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dmb
Joined: 12 Feb 2003
Posts: 8397
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 Posted: Sat Sep 30, 2006 6:12 am Post subject: |
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| dmb has always been in the running for favorite looney |
recognition at last. |
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Mark100
Joined: 05 Feb 2003
Posts: 441
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| Posted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 4:52 am Post subject: |
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| I left because i make more money in the west and save more than i did in Saudi so my decision was purely a monetary one as was my decision to go to Saudi in the first place. |
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Iamherebecause
Joined: 07 Mar 2006
Posts: 427
Location: . . . such quantities of sand . . .
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| Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 6:50 am Post subject: |
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Good to hear that people do get out - I'm sure I'm not the only one who feels stuck though. With a system where you have to give 6 months notice if yu want to leave - so can't be sure there's a good job in hand when you resign; an exchange rate which means that the gratuity you are going to get is not much of a cushion; children to educate; and a home country (UK) where most EFL jobs are all seriously underpaid, and the better University posts often go to people who have been working there part time for years - well, the move is hard.
All these things having been said, is the UAE the only ME country where people leave with a massive fanfare, say 'never again, I'm off home/to Europe', and then come back a couple of years later? |
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scot47
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 15343
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| Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 5:43 pm Post subject: |
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I left in 2004 when bearded crazies chopped the heads off 25 foreigners just down the road.
Later I regretted my flight and came back. As the world plummets into WW3, I woinder if my original decision was maybe not the right one. |
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Cleopatra
Joined: 28 Jun 2003
Posts: 3657
Location: Tuamago Archipelago
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| Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 8:16 pm Post subject: |
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| All these things having been said, is the UAE the only ME country where people leave with a massive fanfare, say 'never again, I'm off home/to Europe', and then come back a couple of years later? |
Absolutely not - the same phenonomon is alive and well in the K of SA.
Then there's the folks who always swear they are leaving 'at the end of this year'. Come September, they're back again, saying "I'll do one more year, but then I'm off". They rarely are. |
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Abba
Joined: 17 Jul 2006
Posts: 97
Location: UK
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| Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 9:29 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="Cleopatra"]
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| ..Then there's the folks who always swear they are leaving 'at the end of this year'. Come September, they're back again, saying "I'll do one more year, but then I'm off". They rarely are. |
This is what I call �Middle East Syndrome� for the expatriates. And it is difficult to manage it without proper self-revision (morally and professionally).
And I noticed it happens after the third or the fourth year, and it affects people with less confidence in themselves, or who have less determinacy and no other better alternatives. And some of them they will realize that 10 years from their life has already been passed without notice!. |
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veiledsentiments
Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 17644
Location: USA
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| Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 10:25 pm Post subject: |
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The reality is that it is hard to give up the positives of these jobs... tax free income... long holidays... that paid ticket in your hand every summer... usually tolerable students.. the occasionally silly managment...
And often leaving for an unknown situation that may be worse...
VS |
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The_Prodiigy
Joined: 01 Apr 2006
Posts: 252
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| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 1:52 am Post subject: |
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Negatives of working in The Desert far outstrip any positives.
Often free housing is offered on compounds to insulate expats from a full-on Saudi experience. Such was not the case at Saudi British Centre. The swimming pool was a saving grace from dusty, littered Riyadh streets. The city is uninviting; two huge towers dominate a scruffy, sprawling mass. Dammam had more attractive features, with well-tended palm trees lining the main thoroughfares.
Saudi society is strictly controlled, little opportunity for imagination and discovery. This attitude filters down to the classroom. We found students lacking motivation despite "learning" English for years. Spelling and pronounciation are abysmal.
One of the EFL main benefits and challenges is to design lesson plans to help students use their English constructively and imaginatively; Saudi eschews such notions and is a major contributing factor to p!ss poor performance. In addition, extrinsic motivation is lacking. A certificate with wasta is enough to get a job rather than true language skills. |
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scot47
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 15343
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| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 5:07 am Post subject: |
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How much success did the Prodigy have with learning Arabic ? I wager little if any. He should judge his stuidents abilities in English in a different light. What amazes me is how much English is learned in Saudi Arabia.
