouring coffee??!! |
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Mrguay84
Joined: 03 Dec 2009
Posts: 125
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| Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2012 3:40 pm Post subject: |
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I'll be leaving Spain soon. I've enjoyed my time here (and of course I can always come back, when/if the situation improves).
It seems some of my private students are getting their wages slashed, and one hasn't been paid for several months - this of course has a knock on effect. I guess that's what happens when you vote in a right wing government - things actually get worse for the non-elite. Cameron anyone??
Anyway, the straw that broke the donkeys back was a couple of weeks back when someone said that 10e an hour to travel to his house to teach 2 children was "un poco caro" - a bit expensive. Then I see an old acquaintance of mine is charging �35 an hour to 'pull out some weeds and trim some trees' back in the green green grass of the UK and says that's the "standard rate".
Time to move on, si se�or si se�or!
Any other Spanish expats having more problems at the current time? |
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pr455
Joined: 08 May 2011
Posts: 135
Location: MADRID, SPAIN
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| Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2012 7:41 pm Post subject: |
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| Mrguay84 wrote: |
I'll be leaving Spain soon. I've enjoyed my time here (and of course I can always come back, when/if the situation improves).
It seems some of my private students are getting their wages slashed, and one hasn't been paid for several months - this of course has a knock on effect. I guess that's what happens when you vote in a right wing government - things actually get worse for the non-elite. Cameron anyone??
Anyway, the straw that broke the donkeys back was a couple of weeks back when someone said that 10e an hour to travel to his house to teach 2 children was "un poco caro" - a bit expensive. Then I see an old acquaintance of mine is charging �35 an hour to 'pull out some weeds and trim some trees' back in the green green grass of the UK and says that's the "standard rate".
Time to move on, si se�or si se�or!
Any other Spanish expats having more problems at the current time? |
I say, good for you my friend.
Many people (students) are using the crisis as an excuse to try and pay less when it comes to them having private classes. I am in no way saying that people getting their salaries cut or not being paid in months is in any way being used as an excuse by people. That is real, but there are those who are using the crisis as a scapegoat.
We all know when our time is up in a place and there is no reason to prolong anything. I know that when my time is up and it's time for me to move on, I will do so without a single regret.
I do believe that the situation will improve, but I don't know when it will. I am riding it out just like many others here in Spain.
Good luck on your new journey.
Shawn |
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Grimace420
Joined: 24 Sep 2011
Posts: 88
Location: Madriz
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| Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 12:17 pm Post subject: |
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| Mrguay84 wrote: |
I'll be leaving Spain soon. I've enjoyed my time here (and of course I can always come back, when/if the situation improves).
It seems some of my private students are getting their wages slashed, and one hasn't been paid for several months - this of course has a knock on effect. I guess that's what happens when you vote in a right wing government - things actually get worse for the non-elite. Cameron anyone??
Anyway, the straw that broke the donkeys back was a couple of weeks back when someone said that 10e an hour to travel to his house to teach 2 children was "un poco caro" - a bit expensive. Then I see an old acquaintance of mine is charging �35 an hour to 'pull out some weeds and trim some trees' back in the green green grass of the UK and says that's the "standard rate".
Time to move on, si se�or si se�or!
Any other Spanish expats having more problems at the current time? |
Where are you based in Spain?
Here in Madrid, things aren't so bad. I arrived in 2007 just as the sun was about to set on the Spanish economic miracle and have slowly watched the situation for everyone around me worsen with no end in sight. However, in that time I have only discovered more and more opportunities for native English teachers. There are so many different avenues that I can't decide which is the best one to take -- for now it's a balancing act between working as language assistant and giving private classes, which provides decent working hours and liveable pay. I've found it insanely easy to get work here in the 5 years I've been here.
Outside of Madrid and to a lesser extent Barcelona, I can imagine it's a lot tougher. I'll bet that in areas like the Comunidad Valenciana and Andaluc�a things are tighter and there's more competition. I wouldn't mind living there myself, but it doesn't sound like the wisest move at the moment.
