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private lessons
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zactherat



Joined: 24 Aug 2011
Posts: 295

PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2012 5:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mr.Engrish wrote:
also, this is China bud, walk down your local street and try not to spot anything illegal.


So.. your point is.. it's OK to do whatever anyone else is doing?

I bet You would have enjoyed the London riots haha #feral

noBillyNO wrote:
Unless your and expert on Chinese taxes and your aware of taxes not being paid on required income, you really have on idea what your talking about.


Unless my.. what?
dude, seriously, I'm not the only one that has noticed this. Go and look up possessive pronouns and apostrophes.

Lobster wrote:
So tell us how exactly taxation applies to part-time work and what the requirements for declaration are in China etc.


Everyone needs a license to trade, from street sellers to restaurants. Language tuition is no different and you know it. Please, with all your experience in China, don't make me inform you that you either need to be working for a licensed employer or to set up your own operation.

Want me to quote a specific law?

Go down your local PSB and tell them you don't know what to do with all the undeclared money you have made from undeclared business - I'm sure they'll find one for you.

You and others above might have enough experience to know how to flout the laws of this country regularly and successfully, and if you are OK with that then i guess it's not my business. But if newbies read your advice they could get into trouble.

I'm not trying to put the boot in for no reason, it just seems irresponsible to me to say "it is illegal but you'll be fine", because - morals aside - people do actually get into trouble for this.
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MisterOyster



Joined: 28 Jun 2012
Posts: 9

PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2012 6:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

zactherat wrote:


I'm sure Daveseslcafe used to have some kind of policy which forbid encouraging illegal activity like this.. maybe i have a bad memory.


I think you meant forbade. You should review your own posts for grammatical errors before you criticize others and lay on the snark that is sadly ubiquitous on these forums.

The original poster asked a simple question and he/she has gotten pertinent replies from several people. The legality and morality of private lessons has nothing to do with his purpose in starting this thread and I doubt your input is hardly appreciated.

Mister Oyster
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zactherat



Joined: 24 Aug 2011
Posts: 295

PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2012 7:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MisterOyster wrote:
I think you meant forbade.


well ok
if you want resurrect and prescribe archaic inflections,
i hope you use "bade" when you talk about ebay activity.


Anyway - What was the topic again?
How much should we get paid for illegal work?

er..
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ecubyrd94



Joined: 25 Aug 2011
Posts: 77

PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 12:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

zactherat wrote:


noBillyNO wrote:
Unless your and expert on Chinese taxes and your aware of taxes not being paid on required income, you really have on idea what your talking about.


Unless my.. what?
dude, seriously, I'm not the only one that has noticed this. Go and look up possessive pronouns and apostrophes.


I'm no grammar Nazi, but yeah, come on. It's not like it only happened once in that sentence, so the typo excuse is out. Laughing
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parnett



Joined: 29 Jun 2012
Posts: 179
Location: China

PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 2:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I used to come here quite frequently (under a different name) years ago. Then, I stopped because no matter how harmless my post, it would always start an argument. It's your right to disagree, but insults are surely not necessary. I think living in China is beginning to drive some of you over the edge.
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kungfuman



Joined: 31 May 2012
Posts: 1749
Location: In My Own Private Idaho

PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 2:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

zactherat wrote:
just want to point out, again, that private teaching is untaxed revenue
= tax evasion
= illegal
What is interesting to me is that many people that complain about China not being properly first world, selectively ignore the law and cheat the system themselves.
I'm sure Daveseslcafe used to have some kind of policy which forbid encouraging illegal activity like this.. maybe i have a bad memory.


My guess is, as a kid you were beat up a lot.
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7969



Joined: 26 Mar 2003
Posts: 5782
Location: Coastal Guangdong

PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 2:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

parnett wrote:
I used to come here quite frequently (under a different name) years ago. Then, I stopped because no matter how harmless my post, it would always start an argument. It's your right to disagree, but insults are surely not necessary. I think living in China is beginning to drive some of you over the edge.

You wouldn't be the first sane person driven away. . . . Very Happy
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Brian Hugh



Joined: 07 Jan 2012
Posts: 140
Location: China

PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 6:57 am    Post subject: VIP students Reply with quote

For the last year I have been teaching VIP students. I am also writing this letter as an answer to the previous person who was accused of ripping off his students by charging two students 150 rmb an hour in Hongzhou. My answer is that you must deal through a Chinese agent in China. Chinese have a problem dealing directly with a lao wai.
I have been teaching VIP students for the last year. They too complain about everything. I present books that I have bought to study from they choose the book and later complain that the book is not good. So I get them another book or take them to a library or books store on my time and let them choose another. Most of the students are appreciative of my work but I have some that nothing makes them happy.
Teaching VIP students in a school is good in that I am less threatening to the Chinese English teachers working at my school. These classes are usually small sometimes only one student attends.
Do any other teahers have a take on this VIP system of English teaching?
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Mr.Engrish



Joined: 22 Oct 2009
Posts: 57
Location: China

PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 3:32 pm    Post subject: Re: VIP students Reply with quote

Brian Hugh wrote:
For the last year I have been teaching VIP students. I am also writing this letter as an answer to the previous person who was accused of ripping off his students by charging two students 150 rmb an hour in Hongzhou. My answer is that you must deal through a Chinese agent in China. Chinese have a problem dealing directly with a lao wai.
I have been teaching VIP students for the last year. They too complain about everything. I present books that I have bought to study from they choose the book and later complain that the book is not good. So I get them another book or take them to a library or books store on my time and let them choose another. Most of the students are appreciative of my work but I have some that nothing makes them happy.
Teaching VIP students in a school is good in that I am less threatening to the Chinese English teachers working at my school. These classes are usually small sometimes only one student attends.
Do any other teahers have a take on this VIP system of English teaching?


