Job Discussion Forums

[cafebleu]

Hi Glenski, I would like to keep to the topic and tell you why I think there has been an increase in people stating that they want to teach English but they don`t have a degree, how can they teach English without getting one, etc.

I have seen these kinds of posts at gaijinpot. com. Without trying to sound like Bill Clinton, I will say my opinion: `It`s the economy`. Western countries` corporations are downsizing, part-time jobs in the service industries are increasing but these do not give the benefits that a full time worker gets, unemployment is biting hard.

A number of people think that there must be a way to circumvent the educational requirements that are becoming increasingly important now. When I was a child, finishing high school was seen as a good qualification - how times have changed! At the same time a college/university education is going to land those who don`t have rich and or benevolent parents, in debt.

That is why, I think, we see people asking these kinds of questions. They probably lack the necessary skills to enter college/university or they lack the drive to try and enter college/university, or they worry about the financial implications of paying back loans. They hear that native English speakers can get jobs in Asia and based on misinformation or outdated reference books or outdated references on the internet, they think they can arrive in Asia and start teaching English. With no degree.

They need to speak to people such as myself who taught in university in my home country but teaches at an eikaiwa here. Maybe I am over-qualified, but competition for jobs in Japan is getting fiercer and will become more fierce when westerners start leaving Korea. Lastly, the bubble economy myths are still with us as Celeste has stated on another thread. They persist for a number of reasons. I will end by saying I enjoy your posts very much.

[noonlite]

I have noticed, on this site, a certain tension that exist between what I shall call, "those who seek to be professional in their vocation", and those who "are simply using ESL as a way to make a living in Japan or some other foreign country, more for the experience itself than for the a particular interest in the art of foreign language teaching."

I have a message for those who seek professionalism. Start viewing yourselves as professionals. Start noticing the professionalism in what you are doing and declare that. You are different from those who aren't truly interested in being good teachers so much as being in Japan and your ability at teaching reflects that. Yet if even you fail to notice and declare the differences between an experienced teacher who knows what she's doing and new comer who imagines that there's "nothing to it", how can it be that others will acknowledge you?

It seems to me that somehow, even some of the best of you don't think that there is really all that much to teaching English. Perhaps it's because you are surrounded by such generally low standards as a norm. Whatever the cause of this general low self esteem of ESL professionals I declare that teaching English for those who are sincerely are interestred in doing it well and becoming outstanding, is beyond rocket science (as an example of something that requires great intelligence to be able to do). In this context, teaching English makes rocket science seem simplistic at best. This is because teaching English involves the interactions of thinking and feeling beings from different cultures. Just understanding one human being and how to create a working bridge into his or her world that connects to some aspect of your own is an art that would leave the most sophisticated intelligence perplexed. Now imagine a room full of them, all creating a unique matrix of interaction among and between themselves that changes with every new thought, feeling, and action. Now imagine a master orchestrator capturing that web and directing it's natural flow into a new world as it's guide. Even the most sophisticated computer on the planet could not begin to conceive of the true complexity of such an interaction. You go with what feels right. After that initial moment of creation where you felt what to do, did it, and it worked, you can think all about and come up with as many reasons as you chose. When you're in there doing it, however, there is no time for the mind to rationally process all of the enourmous amount of data that's coming in. There is time only to act, so one needs, not only skills and techniques, but also what I call an "awareness of the moment."

The point is this. No vocation exists in this world that does not offer the possibility of great self expression and personal achievement and growth. ESL is included among them. Even the person who takes your order at Burger King can find a way to make taking an order with him a truly gratifying and enjoyable experience with the right attitude and a willingness to be aware and to learn.

Part of our problem as professionals is that we are not declaring our professionalism. Those who seek professionalsm must declare themselves to be professional and demonstrate what that means. I know you all must be out there, but I don't hear you voice. What we do is more important than I suspect many who read this will ever truly know in this lifetime. We create a bridge between worlds my friends. Either that or a barrier. I declare that what this world needs now more than anything is more bridges.

Let's elevate ourselves. Let's talk about the things that make us all better teachers. Let's start a "what worked in my classroom" page or something. But above all, let's notice and declare to ourselves and to others what it is that makes sincere professionals professional. Nobody will notice you if you never notice yourself.

What about the pause. the wait time knowing how long to wait before providing just the right hint that let's the student discover that he already knows the answer and doesn't have to ask his friend? Let's talk about that.

Let's talk about how to deal with the overly talkative student or the overly silent.

Let's talk about the rythm and timing of a lesson.

Let's talk about reading body language and sensing emotions.

Let's talk about methods that have worked and haven't worked for us and why we think they did or didn't work.

