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Volodiya
Joined: 03 May 2004
Posts: 1025
Location: Somewhere, out there
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 Posted: Wed Jul 06, 2005 3:05 am Post subject: |
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Roger, for reasons I don't understand, you don't seem too concerned that your employer will not be providing you an FEC (red book).
There has been no change in Chinese Law or Administrative Procedure, that I'm aware of, eliminating the requirement that a foreign teacher have the FEC, to work, long-term, as a foreign teacher, in China. |
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Alex_P
Joined: 23 Apr 2005
Posts: 174
Location: Hangzhou. Zheijiang, China
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| Posted: Wed Jul 06, 2005 4:38 am Post subject: |
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| Volodiya wrote: |
Roger, for reasons I don't understand, you don't seem too concerned that your employer will not be providing you an FEC (red book).
There has been no change in Chinese Law or Administrative Procedure, that I'm aware of, eliminating the requirement that a foreign teacher have the FEC, to work, long-term, as a foreign teacher, in China. |
Volodya,
This is my understanding of the requirements for the Foreign Expert Certificate. It is required if the teacher is to be employed in a government school, a para-government school, a private school chartered to provide higher and further education in China under the Education Act of 1949 as revised in 1996, and a company school that also provides higher and further education.
It is also my understanding from discussions with the PSB that it is not required if you are going to be working in a language training center, in a corporation giving foreign language lessons, etc., etc. Again, this is just my understanding from my conversations but this may also not be the case nationwide.
I am sure that you are aware that the law governing the requirements for Foreign Experts Certificates has been on the books about ten years. For a good part of this time, since ESL training was still at that point a recent happening in the PRC, application of the law was often not uniform. However, it is my understanding that early last year instructions went out from Beijing to all the local prefectures of the PSB and the local Education Committees requiring strict compliance. That seems now to be the case.
Roger, any thoughts here? |
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oiboy
Joined: 05 Mar 2004
Posts: 142
Location: Middle China
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| Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2005 4:03 am Post subject: |
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| Usually you need an exit stamp on a FEC (red book) to obtain furthur employment. The FEC must be stamped by the school that issued it. The PSB where you needs the exit stamp. It tells them that you have left the school in good standing. It also acts as a clearance letter. My previous employer wrote a clearance letter. The PSB in Shanghai would not accept it and asked the school to stamp my FEC. |
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Roger
Joined: 19 Jan 2003
Posts: 9138
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| Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2005 5:35 am Post subject: |
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I am as clueless as any - having received my passport with the new resident's permit sticker and no further documents. Although I asked my FAO previously about the FEC the impression he gave me was that I wouldn't need it any more. However, the new term hasn't begun yet; an FEC might be forthcoming in the next semester when we want to convert our salaries into foreign currency.
I have total faith in my FAO and believe he will undertake all necessary steps to secure us the right to get our funds in a currency of our choice. And, no, Alex, my status hasn't changed nor has my employer - an university; I therefore am still a "foreign expert", entitled to the privilege of changing RMB into euros or U.S> dollars. This cannot at this moment of hol;idays been done since I am drawing no salary until the end of August. |
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cj750
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
Posts: 3081
Location: Beijing
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| Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2005 7:45 am Post subject: |
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| It would be unlikely that the sticker in your passort would double as a residence permit and a work permit..are you sure this school is legal to hire foreigners.... |
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oiboy
Joined: 05 Mar 2004
Posts: 142
Location: Middle China
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| Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2005 8:33 am Post subject: |
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| cj750 wrote: |
| It would be unlikely that the sticker in your passort would double as a residence permit and a work permit..are you sure this school is legal to hire foreigners.... |
It actually does. The government has done away with the green book.
You only need the sticker. You do not need a Z-Visa. I work for a government uni and that is all we have. Well we also the red book. |
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Alex_P
Joined: 23 Apr 2005
Posts: 174
Location: Hangzhou. Zheijiang, China
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 3:40 am Post subject: |
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CJ750, sorry but you are wrong.
A new set of rules went into effect on January 1, 2005. They have been discussed at length on this board.
A new in-folio Z visa/residence permit/work permit/multiple-entry permit is now affixed into the passport. The Foriegn Expert's Certificate is actually technically the work authorization. One cannot work without it legally in a PUBLIC or PARAPUBLIC institution. The rules for the Foreign Expert Certificate have been on the books for 10 years but as of late Beijing has been insisting that they be applied to the letter.
A majority of the provinces have now already began issue in-folio combined purposes visa. Check with the newer teachers in your school. They probably have one already. |
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Volodiya
Joined: 03 May 2004
Posts: 1025
Location: Somewhere, out there
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 5:20 am Post subject: |
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Alex_P wrote:
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| A new in-folio Z visa/residence permit/work permit/multiple-entry permit is now affixed into the passport. |
I'm concerned that even experienced posters like Alex_P fail to consistently use the actual names of the documents they refer to- risking additional confusion in the readers' minds on these complex subjects. To say, "Residence Permit for Foreigners", eliminates a possible source of confusion for the readers who have less familiarity with the discussion.
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The "Residence Permit for Foreigners", (RPF, for short), is not a "Z visa". (It is not, in fact, a "visa", of any kind.) To contrast the two, the Z visa is issued at a Chinese Consulate or Embassy, abroad. It gives the holder permission to enter the country to work. The RPF is a document that is issued, in China, giving its holder permission to remain in China to work.
Among the other privileges it confers, the RPF gives its holder the right to exit and re-enter the country, within its period of validity, without a visa of any kind.
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Regarding the Foreign Expert Certificate, (FEC), the handling of this document when changing jobs is clearly in a state of flux, as is the requirement for a letter of release. The posts here are helping to shed some futher light on this subject.
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On the topic of whether a foreign teacher must have an FEC, along with the RPF, in order to perform a long-term contract to teach (six months, and more), there are interesting things we can observe about the Chinese Law.
You cannot get a Z visa, abroad, unless your employer has obtained a "Foreign Experts Affairs Invitation Confirmation" for you to use with your application for a Z visa. The organization which issues the Foreign Experts Affairs Invitation Confirmation when you are still abroad is the same organization that will issue the FEC, upon your arrival at your post to work. At both stages the same issues are presented- does your school have permission to hire foreign experts and, do you satisfy the minimum requirements for education and experience, as they're applied in your case. If the answer to both questions was "yes" regarding issuance of the Foreign Experts Affairs Invitation Confirmation; and, upon the strength of that document, "yes" regarding issuance of the Z visa; then, it will be "yes" regarding the issuance of the FEC, and one can be obtained (with the qualification that, in some cases, a medical exam, performed locally, will be asked of you as part of the overall process of providing you with the two documents, the FEC and the RPF). [I don't think we can draw any conclusions about Roger's situation: since he will start working this fall, as I understand it, his university may not feel it necessary to go through the motions, at this time, to get the FEC sorted out.]
The laws I am usually focused on regard foreign teachers, working in China. The sequence of events and documents issued, as set out above, are clearly contemplated by Chinese Law, for those who come to teach on contracts of six months, and more. |
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