I've been doing the school VIP classes for about 5 months now. Usually on the first day I ask them what their expectations are and what areas they want to focus on. Most of the time they want to work on their speaking, so I present them a rough outline of what I have and if they don't like it then I take it out and add in what they do.

I've never really had any major issues with VIP classes or private tutoring other then the occasional call in sick. I really have no need for an agent either.

On a side note, how much do you pay an agent? What do they actually do for you to justify the cost?
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The Steakinator



Joined: 13 Apr 2012
Posts: 71
Location: Oman

PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 4:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This might be a bit off topic, but how easy is it to pick up private students within the first month of being there?

I'm a 28 year old white guy. In Turkey, that spelled death to private lessons (they want "blonde and buxom" women). Hardly anyone would take you unless you took paltry pay. In Syria, well, Syrians are fairly stingy so private lessons were out the window unless you were a blonde woman, even hideously ugly they'd pay great money. What about China, though?
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LarssonCrew



Joined: 06 Jun 2009
Posts: 1308

PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 7:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Steakinator, I've found that generally the longer I am in China, the easier to pick up classes because of connections and people you know.

I originally worked at a training centre, and it was always possible to flick the topic to them renewing their contracts there. They don't want to pay 3 or 400 per hour, so they'll do a deal.

As well student's cancelling in private classes drives me mad, so now I insist on 10 hours worth of classes up front, and charge 1700, if they want to pay for 20 hours of classes up front they can have it for 3000, for most people the 3000 is enough for maybe a month. So you only need 4 students to take you up and you've got 12000 a month extra, although it is another 20 hours a week.

Anyways, if you know more people more people will come to you, and if you do a great job in the first few months most will recommend you to their friends.
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Opiate



Joined: 10 Aug 2011
Posts: 630
Location: Qingdao

PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 10:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LarssonCrew wrote:
so now I insist on 10 hours worth of classes up front,


YES! Also it is a good idea to make it very clear that if they schedule a time and do not show they will not get a refund or a reschedule. Certainly you can make exceptions if they give you notice but if you schedule YOUR time for them then it's your money.
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The Edge



Joined: 04 Sep 2010
Posts: 455
Location: China

PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 9:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I only do 'one on ones' and my minimum is 150 rmb per hour.
My maximum is 300.
It averages out over the course of a year to about 200 rmb per hour.
If I was to do two or more students at the same time (which I would not do as the parents kids like their kids to get 100% private tuition) then I would keep to the same prices.
Building up a reputation as a private tutor is mainly due to having good family connections and the word of mouth from the parents of previous students.
It is not everybodys cup of tea and I only do it to pass the time and to mainly help friends of my wife's family.
However, it certainly pays better and is a damn sight easier / rewarding than working in some crappy language mill or lower league university.
Each to their own though.
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fred13331



Joined: 20 Feb 2012
Posts: 108
Location: Southern China

PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 12:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Edge wrote:
I only do 'one on ones' and my minimum is 150 rmb per hour.
My maximum is 300.
It averages out over the course of a year to about 200 rmb per hour.
If I was to do two or more students at the same time (which I would not do as the parents kids like their kids to get 100% private tuition) then I would keep to the same prices.
Building up a reputation as a private tutor is mainly due to having good family connections and the word of mouth from the parents of previous students.
It is not everybodys cup of tea and I only do it to pass the time and to mainly help friends of my wife's family.
However, it certainly pays better and is a damn sight easier / rewarding than working in some crappy language mill or lower league university.
Each to their own though.


The Edge has it pretty much spot on. I have a full time uni job and do privates on the side. I range from 175 to 250. I do doulble up on occasion, But, I do and charge a little more (250 an hour for 2 students together) This works out quite well, as it is more interactive.

The edge makes a good point about reputation - I struggled to find my first few privates, but, once established, word of mouth has ensured a steady supply.

Time served is certainly a factor. It is hard to get privates straight away. Echinacities is a good place to advertise for free. I have also gotten a few students thru NLT.CC, but this is was very slow to kick off. Other than that it has been word of mouth. I was doing a few hours at a local mill and students approached me for privates - another avenue, but one fraught with danger.

These days I average about 15x200 a week from privates, more than doubling my uni salary. But, to answer the original question it took a long time to get going. You need to stay in one place for a while. It would be difficult for one year backpacker teachers to get into the privates market. I have been in my current location for 3 years, going on 4, and private income, starting as a trickle has only recently become substantial
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The Great Wall of Whiner



Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Posts: 4946
Location: Blabbing

PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 11:10 pm    Post subject: Re: private lessons Reply with quote

parnett wrote:
I'm sure this topic has been discussed here before, but I haven't been able to find anything on it.
I am currently giving private lessons to three students (together) for 2 hours a day. I live in Fuyang (a suburb of Hangzhou). I am charging them the ridiculously low rate of 150 RMB total for 2 hours. The problem is they think I am ripping them off!!!!
How much should I be asking (I have 26 years of teaching experience)?


They are just money-grubbing.

I was making a lot more than that teaching my own classes. If they figure they can find another foreigner to teach at a lower rate, let them. They can end up with non-native English speakers with no education/experience then.
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