Maybe his one of those EFLers who is happily monoglot ? |
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The_Prodiigy
Joined: 01 Apr 2006
Posts: 252
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| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 5:28 am Post subject: |
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English is spoken quite well in shops and restaurants - by expats from nations such as India, Pakistan, Syria, Sudan, Bangladesh to name a few. Approaching 25% of the population of The Desert is made up of foreign citizens.
Students at college had been exposed to English in classrooms for several years and levels of competence were poor but unsurprising when put in the context of cultural constraints.
Good luck with your resumed life in The Desert Mr Scot. |
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The_Prodiigy
Joined: 01 Apr 2006
Posts: 252
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| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 5:33 am Post subject: |
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| scot47 wrote: |
Later I regretted my flight and came back. As the world plummets into WW3, I woinder if my original decision was maybe not the right one. |
Oh, poor, Scott. Quick march to the embassy and sort out a multi-entry. |
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scot47
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 15343
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| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 5:58 am Post subject: |
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| The Embassy has nothing to do with multi-exit/re-entry visas. You get them from the 'Jawazat' Don't you know anything ? There was a perfectly good space here until you came along ! |
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Abba
Joined: 17 Jul 2006
Posts: 97
Location: UK
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| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 12:57 pm Post subject: |
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| scot47 wrote: |
| . What amazes me is how much English is learned in Saudi Arabia. |
Good topic for discussion! I wonder if anyone could contribute in this topic, and tell us, based on his experience, how much English is learned in SA? |
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Abba
Joined: 17 Jul 2006
Posts: 97
Location: UK
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| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 1:27 pm Post subject: |
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| The_Prodiigy wrote: |
| �.. This attitude filters down to the classroom. We found students lacking motivation despite "learning" English for years. Spelling and pronounciation are abysmal. |
Because they learn English by memorisation and not by innovation!
The same problem, or may be worse, with maths teaching. BUT, I think, the lack of motivation is not only attributed to the �strict control� and �lack of imagination� of students. It goes beyond that! I think, the main reason behind the low level of SA students, at least in Maths, is the whole SA educational system, especially in primary, intermediate, and secondary school. And the system is based on rot learning, memorisation, memorisation, and memorisation, this is what killed the imagination. We used to receive students from high schools, with A+ marks in their modules, especially maths, but when we test them for college entrance for preparatory year, believe me, they do not deserve 40% !? And the SA educationists and senior managers know about this problem. I think the whole SA educational system needs a �SEISMIC SHAKE� to wake up from its sleeping!! Also, in primary and secondary schools, especially the private sector, they inflate the students marks, and 90% of the students get �Excellent�, and this is attributed, I think, to some of the teacher Expatriates, especially from Egypt (high % of them in government and private schools) which inflate the marks , because they do not like to get in troubles with the Saudis, also there is the problem of Wasta !!!!
Same problem in Colleges/Universities ?
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| ..One of the EFL main benefits and challenges is to design lesson plans to help students use their English constructively and imaginatively .. |
I do not think plans by itself will solve the problem, because it will stay an ink on a paper! I think the Saudis educational system needs pragmatic actions, actions, and actions on the ground by changing their whole system of education!!
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| . A certificate with wasta is enough to get a job rather than true language skills. |
This is 200% true. How many Saudi students when asked why you want to study, they reply �to get the certificate and hang it in the wall�. And most of them they work in jobs which are outside their speciality.
I met a student with B.Sc in Engineering was working in Saudi-German hospital as a secretary !! And they are many more like him. |
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veiledsentiments
Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 17644
Location: USA
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| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 2:42 pm Post subject: |
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What is the title of this thread? It is 'why did you leave the Middle East?' Why is it that Prodiigy and Abba want to turn every thread into a discussion of Saudi Arabia? This is NOT the only country in the Middle East... ilhamdulillah!!
Mr one-note Prodiigy insists on warping his own particular KSA experience and personal negativity into the only ME reality... which is ridiculous at best.
Why not go back to the Saudi board... with both of these topics...
VS |
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