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RiverMystic
Joined: 13 Jan 2009
Posts: 1986
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 Posted: Thu Jul 07, 2016 6:18 am Post subject: |
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| LarssonCrew wrote: |
I know one Asian American dude [I think he was Vietnamese] who had a good job in Shanghai BUT he had a Masters in English Language or something and taught higher end high school students.
The whole thing from 10 years has become worse. Pollution worse, hygiene as bad, more corruption, more xenophobia. It can be tough for some foreign born Chinese because they aren't considered 'proper' lao wai because they're not white or black and are not considered 'proper Chinese' because they weren't born in China.
I'd give it as a skip because you won't even be able to cherish the occasionally small time when being a foreigner is good [free stuff, paid just to be white, etc.] |
A couple of things are better. Salaries are a hell of a lot higher than ten years ago, especially for qualified teachers. Compare that to Japan and Taiwan, where the salaries are the same, or worse. Second thing that's better is that there are more western-style "escape" options if you want them. Expat communities and services are much better in most places. I could also mention the fast trains, which make travelling in China a dream compared to a decade ago. Oh, and smoke-free zones, a blessing for all but cancer-ward wannabes, |
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OhBudPowellWhereArtThou
Joined: 02 Jun 2015
Posts: 1168
Location: Since 2003
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| Posted: Thu Jul 07, 2016 8:46 pm Post subject: |
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| astrotrain wrote: |
Teaching English to me is beneath my skill set, work and academic experience. |
Since when is English not a subject? Teach in a Chinese university, and you'll be in for quite a shock. Do you think that you could teach any area of English in a western university? Would you even be hired without an advanced degree in English?
With your education, teaching English isn't below your skill set. IT ISN'T EVEN IN YOUR SKILL SET! |
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Shanghai Noon
Joined: 18 Aug 2013
Posts: 589
Location: Shanghai, China
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| Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2016 12:56 am Post subject: |
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| I teach a subject that is not English. Seriously, I've thought about giving it up. It's not above or beneath anything. Teaching kids without the basics in English about deep academic topics can be like trying to teach a fish to ride a bicycle. It pays more because it's absolutely brutal at times, and if it paid the same as ESL no one would do it. |
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upsilon
Joined: 23 Aug 2006
Posts: 14
Location: earth
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| Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2016 2:10 am Post subject: 10 Years Later - Skin Colour Still An Issue ? |
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To Astrotrain,
Thanks for your reply.
I find your first person experience very interesting. Do you know of others in situations similar to yours ?
Here's wishing you continued success. |
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upsilon
Joined: 23 Aug 2006
Posts: 14
Location: earth
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| Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2016 2:20 am Post subject: 10 Years Later - Skin Colour Still An Issue ? |
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| Shanghai Noon wrote: |
| I teach a subject that is not English. Seriously, I've thought about giving it up. It's not above or beneath anything. Teaching kids without the basics in English about deep academic topics can be like trying to teach a fish to ride a bicycle. It pays more because it's absolutely brutal at times, and if it paid the same as ESL no one would do it. |
Ten years ago, similar views were quite often expressed on this forum. Even university students who supposedly have studied several years of English were, perhaps with rare individual exceptions, unable to conduct a simple conversation. It seems the situation remains mostly true today. |
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asiannationmc
Joined: 13 Aug 2014
Posts: 1342
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| Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2016 3:26 am Post subject: |
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| Many franchised programs, often hired Chinese teachers for subjects such as math and when the Chinese teachers have a problem with their English skills, they will resort to Chinese to convey and allow student to memorize the material on the test to insure passing. |
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upsilon
Joined: 23 Aug 2006
Posts: 14
Location: earth
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| Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2016 4:38 am Post subject: 10 Years Later - Skin Colour Still An Issue ? |
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| asiannationmc wrote: |
| Many franchised programs, often hired Chinese teachers for subjects such as math and when the Chinese teachers have a problem with their English skills, they will resort to Chinese to convey and allow student to memorize the material on the test to insure passing. |
By "franchised programs" do you mean places offering tutoring services ? |
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Shanghai Noon
Joined: 18 Aug 2013
Posts: 589
Location: Shanghai, China
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| Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2016 6:05 am Post subject: Re: 10 Years Later - Skin Colour Still An Issue ? |
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| upsilon wrote: |
| Shanghai Noon wrote: |