If you've finished with Spain, congratulate yourself for toughing it out during these hard times and pack your bags. |
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pr455
Joined: 08 May 2011
Posts: 135
Location: MADRID, SPAIN
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| Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 8:23 pm Post subject: |
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| Grimace420 wrote: |
| Mrguay84 wrote: |
I'll be leaving Spain soon. I've enjoyed my time here (and of course I can always come back, when/if the situation improves).
It seems some of my private students are getting their wages slashed, and one hasn't been paid for several months - this of course has a knock on effect. I guess that's what happens when you vote in a right wing government - things actually get worse for the non-elite. Cameron anyone??
Anyway, the straw that broke the donkeys back was a couple of weeks back when someone said that 10e an hour to travel to his house to teach 2 children was "un poco caro" - a bit expensive. Then I see an old acquaintance of mine is charging �35 an hour to 'pull out some weeds and trim some trees' back in the green green grass of the UK and says that's the "standard rate".
Time to move on, si se�or si se�or!
Any other Spanish expats having more problems at the current time? |
Where are you based in Spain?
Here in Madrid, things aren't so bad. I arrived in 2007 just as the sun was about to set on the Spanish economic miracle and have slowly watched the situation for everyone around me worsen with no end in sight. However, in that time I have only discovered more and more opportunities for native English teachers. There are so many different avenues that I can't decide which is the best one to take -- for now it's a balancing act between working as language assistant and giving private classes, which provides decent working hours and liveable pay. I've found it insanely easy to get work here in the 5 years I've been here.
Outside of Madrid and to a lesser extent Barcelona, I can imagine it's a lot tougher. I'll bet that in areas like the Comunidad Valenciana and Andaluc�a things are tighter and there's more competition. I wouldn't mind living there myself, but it doesn't sound like the wisest move at the moment.
If you've finished with Spain, congratulate yourself for toughing it out during these hard times and pack your bags. |
Grimace420,
You are dead on about Madrid. Thanks to the Language Assistant Program and many academies piggybacking on it by offering classes after school, there is a real need for English teachers. I have also seen a surge in academies needing teachers as well.
Things are great in Madrid and we have to wait and see what happens when the new set of budget cuts happen, especially in education. I know there there have been cuts in the number of training classes being offered to teachers, so now they have less to choose from and imagine the same number of teachers trying to get into less classes.
Teacher training has been my saving grace, so I am moving more in that direction. It pays much better than academies and I already have the material that I use in class to share with teachers. I am going to ride that wave as long as I can.
Shawn |
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Grimace420
Joined: 24 Sep 2011
Posts: 88
Location: Madriz
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| Posted: Tue Apr 10, 2012 10:07 am Post subject: |
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| Exactly, Shawn. It sounds like you've paid your dues and are reaping the benefits from your dedication. I agree with you about it being like riding a wave while things last. Even though I have my life basically established in Spain, at the end of the day I am a fairweather friend to the country as much as any foreigner. There's a limit to the amount of crap I will put up with as well. At any given moment I'm ready to pack my suitcase in less than an hour and head to the airport -- I always have an emergency fund ready for that and a comfortable bed waiting at my parents' place. But for now getting work is as easy as sending an email or being recommended by word of mouth to people looking for private classes. That plus the easy lifestyle and beautiful geography make it too hard to resist leaving for the moment while the going's good, at least here in Madrid. |
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Grimace420
Joined: 24 Sep 2011
Posts: 88
Location: Madriz
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| Posted: Tue Apr 10, 2012 12:44 pm Post subject: |
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Found another "entertaining" offer on a website.
Empresa de formaci�n selecciona a profesores de Ingl�s (m�nimo nivel C1 demostrable) para impartir cursos expr�s a domicilio en la zona A de metro Madrid.
La remuneraci�n ser�:
CURSOS 20H (2H cada d�a de L a V): 160� (8 euros per hour)
CURSOS 40H (2H cada d�a de L a V): 300� (7.5 euros per hour)
CURSOS 60H (2H cada d�a de L a V): 420� (7 euros per hour)
IMPRESCINDIBLE: TENER EXPERIENCIA EN FORMACI�N Y ESTAR TITULADO
I'm speechless. |
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