Let's raise our own standards and then watch, as if by magic, the way that others will raise their opinions of us and what it is that we do.

[TokyoLiz]

Noonlite wrote

[Glenski]

noonlite wrote: "Let's talk about the things that make us all better teachers. Let's start a "what worked in my classroom" page or something. But above all, let's notice and declare to ourselves and to others what it is that makes sincere professionals professional. Nobody will notice you if you never notice yourself.

What about the pause. the wait time knowing how long to wait before providing just the right hint that let's the student discover that he already knows the answer and doesn't have to ask his friend? Let's talk about that.

Let's talk about how to deal with the overly talkative student or the overly silent.

Let's talk about the rythm and timing of a lesson.

Let's talk about reading body language and sensing emotions.

Let's talk about methods that have worked and haven't worked for us and why we think they did or didn't work."


Um, pardon me for stating something I think is obvious, but ... why don't you put these thoughts on the various other forum categories on this site? Isn't that why they are there? Adult Education. Games and Activities. Linguistics. etc.

[edgelj]

This will be news to many people. You can work in Korea teaching English without a degree but you must at least be in college. Go to this site.

Korean Ministry of Justice.
http://moj.go.kr/mojeng/index.php

Good Luck
Lonnie

[TokyoLiz]

Roger wrote

[lisabee]

Hello. I have just recently completed the TESOL program I enjoyed it very much. Although I don't believe that this is enough backgroung to teach I am trying to absorb and learn as much as possible to prepare myself. I also am planning on continuing my degree I started 15 years ago .I would like any information you can give me on how to get a job in Windsor,Ontario
Any advice would be appreciated Thank You

[Celeste]

There are a few things that you can do. First, you should start by going through the yellow pages in your city, and deliver copies of your resume to every ESL school in town with a nice cover letter saying how you are interested in substitute teaching for them. (At a lot of schools in Vancouver, they hire their regular teachers out of their sub pool as positions become available). I am not sure if these schools will be able to hire you on as full time or permanent until you have your degree, because CAPLS, the Canadian Association of Private Language Schools
has training standards for the teachers of its member schools. I don't think that this applies to substitute and part time teachers, though. I have provided the link for their website below, so you can contact them and ask them. I do know that my school in Vancouver often employed university students with TEFL certificates to help out with the overflow classes in the summer time.

Good luck.

http://www.capls.com/introduction.htm
http://www.globalstudy.com/esl/ca/map/#on

[TokyoLiz]

Who put the gin in Ginza?

Glenski asked a while back why so many people think they can earn a mint in Japan.


My suspicion is that people are still hearing stories about teaching in the 80s and early 90s before the bubble economy collapsed. Some teachers at the Vancouver school where I work have told me that they were earning 400,000-600,000 yen/mo back in the day. Probably these are the stories which continue to draw hopeful teachers. I'm not sure if people were earning this kind of money solely from salary or if they were relying on tutoring and private classes to rake it in.

[cafebleu]

Well, thank God for Tokyo Liz`s last post sticking to the topic! Yes, I, too, was under the impression that this topic was talking about why so many people don`t have a degree or don`t want to get one or can`t get one, yet persist in questioning why they cannot just scoot off to a country like Japan and earn perceived bucketloads for teaching English!

It is interesting to read the debate within a debate revolving around Nina and her perceptions but please, friends, let`s keep to the topic. If you want to discuss Nina and Nina wants to discuss her experiences, please start a new topic. Simple as that.

Sometimes topics do wander off course but I think the topic went off track after pg 2. Do us a favour and start a new thread. Not that I think there was anything wrong with the discussion re Nina - it was just in the wrong place.

[TokyoLiz]

Cafebleu,

I quite agree. Nina's thread-witin-a-thread really ought to be on its own. Thanks for being explicit about this - my previous post about the topic wasn't so clear. I feel the same way.

Pleas post elsewhere, Nina, or start a new thread.

[Paul G]

Due to popular demand, the Nina related posts have been moved to "Non-native Speakers in TEFL". If I moved any post that the author thinks should remain on this thread, PM me and I will move it back. If you want a post moved, please tell me the date of your post or give me some other way to correctly identify it.

Paul

[joey]

To all of the above messages... firstly I'd like to say that ' go out and get a degree' is most unhelpful and a little patronising to say the least. Having completed various different College Diplomas which at the time were not run as degreee courses, (I also have the CELTA)... a more relevent question would be, do the various immigration authourities know all the different qualifications which the U.K has ?
Maybe you should remember that not everyone who wants to teach efl wants to be a career teacher, some are just looking for somthing a little more challenging in their lives... and to have a bunch of guys getting all proective over their profession is a little off putting; chill out!

[Glenski]

[Glenski]