Job Discussion Forums

[ls650]

[spidey]

[schminken]

Jonny, I am really sorry about your experience in Germany. It may be because I don't live in a university town but I haven't had much of the condescending behavior in Austria. Yes sure, I do get it every once in a while. If I speak German and they speak English back to me, I just switch into the most academic, 10 syllable word vocabulary I know. It doesn't even have to make much sense. Usually they are too uptight to admit they don't understand and revert back to German.

I usually have the opposite problem. They hear me speak German and launch into 100% backwoods dialect and I have to tell them to slow down a little bit!

For the most part, most everyone where I live loves the fact I can speak fluent German. On the other hand, I've lived here for a while and I think it's because "I'm one of them" now and they just accept it. I lived in Switzerland for a while and did have a problem with people speaking English to me even when I spoke German. It was either a.)They couldn't speak Hochdeutsch and English was a better option for them or b.)Even though they understand Hochdeutsch perfectly, they don't like it because it's not their "real" language (the Catalan/Spanish thing). So I solved the problem by learning Swiss German and then mixing it together with my standard German. Throwing in a few Swiss German words and grammar patterns made them happy and they adjusted their language to a happy Swiss German/Stardard German mix.

So what I am saying is this: Don't be discouraged. Keep talking! If you love the language, don't let these negative experiences get you down. Think about all the great conversations you've had auf Deutsch. I teach German in the US sometimes and I love sharing what I know with others. You just have to remember as proud as you are at speaking fluent German, they are just as proud that they can speak English whether it be fluent or not.

[Henry_Cowell]

[JonnytheMann]

Thanks for the kind words, Schminken. We could use more people on ESL cafe like you. I did have many excellent experiences in Germany, and I'd love to return. I think I would have a lot more enjoyable experiences if I were far away from a university. Fortunately, my semester abroad was the third time I had been in Germany for an extended period. The other two times were amazing experiences. So, it probably has a lot more to do with being among intellectually-jousting university students than among ordinary Germans.

Being in Bavaria, I can totally relate to people rattling off in the most incomprehensible Bavarian. It took me several months to understand Bavarian.

It's funny you do the 10-syllable academic English! Sometimes I did that ... and being from Tennessee, sometimes I would put of my best deep South country dialect mixed in with some Ebonics. That often helped to get things back to German. Ha ha.

[Chasgul]

If you really want to give as good as you get then switch to a third 'neutral' language, that is no-one's mother-tongue. If you are fluent in it and they don't speak a word then you can guess who looks like the better linguist.

Otherwise start asking them questions as to the nuance of what they have said and give them between three and five different ways of saying the same thing with slight shifts in nuance - if they can keep up with you on this one then they probably DO speak better English than your attempt at the local Sprache. This variant is also good because the conversation stops being a conversation and becomes an informal EFL session, eventually they wll realise that if they want to talk about things other than the intricacies of EFL then they had best leave well alone. The icing on the cake is when you throw in plenty of jargon which they then feel obliged to go and check and/or learn to maintain their superiority.

[moonraven]

Why not just not have conversations with ill-mannered people?

There is no law that says you have to sit down and have a humiliating gabfest with anybody who comes along.

Life is way too short for this silly stuff.

[dmb]

Well said ms raven. I was beginning to think I was alone.

[moonraven]

That makes two of us....

[JonnytheMann]

Sometimes the person doing this to you is your teacher, waiter, landlord, biology lab partner, taxi cab driver, etc. You can't just avoid these people.

[moonraven]

It sure stops fast here in Latin America when they find out I have written 5 books in Spanish, and that I am a Spanish prof.

[glace]

Hey everyone, OP here. Just want to thank you for all the good advice. It�s just good to know that many of you have had the same feelings, I had thought it might have been just me!

This past week I tried to think about some of your advice when I spoke VN with the locals. It helped. Just switching my mindset a bit � trying not to be too competitive, not taking it personally if they said something in English, giving back some english to the people who wanted it, trying to stand in their sandals, letting people know how kinky and interesting I think their language is, etc�in other words just being a bit more light-hearted about the whole thing.

I got a lot more practice and, more importantly, had more fun. I suppose that people can sense that.

[spidey]

Good on you, glace.

Here's to an open mind...cheers

[younggeorge]

That's the spirit, glace! I didn't contribute to this discussion before because it looked as if people were getting too uptight about it all, but you've come out of it well. Keep that balance and you'll do well, both with the language and with the people.

[Henry_Cowell]

Great job, glace! I've often found that a simple change in my attitude and viewpoint can dramatically decrease tension and emotions. Couldn't survive in the world without that...