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therock
Joined: 31 Jul 2005
Posts: 1266
Location: China
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 Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 4:39 pm Post subject: |
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| SnoopBot wrote: |
They did a survey a few years ago in "That's Beijing" magazine to rank laowai social-status in the expat community , the rankings went something like this from highest to lowest.
1. Big CEO expat types
2. Officials of foreign governments
3. Big company staff
4. Private owners or foreigners working in joint companies
5. Crusty types that lived in China for +++ years
6. Students studying Chinese e.g BCLU students
7. Backpackers and tourist
8. English teachers, and bums (Sexpats, drunks, ect.)
Yes at the very bottom was English teachers lumped together with bums. |
Cool!!! This makes me so proud to be an English Teacher. |
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naturegirl321
Joined: 04 May 2003
Posts: 9041
Location: home sweet home
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| Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 6:22 pm Post subject: |
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| About that list. I think that most of the people doing those jobs live on the outside of life in China, they have foreign jobs, work with foreign people, live in foreign housing. They never really interact with Chinese. |
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jammish
Joined: 17 Nov 2005
Posts: 1704
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| Posted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 12:05 am Post subject: |
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| I've never seen a crusty in China. Surely most of them are in India or Thailand? |
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naturegirl321
Joined: 04 May 2003
Posts: 9041
Location: home sweet home
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| Posted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 12:26 am Post subject: |
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| jammish wrote: |
| I've never seen a crusty in China. Surely most of them are in India or Thailand? |
HOw many years does it take to make a crusty? |
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danswayne
Joined: 23 Apr 2006
Posts: 237
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| Posted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 1:19 pm Post subject: |
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| naturegirl321 wrote: |
| So now you're a salesperson? |
That is the beauty of it for now, I am lucky enough to have guangxi in both the USA and China. I have the best kind of advertising in the world going right now and that is word of mouth. I have great customers who want me to succeed and are giving me new customer tips almost every month, so what was one customer 8 months ago has turned into a possible 7 - 10 customers in less than a year. If things go as planned we will be making 6 American figures next year, and we will still be spending about $15,000 a year to live here, which includes a lot of travelling and two kids, and the best part of it now, since we are incorporated many things are now tax deductible.
I will be a salesman in about 2 years I hope though, so I can be making a comission on what I sell and also make 200% on the products I buy over here. |
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naturegirl321
Joined: 04 May 2003
Posts: 9041
Location: home sweet home
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| Posted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 1:52 pm Post subject: |
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| danswayne wrote: |
That is the beauty of it for now, I am lucky enough to have guangxi in both the USA and China. I have the best kind of advertising in the world going right now and that is word of mouth. I have great customers who want me to succeed and are giving me new customer tips almost every month, so what was one customer 8 months ago has turned into a possible 7 - 10 customers in less than a year. If things go as planned we will be making 6 American figures next year, and we will still be spending about $15,000 a year to live here, which includes a lot of travelling and two kids, and the best part of it now, since we are incorporated many things are now tax deductible.
I will be a salesman in about 2 years I hope though, so I can be making a comission on what I sell and also make 200% on the products I buy over here. |
If you're happy, that's what matter. I bet your Chinese must be pretty good. What do you sell? The good part is it seems likeyour children will be living on two continents and learn about two cultures. |
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Tiger Beer
Joined: 08 Feb 2003
Posts: 778
Location: Hong Kong
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| Posted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 3:37 pm Post subject: |
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Interesting thread.
Sounds like a real financial challenge to save $ though. |
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SnoopBot
Joined: 21 Jun 2007
Posts: 740
Location: USA
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| Posted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 7:46 pm Post subject: |
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| naturegirl321 wrote: |
| jammish wrote: |
| I've never seen a crusty in China. Surely most of them are in India or Thailand? |
HOw many years does it take to make a crusty? |
I guess per "That's Beijing" a crusty type was the kind of person who was a Rocket Scientist in the west and decided to live in People's paradise raising pigs in Dongbei province. Of course after they found out the joys of marxism.
Another definition was , someone who knew everyone in the village and could fluently rattle off in Chinese to save the most money buying a red pepper from the veggie market.
I guess Crusty meant that you actually met Mao when he was still alive while living in China.
Again, not my ranking system I would have least ranked a drunk BCLU student living off mom and dad's $$ that lives in the bars of Wudaoku lower than the NET's.
