Job Discussion Forums

[arioch36]

Kev said

[kev7161]

Yesterday I had two students missing from one of my Senior One classes. They were in their previous class. I can often tell when my students are "covering" for their fellow classmates and this time they did a poor job of doing so. Class hadn't officially started yet, but all the other students were there so I assumed these two yahoos weren't going to show. I went to their Chinese/English teacher and told her about the two missing boys. I also told her to tell them (if she found them) that if they don't come to class today (yesterday), don't bother coming back for the rest of the term (it's strange how I can make ultimatums like this and nobody questions my authority!).

So, naturally, they didn't show.

Today, one of the boys comes in and plops down in his seat. I inform him (well, actually, one of his classmates translates for me) that he is no longer welcome in my class and he can leave. That kid jackrabbited out of the classroom so fast . . . !!! I just made his day. The second boy didn't even bother showing up. I'm guessing he got the message ahead of time.

[Roger]

I wonder if there is some sort of institutional racism at Chinese public schools?
Consider this:
Chinese teachers are "respected" (probably "feared" is the more accurate term); they don't have to put up with adversarial behaviour and challenges from their students - they can go strait after the culprit, punish them and/or complain to their superiors and the kids' parents, and they will be listened to! That's a definite advantage that accrues from their weekly meetings with fellow teachers.

Now us: do we get inducted? Introduced to the kids? Introduced to their teachers? Told what they have been doing so far? No, no, and ten times more nos!
We are placed in front of a crowded classroom and told to "function". Open their bloody mouths. Make them act and react.

Often it doesn't work. We don't even get a name list, so we have to get to know them over time.

But, a few weeks into our stints, our darlings enjoy the privilege of "assessing" us. They can give any kind of feedback, and only their opinion will matter - not ours.
So, if they make the "suggestion" that you "should make your class more lively", then you will be quite stumped; does this mean you should allow them more leeway so they can practise more Cantonese or Mandarin during their English class? Probably not, but what is expected from you, do you know???
I got also some feedback telling me "to speak as little as possible, and to let us speak more". But: "Please, give us MORE COMPLETE instructions"...
Well and good, but in point of fact these kids can hardly listen for any period of time in excess of 30 seconds; you will always have to raise your voice, and eventually, to shout them down.
"And, we would like you to treat us as grown-ups"...
But do grown-ups arrive in class ten minutes late?
Do grown-ups have the right to be absent for the whole lesson without excuse?
Do grown-ups do their homework during the lesson?
Do grown-ups constantly talk in the local vernacular with their peers rather than listening to the teacher, then complain "Sir, I don't hear you say what!" ...??
And, do grown-ups speak under their breath as though they were burglars in a house full of sleeping residents?

When I brought up my complaints to a fellow expat, I learnt that he had been having the exact same problems for the entire time of his presence here; he eventually resigned himself to having them read aloud in front of the class.
He also said that kids who do homework during his lesson will unceremoniously be evicted from the classroom; this seems to be the most effective weapon he has, and he enjoys the respect from those students.

But no one had bothered telling me, and when I got a list of "suggestions" I did feel the school was using the most patronising means to put me in a station beneath my students.

Today as I threatened to send disobedient kids to the school library - where any chance visitor would see them and know they were skipping class - I suddenly had more power over them, and much-improved results.

[Asialiner]

I teach English in the tourism department, and I too was having about 1/3 of my students skip class. I asked the Dean about it, and he made my classes optional. Now, I've see as few as 2 out of 50 in my 2nd year classes, and run about 10 out of 18 in my first year classes. If I give an assignment, few will show up for the next class, and they haven't done the assignment. I'm told, "We don't have to come to class, so why do the assignment?"

Next term, I'm switching to the English Department. My fellow teachers say they have similar problems, but not on the scale of non-English majors.

[kev7161]

I could go on and on (and on) about this topic as it is one of my biggest pet peeves:

I often will have students miss class on a test day. Last semester, I arranged for these kids to come to my class at the end of another day to take the test. I finally asked one of the Chinese teachers what do they do when students missed test days and he said they get a zero. Aha! Now, I don't bother with making up tests . . . the kids just get a zero from me as well.