| I teach a subject that is not English. Seriously, I've thought about giving it up. It's not above or beneath anything. Teaching kids without the basics in English about deep academic topics can be like trying to teach a fish to ride a bicycle. It pays more because it's absolutely brutal at times, and if it paid the same as ESL no one would do it. |
Ten years ago, similar views were quite often expressed on this forum. Even university students who supposedly have studied several years of English were, perhaps with rare individual exceptions, unable to conduct a simple conversation. It seems the situation remains mostly true today. |
By all means, go for it if you studied a subject in university that is applicable here. My school even hired a foreign art teacher, so there's hope for everyone if you're in the right place at the right time (ahem, creeper1). Just don't have any delusions of grandeur. It has a much greater potential to suck than an ESL job does. |
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asiannationmc
Joined: 13 Aug 2014
Posts: 1342
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| Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2016 6:39 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| By "franchised programs" do you mean places offering tutoring services ? |
No many uni's sell their program to Chinese uni's (so the Chinese uni pays for the program and delivers a two year program under the guidelines of the British uni with supposed checks by the British uni and reviews of the work generated by the students ), the third year is spent in ...say for example Britain. usually, the English teacher is hired by the British uni and the other teachers are part of the uni's staff but work part time for the franchised program. I worked at such a program for 9 years in Beijing and left two years ago. They usually hire teachers under the title; consultants. From what I understand from conversations with management of some of these programs ..... many of these franchised programs are from formally polytechnics that became a for profit uni. |
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upsilon
Joined: 23 Aug 2006
Posts: 14
Location: earth
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| Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2016 7:21 am Post subject: Re: 10 Years Later - Skin Colour Still An Issue ? |
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[quote="Shanghai Noon"]
| Shanghai Noon wrote: |
By all means, go for it if you studied a subject in university that is applicable here. My school even hired a foreign art teacher, so there's hope for everyone if you're in the right place at the right time (ahem, creeper1). Just don't have any delusions of grandeur. It has a much greater potential to suck than an ESL job does. |
Your actual experiences coincide with my perception. |
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upsilon
Joined: 23 Aug 2006
Posts: 14
Location: earth
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| Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2016 7:25 am Post subject: |
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[quote="asiannationmc"]
| Quote: |
No many uni's sell their program to Chinese uni's (so the Chinese uni pays for the program and delivers a two year program under the guidelines of the British uni with supposed checks by the British uni and reviews of the work generated by the students ), the third year is spent in ...say for example Britain. usually, the English teacher is hired by the British uni and the other teachers are part of the uni's staff but work part time for the franchised program. I worked at such a program for 9 years in Beijing and left two years ago. They usually hire teachers under the title; consultants. From what I understand from conversations with management of some of these programs ..... many of these franchised programs are from formally polytechnics that became a for profit uni. |
Very informative. Thank you. If I may ask, are you still in China ? If so, do you consider yourself well off (compared with locals, with other foreigners) ? |
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asiannationmc
Joined: 13 Aug 2014
Posts: 1342
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| Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2016 8:27 am Post subject: |
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| I left my employer two years ago and still live in Beijing outside the 5th ring road. Live in a village with no other foreigners (although some Africans and middle eastern workers are located in the next village over) and have a small garage where I hang and work on projects... have a long term girlfriend who has a good job... yeah .. life is ok ...to be honest, I only know one teacher now (heck of a guy) .. and none of the locals I live near, have few friends who are mostly Chinese and know a few foreigners who run restaurants and other businesses. |
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upsilon
Joined: 23 Aug 2006
Posts: 14
Location: earth
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| Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2016 7:25 am Post subject: 10 Years Later - Skin Colour Still An Issue ? |
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| asiannationmc wrote: |
| I left my employer two years ago and still live in Beijing outside the 5th ring road. Live in a village with no other foreigners (although some Africans and middle eastern workers are located in the next village over) and have a small garage where I hang and work on projects... have a long term girlfriend who has a good job... yeah .. life is ok ...to be honest, I only know one teacher now (heck of a guy) .. and none of the locals I live near, have few friends who are mostly Chinese and know a few foreigners who run restaurants and other businesses. |
Very interesting. It seems a number of foreigners have established themselves in China. Thanks again for sharing. |
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LarssonCrew
Joined: 06 Jun 2009
Posts: 1308
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| Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2016 8:22 am Post subject: |
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'established themselves' is a bit of a fiddle.