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bdawg
Joined: 25 Feb 2004
Posts: 526
Location: Nanjing
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| Posted: Mon Jul 02, 2007 2:31 pm Post subject: |
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| I found it interesting how we ranked lower than number 6? Students still working on their 4 year degree at a Chinese university. |
I agree it is sad...but the ESL 'profession' in China has sort of brought this label down on itself. Personally, because of this, I don't tell anyone (foreign or local) I'm involved in ESL...I tell them I work for a foreign company (which is true), but I leave out the ESL component. One can criticize me for this, but I just don't like all the negative baggage that is now associated with the industry. I'm big on professional respect, and honestly, despite what all of the respect locals say they have for us...I think a big part of it is a giving face situation and most of us they just view as a joke.
I imagine that Mando students get more respect than us because they are viewed as working harder...doesn't matter how much beer they drink or how obnoxious they are...they are students of Chinese culture and language. |
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SnoopBot
Joined: 21 Jun 2007
Posts: 740
Location: USA
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| Posted: Mon Jul 02, 2007 5:33 pm Post subject: |
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| bdawg wrote: |
| Quote: |
| I found it interesting how we ranked lower than number 6? Students still working on their 4 year degree at a Chinese university. |
I agree it is sad...but the ESL 'profession' in China has sort of brought this label down on itself. Personally, because of this, I don't tell anyone (foreign or local) I'm involved in ESL...I tell them I work for a foreign company (which is true), but I leave out the ESL component. |
To be honest I do the same thing as you do, at best, I avoid the topic of what exactly I do. I found myself doing this after 2 years in China. I was sick of the fellow expats snickering or more wealthy Chinese asking why I could not use my education for something better like how they did it.
It does not help when some of the Chinese have the same degree as you do, went to the same Western university, but found a better job position in the USA after they graduated and I�m making peanuts in their country.
I feel it is the result of many things, I retired at age 38 from my first career and after finishing graduate school I was over 40. This was the magical age that most expected you to have a few years of fortune 500 experience.
A career in the US Military did not mean much in terms of a real second career, the only good thing is the extra $2300 a month check. Other than this, many consider this type of career to be not useful for a real good corporate styled second career. Most retired military types just go golfing or work for some government contractor or take a min wage �fun job� I wanted the travel again.
I figure , maybe those +60 hour weeks playing office politics for +100K a year are just as bad/or worse as being laughed at as an ESL teacher in China.
However, to keep the insults low, I will tell most I am involved in a business and not connected directly to ESL. |
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naturegirl321
Joined: 04 May 2003
Posts: 9041
Location: home sweet home
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| Posted: Mon Jul 02, 2007 6:05 pm Post subject: |
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| SnoopBot wrote: |
I feel it is the result of many things, I retired at age 38 from my first career and after finishing graduate school I was over 40. This was the magical age that most expected you to have a few years of fortune 500 experience.
A career in the US Military did not mean much in terms of a real second career, the only good thing is the extra $2300 a month check. |
So you retired from the Military? That was your first career or your second? I heard that most people have six different careers throughout their lifetime. |
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SnoopBot
Joined: 21 Jun 2007
Posts: 740
Location: USA
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| Posted: Mon Jul 02, 2007 7:50 pm Post subject: |
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| naturegirl321 wrote: |
So you retired from the Military? That was your first career or your second? I heard that most people have six different careers throughout their lifetime. |
Yes in 1996, in the late 70's the USA was hit with double digit inflation, recession and a credit crunch. The US military was being rebuilt into the volunteer force for post-Vietnam missions.
At this time we had a 25% unemployment rate here, the military had a program that would pay for your university degree if you joined for 6 years of Active duty. This was one program from many at the time. 30% of my high school graduation class joined one of the branches of the military. Often best friends joined together, or we joined as a group.
Much different than now, nobody wants to join now, unless they have strong patriotism. Younger people today have many more career options or ability to attend an university or lower cost Community College. In my days if your parents were not rich, you didn't go to school.. period.
To retire is takes 20 years, so at age 38 (join at age 1 you can retire.
Most did their time and got out and went to school. At the very end I was offered a good location and position so I could stay in service and also attended a University while still in service. This what I did, with an exciting overseas position later.