And before you protest . . . 99% of these test-skippers are the kids who don't care/don't do anything in class/often don't come to class in the first place. If it was one of my "true blue" students, I certainly would give him/her a chance to make it up.

[oprah]

The school does not care. I was told I was here for political reasons. It is important to have a foreign teacher in the school.

[kev7161]

Luckily, Rickster is the perfect teacher with no absentees.

In my opinion, absent students mean lazy/shiftless/futureless students.

I've already signed a contract for next year and my department loves me (as do many of my not-so-lazy students). So, thanks for the input there Rickster.

[kev7161]

You are making a lot of assumptions (as a certain "Prawn" did in another thread) about me, my classroom, my school, and my students - - - and it seems about the other half dozen or so posters that experience the same problems as well.

There is no way you can know FOR SURE what kind of teacher I am until you come and observe for a couple of days. There is no way you can know FOR SURE what kind of students I have until you come and observe for a couple of days.

"Having some unemployable Westerner suddenly teaching them 'marketing' doesn't go over well with everybody."

Where did that come from? You must be referring to someone else. I am quite employable (as a matter of fact, I've had two job offers recently come my way from my home town in the US for the next school year. I am choosing to stay in China for one more year for my own personal reasons). And I don't teach marketing, only English.

Actually, I'm quite experienced at teaching as my chosen career for the last several years has been teaching - - I actually went to some university or another and got a . . . . are you ready . . . a DEGREE to do exactly that - TEACH. Pretty cool, eh? As for whether or not I am qualified to be teaching in China, that's not for you to decide, rather my employers will let me know. And they DID sign me on for another year - - but maybe they are just idiots and have no idea what a boring/unexciting/useless person I really am. As for me signing so early, I think it is a smart move. I am now locked into another year here at a MUCH higher salary (in spite of how crappy a teacher I am) and I was able to flex my muscles a bit and get the contract that I wanted. Now I don't have to worry about going out looking for another job or packing and moving all my stuff. I can go home to visit in the summer and know exactly where and when I will be coming back to teach. And yes, I loved to be loved. Not important as a teacher - important as a human being. You should try it sometime.

And I will agree to disagree with you. You've stated your opinions on what absent students mean to you and I've stated mine. I work in a private school where many of the kids come from wealthier families and they are quite spoiled and/or their parents don't have the time of day for them. They are here for days on end in the classroom morning, noon, and night. This being my first year here, I will admit I didn't have quite the handle on how to deal with delinquent students - - I have plans in place to change that next year. As other posters have stated, some Chinese students tend to treat foreign teachers differently than their Chinese teachers (expcept for Rickster of course). I know I am more window dressing than teacher here and I can generally accept that, but kids will not be allowed to come and go as they please in my class and not in other classes.

And, finally, to repeat: The kids that miss my classes (and do poorly) are the same kids that do poorly in other classes as well. I've been told this by other Chinese teachers, so never "assume" anything Rickster because it makes . . . . well, you know.

[kev7161]

Sorry . . . thought I was finished:

You all know that not all students are interested in learning English. Some probably feel that it is a waste of time and it is something they will never use in their adult life. Fair enough. Other students feel the same way about Math, History, or PE. The thing is, they don't have a choice. English is part of their curriculum just like all the other subjects. Do you think that, when I was 17, I knew I would be coming to China 25 years later? If I did, I sure as heck would have been boning up on my Chinese language skills all these years. And that's the thing. Most kids may THINK they know what they will do after their university life (if they even go to a university), but they don't know for sure. Life is a winding path. So maybe some of my students are bored with me and with studying English. When I was in school, we had to take one year of a foreign language and then the next two levels were electives. Luckily, I enjoyed learning Spanish and stuck with it. And that's the mistake I think is happening in Chinese high schools. Some of these "speciality" classes such as the English language are foisted upon these kids, like it or not. Spanish has been only somewhat useful for me in my adult life, but I certainly could have lived without it. So I feel for the bored kids, but it's not my rule that they MUST endure English. I do try to make my class as interesting as I can, but some days are simply reading, repitition, writing, answering questions, blah, blah, blah. Every day can't be a party in my classroom (and with only 45 minutes, putting up all those decorations would take up most of our time!), but that's not my goal (nor my school's goal).