I would say they are living comfortably, but they still have several things 'hanging over them'. The need to secure a visa every single year.
The fact you cannot legally work on a marriage visa.
The fact it's extremely difficult to own property as a foreigner.
The fact that courts will always find against foreigners in a simple domestic case or a huge multi billion dollar contract dispute.
The fact you can have your visa revoked at any time for any reason.
The fact if you become 'too big' at something you will find trouble [i.e. open a bar, it's too popular, cadre's brother in law wants to open bar, suddenly you are shut down for some reason].
The fact locals will never truly include you as a local, or see you as anything but a novelty.
The fact you cannot truly make the 'big money' in teaching because you are not Chinese. If I work in a public high school and student's love my class, I cannot 'ENFORCE' a mandatory 50 rmb per head after school program like almost all of the local teachers. |
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asiannationmc
Joined: 13 Aug 2014
Posts: 1342
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| Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2016 10:23 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| It seems a number of foreigners have established themselves in China. |
While some foreigners have indeed established a presence, I'm not one of them, just passing time due to having a bit of coin saved and a girlfriend of 9 years that has a Phat Paycheck.
Others like the guy who created "Plastered" has done very well. I just bought motorcycles with JingA number plates that went way up in value and that along with my salary of the last 15 years mostly saved has afforded me a somewhat comfortable life. Other Expats I have known have made some off of apartments they purchased and resold. True as L.C. sez, a marriage visa doesn't allow working, but then again, this is normal for many countries...and it is my understanding after a period of time a work permit can be applied for. Most of the expats businesses that have beren closed in Beijing was due to improper leases and housing zone regulations that are now being enforce...rule of law ya'll. On XiaYunlu they have closed all the business on the first floor of a gov own building that provides housing to postal and other gov employees. All Chinese bizness'es,
As far as money, I did ok, and will continue to live off the fruits that the PRC provided for a while....my girl has a housing savings acct.... much of it provided by her employer and likely she will buy a place here while I am looking for an alternative in the U.S....got a lot of work to sort that American Dream out... buy a house, bike, get a drivers license, so forth ...
I spend most of my free time with 6 guys who are Chinese, one just married today, and no I did not go... remember .. avoid the culture, however, I will go to the party tomorrow night. Party Culture is like Kustom Kulture, it bridges the gap insure by the thinking that polarizes and divides.
When i first was thinking to come to China, I had answered an ad in the Seattle Times and the guy who interviewed me told me something I never forgot....some people will adapt to China and do well.. and the rest... will just find fault.
As far as the courts an the police.... as years have floated by the police have become more strict as to foreigners, now drug test are common if your picked up for anything else such as not having your passport on your person. My personal experience has been pretty good as I had more than one trip to the cop shop....nothing bad to report a few market dust ups but even if the police offered to arrest the other guy, I would never sign a complaint.. once as I was moving from'a place, the landlady decided she wanted to shake me down .. the police came and after some conversations, phone and in person, instructed her to pay me 300 rmb. I gave it to my house keeper for her trouble that day as the ole' Chinese woman was pretty hard on her but she stuck by me and I still have her working for me today ..... another time a bike thiefs family paid me for a reduced sentence for the thieves and later the police called and gave the bike back to me .. I had to go to a prison where the bike was being stored.... felt like Dustin Hoffman in Dog Day Afternoon, Attica....Attica....anyway .. some can some cant... don't let it discourage anyone. Now Im not gonna tell you all encounters with the police will be pleasant..I mean after all they be the police. But in 16 years here I have paid cheaper insurance and have had no tickets.. that is also due to knowing where the traffic cameras are located ...
I have been working contract to contract, for the last two years... money going into a overseas acct. .. just waiting for a vacation.... |
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