During the Clinton years, to save money from the pre-Desert storm/Cold War huge military, they offered a 15 year retirement. I took this one at 18 years.
You're right I've had a few different job fields but found I often became an instructor trainer in the military usually related to high-tech or fitness.
So I figured teaching would be a good second career and Tesol would give me the joy of travel which I enjoyed in the military.
So, I attended a good university MA Ed program and finished in 2004.
I do not know if this will be "THE" second career or if I'll end up doing something else.
I do know the situation in the ESL world needs a lot of clean up. We have many problems in ESL. Not all can be blamed on the poor quality of teachers or the hords of the backpacker sexpat types.
You have TOO many dodgy sweat shop schools, fake recruiters, greedy corrupt school leaders. So it is a "hit and miss" career.
I will admit one thing, at the lowest rank I was in the military, I still earned more at the lowest rank overseas than I ever did at teaching.
This still would almost be true if I had a lucrative International School position.
However, most military type jobs are looked down upon almost as much as TESOL teachers but maybe not as bad.
Also most top companies will not consider any military service as proof of fortune 500 ability. Many are shut out regardless of experience or education. Over 40, no fortune 500 experience, forget it.
US universities are also good at keeping those with military service out of their staff ranks and doctorate programs too. Military experience DOES count while teaching in the Public School, inner-city locations as this is almost the same as having Combat experience.
I have NO desire to scream and yell at gang members in these schools, so here I am. |
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cj750s
Joined: 26 May 2007
Posts: 701
Location: Donghai Town, Beijng
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| Posted: Tue Jul 03, 2007 12:30 am Post subject: |
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I was in the service when the "volar " changes took place ..but it didnt last long...most of the GIs serving at that time..left
Funny, but a few who were in the service the same time as I was are now in china and we keep close contact...Friends made from service connections are solid friendships...
I chose teaching because it came my way and it was a job that afforded a lot of free time...and the ability to travel with a job..
but I also did my time working ofr the State of Washington ..and I have to agree....heading up a class of wana be gang-stars is trying....but teaching has been the most lucretive move I have made and with the motorcycle parts hobby...the money is kind of easy...and with living expenses what they are..saving 12 to 15 k per year is not out of site... |
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SnoopBot
Joined: 21 Jun 2007
Posts: 740
Location: USA
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| Posted: Tue Jul 03, 2007 1:42 am Post subject: |
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| cj750s wrote: |
I was in the service when the "volar " changes took place ..but it didnt last long...most of the GIs serving at that time..left
Funny, but a few who were in the service the same time as I was are now in china and we keep close contact...Friends made from service connections are solid friendships...
I chose teaching because it came my way and it was a job that afforded a lot of free time...and the ability to travel with a job..
.. |
Awesome, I'm glad others are doing this too like both of us.
Most ex-military types usually go to Korea (Korean wife) or Thailand/Japan. Some teach in the Philippines in more remote areas usually as a volunteer.
China is a newer idea, I guess those that were in Vietnam are now looking at retired positions back in Vietnam.
I wouldn't mind doing the teaching circuit in Vietnam myself.
You're right, the best thing about the military in my mind was the travel. I never was stationed Conus except for school. The rest was all spent overseas in the Pacific area.
I'm glad to meet you on this board |
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lychee
Joined: 14 May 2007
Posts: 109
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| Posted: Tue Jul 03, 2007 5:43 am Post subject: |
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I save about 8,000 a month and fret a bit if I don't. I do spend a lot of money on western food, I enjoy cooking at home and it's cheaper and better than going to western restaurants. My earnings vary, this next 2 months I will earn 16,00 for 19 hours but that could go up because we are setting up daytime classes for the kids.
I think it was TW who pointed out in a similiar thread, the bars really swallow up the money, charge up cheaply at home before you hit them was a good saving tip.
I don't count the penniesand I don't ever want to.
I freelance and so even though it is not a regular work, up till now I have had regular well paid work with more coming in.
I think the longer you stay in one place the better the work situation. You learn to know who to trust and the ones to avoid. The time wasters, sending you out on yet another unpaid demo.
I meet quite a number of FTs who are now working for companies or have started their own businesses with varying degrees of success.
They have a lot less free time and a lot more stress.
I am more than happy with my supposedly low status as an ESL teacher |
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