I don't know why I'm going on like this, but it all circles back to the original point. Miss my class if you will, but there is no revolving door attached to my classroom. And I guess it has a little to do with Rickster's smug posting. Maybe I protest too much, but I work hard to give those kids the best that I can. So if they (some) are bored or disinterested, well, so be it. I can't change their attitudes.

[Roger]

Kev,
there is no need to defend yourself. That other poster has no more success with his or her Chinese "students" than you or I have.
Since when do students know what's in their best interest in English class? Especially those Chinese English major - having formed those habits that come with memorising everything, they are intellectually overchallenged in the presence of a native English speaker. That often has a deterrent effect. Their reaction is to - walk out on the class, or take liberties with a teacher whose nationality they have learnt to despise.
Look, in my second job I teach middle-schoolers. Initially I thought their English was above that of my university students. Until I found out that half of them in classrooms of 60 were secretly doing their homework, reading magazines and comic strips, or simply staying away.
With so much left to desire on their part, what can you expect from them when they have to assess you? Will they say "we are always very happy to see our foreign teacher come to practise English with us?"
They will likely say "it's too difficult". Or: "He should treat us as grownups". Or: "He should speak more slowly!" Also: "He should talk less, and we should have more time for talking in English" Which, as you and I know, they will never do voluntarily!

[arioch36]

[anthyp]

Ah, this is becoming a greater problem for me as the term winds down. Most of my classes are being cancelled for exams ... and I've seen 50% attendence or less in some of my penultimate classes, which I try not to take personally. The students' English exams are not oral and I understand they have other priorities. Suddenly I am not so averse to the idea of a class devoted to games/songs/other non - learning activities.

[kev7161]

Yeah, I agree. June for me consists of a Tongue Twister Tournament in my Senior One classes, probably followed by a movie and definitely a movie in my Senior Two classes: Dances with Wolves (one of my all time favorites and an ideal movie for those struggling with another language. They get to see Kevin Costner learn the Native American language of the . . . Sioux? I forget. And the NA Medicine man learn English. There are some humorous moments with the language barriers. Of course, they both learn each other's language in the space of an hour or so . . . . but still, a good movie.).

We have a four day holiday in the midst of June somewhere and I'm sure there will be testing for a couple of days somewhere and I've been told that I will probably be done by June 25th.

[anthyp]

How does one go about arranging a Tongue Twister Tournament, anyway? I could use some ideas for getting through these last classes without having to go back to the Recite the Dialogue Well.

[kev7161]

Basically, I set up a tournament board like any kind of sports tournament. One student versus another. If you have an odd amount, then you will have three students against each other at times (the top two vote getters will advance). I give them a sheet of tongue twisters to choose from. I talk about what I am looking for in a good competitor: pronunciation, loudness/clarity of voice, did they pick an easy or hard one, did they mostly memorize . . . whatever you want.

Next I take a class period and go through all the tongue twisters so we can practice pronunciation (because there are some weird words in twisters - - "Fuzzy Wuzzy" anyone?). I urge them to practice on their own. Next class we will begin. The students watching will vote on who they think did the best job (and I ask them to please not vote for someone because they don't like the other person, I tell them that is what small children would do . . . hmmmm, we'll see) - - one point each vote. However, my vote counts as five points. Then each person does their presentation, the kids and I will vote, I'll tally the vote and declare the winner and they will advance to the next round.

Sadly, the person eliminated will not be able to practice their english for a couple of classes until the competition is over, but I bet that some of my students won't mind that one bit. Also, it will be a good listening exercise for them and we've been practicing oral English all year long. Not practicing for a couple of weeks is not going to make them worse all of a sudden!

Of course, as an incentive, I've offered a nice prize for the winners of each class (I have four classes which we are doing this). I have told them I will take the four winners out to dinner in Hangzhou one evening in June. I hope this excites them a little, but it's hard to tell. The runners up will get something nice as well. I hope it will be a relaxing couple of weeks for the students and they will have fun and get into the competiveness of it. But, this is China so I'm not going to get my expectations too high. I'm hoping to be surprised by some of my students.

If some of that wasn't clear enough, please let me know and I'll try to do better.